Wait, is the entire NSA still under the department of defence? I’m fairly certain they’ve been involved in civilian court cases. Civilian judges aren’t big on taking evidence from the military, military and civilian police powers don’t generally overlap, by design.
I know they would have to be recognized by a civilian court, defence gets to cross examine them, prying for every detail on collection methods… they gotta stick to warrant rules if it us a court case.
I just figured by this point they were independent of the military command in US cases, like if some American was retarded enough to have our ballistic shield network, NSA would be called in by our cyber command and military secret squirrel units, they would take over using super dooper tech (or super lame yet high expensive and classified bullshit tech from the 50s) to trace it back, submit it to a federal prosecutor…
It has nothing to do with this thread, but now I’m stumped. NSA are all technically civilians save a few officers, so are the military for being in the defence department or only the military personnel are? Seems like jurisdictional cheating to me. Not sure you can have a court case thrown out by that fact alone, but I can see a judge cringing at this.
They will eventually find ‘proof’ of what they want to be true.
Just like the same guy found ‘proof’ of WMDs in IRAQ.
It’s a mistake to assume that they have any shame.
And why should they quit lying? The dummies who still believe the lying press will stick with them as long as they feel comfy.
Not legally. The whole reason why PRISM was such a big deal is that spying on U.S. citizens is outside the NSA mandate. They are strictly about foreign powers. So for them to be involved in civilian court cases, well, it’s hard picture.
It’s possible this shit changed though, a lot of it did after 9/11 with the formation of Homeland Security. I mean, the Secret Service was under the Treasury Department until 2003.
That would probably be the DIA, honestly, but either them or the NSA would operate in the same way- investigate the hell out of it, then give their findings to the FBI who would do whatever additional investigation they needed to in order to make an arrest and avoid the need for a DIA/NSA agent to testify. At least that’s how it would work in a pre Homeland Security world.
Now, I’d think Homeland Security would play a role, but I’m not sure what.
According to Wikipedia, the NSA has a mix of civilian and military employees, which only makes sense. And yeah, I would think the whole point of the NSA was to do a bit of jurisdictional cheating, that’s why nobody heard of them for so long; remember, each branch of the military has its own intelligence department anyway, so if not for inter-jurisdictional shenanigans, what’s the NSA even for?
The CIA may be at the forefront, but it sounds like there is broad agreement between agencies. Washington Post broke the story, here is what I found.
The CIA definitely haven’t been the only agency looking into this, that’s for sure. We have the October 7th release, I’ll quote again:
Anyway, why the CIA is coming out now is unclear. It sounds like they sat on it until they had more answers. It would have been easy to make this statement just before the election if they were really trying to prevent Trump from getting to office. Like the timing of the FBI investigation. Obviously that didn’t happen.
Ah yes, the record. The standard of consistency that used to mean something before Trump. Yeah, no one gives two shits about that.
Department of homeland security has the Coast Guard and a infantry corps for nuclear power plants, and a police force with AR-15s that operate alongside the department if fish and game, interior, etc on raids, so that means a judge could and would accept cases from them. Coast Guard always had this quasimilitary role too, given it’s role in territorial waters, absirbig the customs fleet in the 19th century, etc.
Yeah, um… Technically the NSA could (and almost certainly has) access to everything, it knows my phone habits, what we submit on jokers forum, backs up literally the whole internet I presume, even encrypted stuff it can’t read. But umm… for a judge to accept a case from the in civilian court, they can’t be military, meaning they aren’t military.
I got my doubts in regards to the DIA’s ability to hack most stuff. The military computer units bitch about not being able to promote officers beyond major, get trapped in a middle rank while everyone else advances. Signifies the culture likely carries over to the DIA, and they often run over to the NSA for help.
You may be right. I’m just thinking that when it comes to U.S. missile defense, the DIA would be the first to know about the breach and what to do about it would fall under their jurisdiction. It’s entirely possible they’d rely on the NSA for the high-tech aspects of any investigation.
No, that’s a secret squirrel signal unit that regular signal units are allowed access to. They would be the first to know, but given the recruit from normal signal units, and knowing some of those goobers who walk around winter in malfitting clothes with snot frozen to their faces, I got my doubts. Likewise, Motorjax from INFJ forums used to be in navy commo, hacking airwaves. He mostly just learned it himself, I wouldn’t trust him to fix a malware problem on a tablet, he just started fucking around with his gear, discovering more or less it could do stuff.
As a rule, every time someone tried training me on something supposedly really advance and top secret, it was absurdly retarded and ancient technology, with a battery the size of a double dong dildo, and the civilians teaching how to operate it (all ex special forces or navy seals, hired as salesmen) they didn’t know what all the little shit did. My unit didn’t even send it’s officers, they sent dinky ass me, I be in a room full of other officers, and I bring a lowly specialist had the right to admit to not knowing what something does, or what it was for (nobody knew).
There is a intelligence void in the front line military, if you can’t get a guy like Q from James Bond to make it simple obvious for any grunt to use, I don’t think the DIA is gonna master the tech in it’s main intelligence collecting efforts. Military likes satellites and UAVs because your average Joe can’t break it, and everyone gets to stand around a table looking like they are masterminds. Who do you think gets selected to go into the field collecting data? That’s what Cedar/History boy did in Bosnia, I’m not bringing my computer problems to him.
I think the DIA tap lines. Like the Soviet lines in East Germanywe dug under. Shit a Joe can handle.
That stuff concerns Russia hacking DNC computers and releasing the information, not Russia tampering with the election itself. Considering Obama has done the same type of stuff to our allies, I’m not sure what the take away is supposed to be here. I don’t know if it’s happened before, but as far as public knowledge goes, Obama set this bar of acceptability for foreign powers meddling in their ally’s elections. So now here we are; we can bitch all we want, but the DNC isn’t claiming the emails were forged, and if we complain too much, the world community will just point to Obama’s direct meddling with the Israeli elections.
No it isn’t. They are coming out now because the President or somebody in his immediate Cabinet told them to. That’s the only reason the CIA ever does anything- they serve the President directly, unlike other intelligence angencies.
“They” didn’t think Trump had a realistic chance of winning, so “They” didn’t have a reason to compromise the integrity of the CIA by doing this. And of course, “Russia is helping Trump” was all over the media leading up to the election, it just didn’t have the CIA stamp publicly on it.
The FBI doesn’t investigate things at the President’s or anybody else’s request. You can blame Comey for that if you want to, but no higher.
I have no idea what this is even supposed to mean. When Obama thought Hillary’s victory was certain, he publicly stated that the idea of the U.S. elections being tampered with was preposterous. Now that he didn’t get the result he wanted, he is publicly ordering the CIA to investigate the thing he said was preposterous. What does you not liking Trump have to do with it?
There is no evidence of foreign hacks and intrusions into ‘our systems’. Some computer in a DNC operatives house is not ‘our systems’. It’s some dumbass who didn’t secure his emails. That’s you trying to make it sound like more than it is.
The election wasn’t hijacked by Russia, the DNC and media’s attempt to rig the election was revealed. Look, if you can’t be bothered to reply to anything else I said, all I can do is repeat myself: What we actually have evidence (according to the CIA) that Russia did, does not amount to rigging an election, and when push comes to shove it fits a precendent Obama set with how we treat our allies, so we have no recourse. Anything more than that, such as screwing with election counts, would indeed be quite serious, but these are claims that Obama publicly declared to be ridiculous until he found out his side didn’t win, and * only now* he’s publicly ordering the CIA to look into these claims he said were ridiculous.
I don’t know how I can make it more plain- the whole thing falls apart once you realize the CIA doesn’t do anything unless Obama tells them to.
“This” being Russia as the original source of the Wikileaks. Not any sort of election machine or electoral process tampering, which is what Obama is pushing the CIA to look into, which is what he already said was ridiculous. Russia being the source of the Wikileaks is fucking nothing. It’s nothing because the content of the leaks are not being denied, it’s nothing because it’s no worse than what Obama does to influence the elections of our closest allies, and it’s nothing because at the end of the day it still amounts to people voting in response to true information.
What’s an ‘election-related system’? What’s the significance of scanning and probing? This is nothing. As your citation goes on to say:
“The USIC and the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) assess that it would be extremely difficult for someone, including a nation-state actor, to alter actual ballot counts or election results by cyber attack or intrusion. This assessment is based on the decentralized nature of our election system in this country and the number of protections state and local election officials have in place. States ensure that voting machines are not connected to the Internet, and there are numerous checks and balances as well as extensive oversight at multiple levels built into our election process.”
Look, if Russia or anybody were actually tampering with the election process, that would be significant, but there’s no evidence that they are, and Obama- who gets intelligence briefings on all of this- declared the idea baseless until the election didn’t go the way he wanted.
Great, I’ve gotten your point of view. I happen to think there may be more to it and that we should be investigating all probing and penetration. I’m not interested in speculation.
Orbie dont be so incredibly naive man. Comeys strategy played out entirely in favor of Clinton, with his last minute “nothing wrong” bullshit. Trump could have actually lost because of that. It was a deeply uncouth manipulation.
about the OP.
Clinton camp is psychotic.
they are criminally unfit for power in several ways.
1
GETTING FUCKED BY THE RUSSIANS
this alone proves she is entirely disqualified. I dont know why shes fucking ADVERTISING HER DANGEROUS INCOMPETENCE.
2
WHAT CAME OUT OF GETTING FUCKED BY THE RUSSIANS
Because she is so phenomenally incompetent, it is for all of us to see that she is a GENOCIDAL CRIMINAL.
She now tries to combine these reasons, both of which by themselves are plenty to disqualify her and perhaps even execute her, to form an argument for her. Which leads to point 3.
3
HOW SHE HANDLES BEING EXPOSED
She thinks that her own errors and crimes which ended the lives of hundreds of thousands, speak to her favor when added up.
Obviously there are basically endless reasons on top of this, but these three reasons alone prove that she is the worst and most incompetent, stupidest and most absurdly self-blind and greedy person to ever run for any kind of office, third, second and first world combined.
I’m probably the only one here who knows this, but Rush Limbaugh called that on Day 1. He specifically said that when Comey did the “We’re looking into Clinton again!” thing, it was going to be followed in a few days by a “LOL NEVERMIND, SHE’S CLEARED AGAIN!” announcment to put the final nail in Trump’s coffin, and that’s exactly what happened. People forget that before the election, the DNC was praising Comey for just this reason.
Whatever Comey’s actual motivations are, it only seems like a pro-Trump maneuver in hindsight because Trump actually won. He certainly wasn’t being interpreted as in the Trump camp leading up to election day.
I was searingly pissed when he came out with the ‘oh she is a criminal, but it would be weird to prosecute her for it’ and I could see a few Trump supporters were almost giving up hope.
Now, with the ‘Russian hack’ argument, Clinton is giving off a message that can be quite literally translated into the following logic:
Despite all the billions I received, I wasn’t even able to secure my own office from foreign attacks. These attacks did me injustice because they revealed my endless violations of the law.
Thus, because I didn’t secure my house, and you all got to see what a monstrous mess I make of things, you should tear up the Constitution, and put me in power.
That is quite literally her argument.
Ive never seen a stupider type of animal than Clinton supporters. An intestinal worm looks human next to them.
Remember: Russia hacking DNC campaign emails is a super big deal that threatens American independance and national security, but Hillary Clinton operating the State Department through an equally insecure email server is not a big thing at all.
A congressman has cone out to request a official inquiry.
However, neither Obama nor the CIA has jurisdiction over the states election machines, at least until after a candidate is selected in a week. It is a fucking no go, and the Trump administration would quickly point out what we pointed out here, that the CIA shouldn’t of been in a position to spy on state voting machines, if they were doing that at all for their evidence. I might be able to swallow the idea that they hacked Russia, and found the evidence there, but that hack wouldn’t if penetrated much of PA’s voting machines.
It becomes a painful paradox for the Democrats to explain how the CIA was investigating this with severe ethical consequences. If they were, Obama has been caught red handed.
Now, anybody from the CIA, NSA, fuck… NASA, could of just hone up to a member if Congress saying he had top secret whistle blowing info. Didn’t go down that way at all. Instead, it was Obama’s CIA doing this, now they want access to voting machines? Not a fucking chance. They are proven at the very least highly unethical for complying with the presidents orders. It needed to come from Congress from the outset. CIA doesn’t get to decide elections for their current boss.