Coronavirus Hoax

*The old way… heal the body to cure the symptoms.
*The new way… cure the symptoms and destroy the nervous system, with toxic medicines.

It’s not so much the virus killing the many, as it is their weakened nervous systems letting them down, by being suppressed and therefore disengaged from the body through toxins in our consumerables, and so causing modern illnesses that were not around before - In procuring food additives from all over the globe, the West opened itself up to toxic warfare, which has been going on for a few decades now… slowly suffocating ourselves to death and dis-ease through a weakened NS. I bet Taiwan rarely outsource food additives, if at all.

This isn’t new news, but here we still are, discussing a very serious matter… decades later.

Now this sounds like a hoax to me. :laughing:

This doesn’t match what I can find about their response. Their CDC started monitoring travelers from China, and in particular from Wuhan, in December. They started curbing travel to and from China at least from mid February, and quarantined everyone coming into the country from mid March (and earlier for medical professionals). At the same time, they closed schools on February 2, stopped exporting masks, ramped-up mask production, and implemented rationing.

The better explanation for why there haven’t been many infections there is because they acted early and aggressively to stop the outbreak before it started, and they’ve maintained aggressive controls to prevent an outbreak. The better explanation is that stopping it at the border to an island before it’s become a pandemic is easier than eradicating it from a population once it gets in.

And they have had 6 deaths for 429 confirmed cases, a CFR of .14%, or about 5x more deadly than what you claim the “incoming data” is saying (if you could link to your data, or tell us what source you’re using, it would help). And that CFR is crazy low by international standards: US CFR is 5.75%.

That’s not the question. Rather, the question is, given that they have shown you some science, how likely is it that that science is the mainstream, consensus scientific position? And the answer seems to be that it is very likely. In fact, your point that they don’t show very much science supports that conclusion: if the MSM throws a dart at the body scientific, it’s more likely to hit a practitioner who accepts the consensus, because more practitioners are going to accept the consensus.

How has life expectancy changed in the course of those decades? In the US it’s recently fallen, but that’s only happened in the past ~5 years. Prior to that it’s been a steady upward trend. And globally the trend has been even better, with no drop off (pre-COVID, the virus that’s actually killing people).

Go talk to Felix or Karpel or whoever still wants to talk to you.

Yup, medicine use to be more about holistic healing, then it became more about managing symptoms, keeping the sick alive, and dependent, and now it’s gotten even worse, now it’s about depopulation, mass murder, it’s not medicine at all.

If they wanted depopulation and mass murder, then they would not be telling people to isolate and practice social distancing. They would be telling people to go out and mingle so that the maximum number of people get COVID and die.

In fact, their recommendations show an obsession with saving lives even at the cost of a damaged economy.

No way!

Here, when you’ve seen one hoax you’ve seen them all.

Well, so far. :wink:

How far will the MSM hoaxsters go?

nytimes.com/interactive/202 … e=Homepage

The fact that Censortube pulled the videos, is another truly alarming event.

Let’s go over it.

They lied from the start. They over-reacted. Two years of economic growth is destroyed. The economic downturn will cause massive harm. New forms of censorship and corruption are rising.

There’s some real evil lurking in the West.

I want to update this post with…
newsweek.com/dr-fauci-backe … _rudd8F5Lw

So, the same FAuci who said the Trump Administration WILL face a disease crisis - see link in this post of mine -
ilovephilosophy.com/viewtop … 5#p2765200

also funded the research of corona viruse on bats in Wuhan. He knew a major infectious disease crisis was coming. He funded a lab in the city where it supposed would start. The lab was studying corona viruses on the specific species of bats that is supposed to be the origin of the disease. The lab he invested in was considered unsafe by two state department officials back in 2018.

For some reason Carleas, but also many others don’t seem to find it odd that we are investing in labs in China that are producing dangerous and potentially weaponized diseases. He even goes so far to brush this off as China is an ally. None of the other coincidences above seem to both him and many others.

How the US government not start looking at the possibility that it was a leak from the lab, starting in December last year, since the government invested money in this lab and those officials who did this HAD to know there was a possible problemw with that lab and what it was working on?

When the 3rd Reich came to power in Germany, they didn’t start putting people in camps right away.
There were 1000s upon 1000s of red flags that lead up to that.
Some people left Germany early.
Others fought or fled after the Reich intensified its oppression.
However, some trusted right up until the end, after it was too late to turn back.
We have to accept there’s a large % of people who’ll trust authority no matter what.

However, in my estimation (of course some would argue with me, particularly those on the radical left), today we’re not in danger of radical religious or fascistic groups coming to power, on the contrary, we’re in danger of radical technocratic and Marxist groups coming to power.
The 3rd reich didn’t materialize out of the aether, there were a lot of things that lead up to it.
Marxists were trying to take over Germany like they took over Russia and much of Eastern Europe and they finally did take over half of Germany after the war.
Millions upon millions of Germans were slaughtered and raped, just as they slaughtered and raped millions of Russians.
The 3rd reich were pressured to do much of what they did.
They were fighting a bitter struggle over the destiny of Germany.

What’s happening now is the public veered a bit more to the right than usual, particularly culturally and socially when they elected Donald Trump in the US, Boris Johnson in the UK, Jair Bolsonaro in Brazil, Matteo Salvini in Italy (who they’ve managed to remove) and others in Poland, Czechia, Slovakia and Hungary.
It’s not an accident the public veered to the right, they were sick and tired of the increasingly crony capitalist, neoliberal (culturally and socially center left, economically center right) order established in the 60s, 70s and 80s.
The left started veering more to socialism and the right nationalism, but the public went more with the nationalists than the socialists and this enraged the left.
They couldn’t take it and for the last few years, they’ve been throwing everything at the right to see what would stick.
Unfortunately for them, little did.
The left knows it has no chance of winning an election in 2020 so they’ve gone full tilt batshit crazy.
If this virus exists, it looks like they created it in a lab and released it to use as a pretext to seize power and oust Donald Trump and other nationalists.

A struggle is happening over the destiny of the west and the world.
If it can’t be resolved, if they can’t collaborate or reach a compromise (and it doesn’t look like they’ll be able to, things are already ugly), things could get brutal.
The centrists, the moderates are dissolving, and the extremists, center left and radical left, center right and radical right, are coming out of the woodwork.
Of course a lot of this isn’t happening organically, powerful financiers on all sides are moving the chess pieces around the board.

Sorry gang, it’s not just the tinfoil hat wearing alt right conspiracy theorists anymore, even those right smack in the middle, who we think of as the most sane and sober among us, are accusing the Technocratic Left of fascism (or communism rather).

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/elon-musk-criticizes-coronavirus-stay-at-home-orders-calling-them-fascist/ar-BB13p1Jg?li=AAggNb9

As the pressure builds, more and more people are taking sides.
How far will the left go?
Is Elon Musk secretly a member of the Klan too (perhaps even as high as Grand Wizard)?
Is Dr. Mercola and Dr. Phil?
Is half the world?
Even many Canadians have had enough.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/hundreds-flock-to-alberta-legislature-to-protest-covid-19-restrictions/ar-BB13omXU?li=AAggNb9

@Gloominary:

People chose to self-isolate, then Governments jumped on that bandwagon and took control… like they are now also doing on the matter of to-wear-or-not-to-wear face-masks.

The US, UK, and many other countries will be implementing operation reverse-lockdown from next week onwards… is that not good enough?

Also, tbf… working from home was high on the agenda of many companies and corporations for quite some time now, and most will welcome the opportunity and option.
Weren’t closed borders not cried for, to stop illegal immigration? Now each Country and Continent has the massive opportunity to look after their own and their home affairs… where you see a negative, I see a positive.

Again, the problem here is that both sides can make reasonable arguments. But neither side is able to encompass a complete understanding of the coronavirus itself. You can talk about the freedom to congregate with others, not wear a mask, reopen your business. But if you are wrong about the virus and get infected that can easily collide with the freedom of others not to become infected by your very own interpretation of freedom.

Unless of course you are able to establish beyond all doubt that the numbers here… worldometers.info/coronavirus/

…are just part and parcel of a liberal hoax to create a New World Order run by the United Nations.

We’ll see how things go, I don’t think the technocratic left are going to stop, for they told us they wouldn’t, they said they wouldn’t fully (only partly and temporarily) release us till a vaxx is released and most, if not all of us get it.
And even if we force them to stop, there’ll be another false flag in a few months or years.
I don’t think they will stop until at the very least they’ve regained the power they lost, if ever, they may try to take it all the way to the end this time.

People are seeing this event as a dot, I’m seeing it as part of a picture.
They went after Brett Kavanaugh with the Christine Blasey Ford false flag.
Then they went after Trump and his administration with the Russiagate false flag.
Now they’re going after the right and all of us with this.
Of course I could be wrong, but nonetheless I think they’re only going to accelerate and intensify.

I think there are multiple reasons for the lockdown, and not all of them negative… perhaps it is the
LLL and Crony Capitalists that need to keep up with (the) Change(s)?

This is absolutely true. According to the US Bureau of Economic Analysis, GDP fell $191.2 billion in Q1 2020. Q2 will probably be worse, and estimates of the total cost when it’s all over are $1-2trillion.

For comparison, I did some math around the value on the other side of the scale: the dollar value of lives lost to COVID (see spreadsheet here), and my quick and dirty estimate is that the value of life lost from COVID in the US is at least $8 billion, and may be higher than $20 billion.

My method is very rough, and I can think of a few ways that it can be improved, but here is how I arrived at those numbers:
I found life expectancy data from the Social Security Administration, which shows how many years of life a person of a given age can expect. I couldn’t find national demographics for COVID deaths by age, so I used NY death demographics as a proxy. Since their numbers are in age bands, I averaged the life expectancy for all the ages in a band, and I used the male life expectancy because 1) men die more frequently from COVID, and 2) men don’t live as long. To exclude those who would have died anyway, I used the %, I used the numbers for people who either don’t have a preexisting condition or for whom it is unknown whether or not they have a preexisting condition. That gave me [average years left] * [number dead (60966 on 4/30)] = [total lost years]. I then found estimates for the value of a year of life. There was significant variation, but I did the math for both $50k and $129k: [value of a year of life] * [total lost years] = [dollar cost of loss of life]. The result is $8,517,131,122.25, assuming $50k per life-year, and $21,974,198,295.41 assuming 129k per life-year.

Issues with this approach:
As the wiki page points out, there are better ways to estimate lives in dollars, but I don’t know how to do the estimate using QALYs. On the one hand, my estimate may overestimate the true cost, because it treats life-years for all ages as equal in value, which we can be pretty sure they aren’t.

On the other hand, I exclude the majority of deaths completely, which is definitely wrong, and probably orders of magnitude larger in effect: deaths with preexisting conditions under 65 are about a quarter of all deaths, and most of those will have a non-zero number of years left. I’ve basically treated those people as already dead.

Generalizing from the NY data probably isn’t perfect.

Using only the male data isn’t perfect, and under-counts the cost by 1-5 years per person.

The cost in lost GDP is for Q1, but most deaths tool place in Q2.

The cost in lost GDP includes the cost of both the loss of life and the lockdown-generated economic collapse.

Some additional questions:

  • How many lives has lockdown saved? How many lives will it save? This estimates cost of what has happened, not what would have happened. If we think the lockdown has cut deaths in half, it’s a very different outcome from what it would be if we think it was only cut by 5%.

  • What percent of the loss of GDP is caused by formal lockdown, as opposed to voluntary social distancing? Sweden, the poster child for a less mandatory approach, still saw a 75% drop in movement. Does that mean that formal lockdowns are only responsible for the difference between that and whatever results they’re seeing? Note also that Sweden’s approach doesn’t seem to have improved its economic outcomes (their economic losses are projected to be larger than Denmark and Norway, who have more aggressive lockdowns – would like to know Gloominary’s reaction to this as well).

What do you mean by odd, and what specifically is it that you find odd? We’re in the middle of a once-a-century pandemic, so by many definitions everything about the current global situation is odd. Given that we’re in a pandemic, how likely is it that it was first identified in a city with a research laboratory dedicated to studying this kind of virus? That depends on how many such laboratories there are, how many of them are in places where diseases with pandemic potential are likely to jump from animals to people, how much likely such a disease is to be in an area where an above average part of the population is an expert in the disease that’s identified, etc.

Here is an article from 2006, about how multiple infectious disease labs were built in the area of China in which the 2003 SARS epidemic began, not too distant from Wuhan. Is that odd?

For US funding, what percent of labs that do this kind of work are US funded? We hear a lot about the Wuhan lab, but given that a lab is studying this kind of disease, how likely is it that the US is funding them? The CDC spent more than $600m in 2019 on “Emerging and Zoonotic Infectious Diseases”, of which about $750k went to the Wuhan lab ($3.7m over 5 years). Presumably some part of the remaining >$599,250,000 went to other labs, probably also located in parts of the world that have generated multiple potential pandemics in the past decade. Given that there’s a lab in a city with an outbreak, how likely is it that it’s a US-funded lab? Seems pretty likely.

As I said earlier, “I think the evidence justifies some suspicion that the origin of the pandemic is the lab.” I don’t think it justifies a strong belief about this, and I don’t think the US government connection is particularly meaningful.

I think there’s only one reason for the lockdown, it’s a technocratic and Marxist takeover, and it’s mostly negative.
We do need to get rid of the crony capitalists and either replace them with real capitalists like Maxime Bernier in Canada and Rand Paul in the US, or with social democrats, not with technocrats and Marxists, which’s what this is.