Ladies and Gentleman a disturbing definition on the metaphysical aspect of philosophy:
‘A BLIND MAN, IN A DARK ROOM LOOKING FOR A BLACK HAT, THAT ISN’T THERE !!’
Philosophy leads only to more questions the real answers to life aren’t ones we can simply deduce by simply sitting here and thinking long and hard…life is something which we don’t understand…why ??..simply cos we didn’t make it and can’t even begin to fathom it. The only answers that can be found to life are bound to be found in the scriptures of old…which ones…well I’ll leave u to decide that !!
Which answers are to be found in scriptures exactly? Ok, lets ask the scriptures a question shall we?
“What should I do if someone hits me?”
Torah: Hit them back.
New Testament: Don’t hit them back.
Qu’ran: Declare war on them.
Can you see the problem here?
Right, now lets ask philosophy the same question.
“What should I do if someone hits me?”
Well firstly, find out the circumstances behind it. If you deserved it you should probably just take it. If you didn’t and there’s a chance you’ll be hit again if you don’t defend yourself then you should hit back. If you think the situation will be calmed if you don’t retaliate then you should refrain from doing so.
No-one claims that philosophy has objective answers but it provides you with the tools with which to come to your own conclusions. This is superior to the scriptures which just gives you a conclusion and you are not allowed to stray from it, however ludicrous it is!
OBJECTION !!! Where pray tell in the Koran does it say declare war on ppl who hit u ?! EH !!! All ur serving to do there is to promote and encourage stereotypical beliefs !!
Let me ask a question then and see how best philosophy answers it :
How should we live our life ?!
I think perhaps on the more important aspects of our life scriptures provide the neccesary answers, it just requires us to look for them.
Philosophy only provides more and more questions…extending further and further into infinity !!
Ok, so maybe my remark on the Koran was slightly stereotypical, but it helped make my point.
However, on how to lead our lives you are asking the wrong question!
Do not ask “How should we live our life?” but rather ask “How should I live MY life?”
Religion gives a large amount of people one answer on how to live there lives. It doesn’t take into account the HUGE differences between people and their needs but yet still gives them the same moral code and the same duties.
Philosophy however tailors things to the individual. It may turn out that a religious path is best suited to a certain individual but a choice has been made. Religion offers no alternative.
The answer is neither in religion or philosophy because there is no answer. Either you’ve been given free will or you’ve acquired it therefore you should exercise it and by exercising free will you’re living life the way you should. The problem with looking for answers in a religious text is that you’re relying on what someone else (maybe a divine being if you think so) has written so why the hell should you do it. If you’re relying on philosophical reasoning to create a system which you should abide by at all times then give up cos no one has successfully done so and no one ever will.
Now for a bit of existentialism: The absurdity of life is always puzelled over by men. What’s truly absurd is that we do that - why search for meaning that isn’t there, why try to rationalise the irrational, why try to ‘proove’ the existence of God using a system of logic or some ridiculous semantic trick? Instead let’s live according to personal choice - neither philosophy nor religion can give us that, it is the gift that is life.
[This message has been edited by alex (edited 10 December 2001).]
The famous philosophical paradox that we all know and love!
Existentialism says that philosophy has no answers and that we should live according to personal choice.
Yet paradoxically, existenstialism is ITSELF a philosophy which has provided us with an answer. Therefore if the philosophy is true, it is false, and if it is false it is true.
Mind boggling… (however, i do like existentialism. maybe you could write an article for us on it al
Indeed the paradox that is existentialism and yet the majority of ‘existentialist’ philosophers strongly rejected that label. It is also the reason why many ‘existentialists’ (e.g. Nietzsche, Camus, Kierkegaard) wrote in literary forms or used parables. The paradox is a problem and yet someone has got to highlight the futility of philosophical systems before we can reject them and get on with the essence of life. Existence is more important than meaning. Who doesn’t agree??
Ben I would love to write an article on existentialism, consider it my job for crimbo hols!!
[This message has been edited by alex (edited 10 December 2001).]
surely we can not experience the true existance of life without knowing the meaning… as in, if we know who and why we are put here then we know what lif eis for and consequently can live to the correct existance.
so i think that meaning is way more important that existance as then we would also end religious conflict, be content in our lives and know our purpose… the point of looking for meaning leads to a better and greater understanding of existance
Well i would have to say the muslim rep has a very good point, not because he is muslim, but because philosophy is not something which has created solutions to conflicts or problems found in this world, or this earth.
in asking questions in philosophy we are not really living lifes, we are always found asking why? for what reason? etc…
life should be more so about living it, not about questioning the reason to being here, or questioning other peoples motives, or even faiths.
if i have ever noticed anything in philosophy it has to be that you can put forward an argument, and then there is a counter, which can have a counter to the counter, and so on…which leads us to the Kalaam argument…in which we have an infinite (potential in this case)…people don’t get me wrong i’m not saying philosophy is wrong, but what i am saying is that when you have a blind man leading another blind man across a busy road, the outcome isn’t going to be a very good one is it?
Also if philosophy asks more questions than it can answer, then what is the point of taking such a large bit out of a small apple.
coming back to what ben was saying about the scriptures, i would have to say that reading what the Koran really says would be more advisable that speculating it from Mr UBL’s choice of militancy. Islam in it’s meaning is submission, and talks of tranquility and peace.
I don’t see how you can say that philosophy is a blind man leading a blind man. Philosophy is the tool by which individuals will come to their own conclusions. It is religion which is the blind man leading the blind man. Philosophy is speculation, religion is blind faith. I’m not saying whether that is right or wrong but you cannot say philosophy is just blind following because it simply isn’t.
As a wise man once said “Philosophy is the questions that may never be answered, but Religion is the answers that may never be questioned.”
Philosophy is an integral part of our lives. I can guarantee that most of us at some time in our life has asked “why are we here?”, “what’s the point?” and questions like that. It is these instinctive questions (and others) that philosophy has attempted to answer. Philosophy does not promise one answer for the masses, but it does offer individual conclusions.
How would Alex know that existentialism was for him unless he had studied philosophy? How would any form of politics, which is a practical branch of philosophy, have come about without philosophy? Philosophy is not just about getting answers it is also a learning discipline. You learn about past philosophers and what they had to say just as in history you learn about what Cromwell did etc.
Philosophy is also a valuable way of learning how to discuss and debate. As we have seen on this site, philosophy is about getting your point across coherently but without offending others or plagiarising other peoples work. Communication is definitely necessary in this world if you want to have any kind of social interaction and philosophy helps you with discussion and debate.
This website is a huge testimony to the fact that Philosophy is worthwhile and necessary. No, it doesn’t offer all the answers but then it never claimed to. Philosophy is there to attempt to answer the questions THAT CANNOT BE ANSWERED. When someone is going through a difficult patch in their life where they have to make a decision, they won’t look to science or maths for an answer, they will talk to people and talk through the problem and will come to their own conclusion from that. That is similar to philosophy.
Well Ben, i wasn’t saying or suggesting that Philosophy was a blind man helping a blind man…but what i was doing was given a simile. I would however have to differ with you on the fact that religion isn’t blind faith, it might be fair for one to say it is faith without proof (for those who don’t believe) but to say it is blind faith i disagree.
Also is speculation the right way forth, because isn’t speculation another word for theory, and well that leads us to the fact that ‘in theory’ it cannot be right/wrong, but can only be accepted if you are that way inclind.
if you question the answer, which for some, if not many people is the right way then is the any point behind reaching those answers of the questions a philosopher might have derived?
“i’m not saying philosophy is wrong, but what i am saying is that when you have a blind man leading another blind man across a busy road, the outcome isn’t going to be a very good one is it?”
And NOW you are saying that you never said that?!?! What the hell is going on? You are completely contradicting yourself! I’m afraid I’ve had enough of your attitude on this board and I am removing you until further notice. Feel free to take this up with me in private by e-mail.
I’m going to state an opinon, and now don’t go ahead and hang me by the neck. But doesn’t anybody else kind of believe that religion was created to just control the masses? What better way to insure that everyone follows rules by telling them that an invisible force in the sky is going to damn them if they do wrong. And wrong is what ever the priest say is wrong. Any points of veiws on this?
— Good Point Smooth, Marx and Nietzsche talked about that, but that is not my question…
— Was it Bertrand Russell who said that philosophy doesn’t give you any answers, it just teaches you to ask better questions? Life has no meaning, we must give the meaning to it ( or allow someone else to). So when Ben says
this is the paradox that must be worked out through each individual life whether you’re Muslim, Christian, Secular Humanist, existentialist, etc.
—Ben said:
Just give me the information i need to make my own individual choices and don’t try to convert me. To my mind proselytizing has always smelled of insecurity. If you’re a Buddhist, i WANT to hear about all of your buddhistic experiences which you are willing to share, but your experiences can never be my experiences.
— Ben said
— Who said that? That truly describes a lot!
—Was it Carl Sagan who said something like the greatest crime in history was the hijacking of morality by religion?
— A Muslim: How is “faith without proof” different from blind faith?
— The Muslim Representative said
1.) The metaphysical aspect is not the only aspect of philosophy. Great things have been discovered by people doing totally frivolous things, e.g. Decartes was in bed watching a fly on the ceiling when he came up with the idea of cartesian coordinates. A lot of scientific advances have been obtained by the search for extra terrestial life on other planets. A great deal of philosophical thought has been engendered by the so called “proofs” of God’s existence…
2.) The fact that a field of endeavor will only lead to more questions is no reason to avoid it. Science has lead to answers AND more questions and has definitely enriched our lives.
3.) I didn’t make my car, either, but i have to understand a little about it to travel to work.
4.) Hey! That’s great! I am so glad that the only answers to life can be found in one book, i can stop searching now. What can the scriptures tell me about life on other planets? or the odds that a ladies unborn child will have downs syndrome? I am so excited about this newfound knowledge!
— The blind man grasps around frantically. He trips over something. He bends down to get his hat, no wait, that is not his hat. “Could it be”, exclaims the man, “this is my God, dead at last”. The man’s sight miraculously returns, he can barely make out the last agonizing grimace still upon God’s face. “Now to find that light switch so i can finally see”…
sad is the person who asks no questions. muslim rep, do you just accept everything bestowed upon you? questions upon questions upon questions. despite knowing that many are unanswerable, i take pride in hte fact that i asked them.
oh yeah, and of course, the scriptures says so. ill write a scripture myself and may the person who finds it several millenia later find it and follow my holy word.
“And the mountains and valleys of the land split open to reveal that a lone man stood. He stood on his laptop questioning the art of questioning.”
I doubt my existence. I doubt my reflection in the mirror. I even doubt the fact that there are humans typing these responses on the internet. For all I know this is the result of some great A.I. Or maybe I am stuck in the Matrix. Who knows, not me. But you can still ask around. We are a brave lot that asks why.
— And behold, for in the book of Pocky chapter 11 verse 3, as it is written, “For thou can doubt everything, but thou can not doubt the fact that thou doubtest.” Selah!
It is known that as life progresses, it tends to develop routines in accordance to a peron’s schedule or patterns of living. The everyday ritual which serves as a discipline to ensure the survival of mankind based on Darwinian Theories. Philosophy is nonesense and often times presumptive but it is man’s sole guidance in a world where everyone lives by the phrase “Survival of the Fittest”, aside from the fact that it is the essential expression for man’s love for wisdom and pursuit of truth. Philosophy tries to attain propositions that refelcts perfections and consistency. The basic method of “Learning from the past and applying to the Present” evolutionizes civilizations way of thinking stemming back to past historical events and the present stage of the Information Age. Philosophy is a never-ending search for truth, wherein an individual relies on human emotions manipulated by reason, critical thinking and analysis.
“Woe to the man whose heart has not learned while young to hope, to love- and to put its trust in life.” - Joseph Conrad
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