Antitheism

[AutSider]

Science has always been about power.

Increasing the power of a few at a great majority’s expense.

These utopian notions of science and technology is just silly.

Hey, knowledge is power, right?

Those aren’t utopian, just realistic. Anarchy is your utopia, is it not? How is it any less silly?

I’d go as far as to argue that any sort of long term anarchy is impossible because people are naturally inclined to some sort of society, order, hierarchy, government, whatever you want to call it.

Anarchy can only occur during a short state of transition from one political system to another.

[LaughingMan]

@Ierrellus

@LaughingMan

@Ierrellus

Dan, Dan, Dan,
Why poke a stick into a hornet’s nest? Have you nothing better to do?

Because Dan unlike you is not afraid to challenge his own beliefs.

I see no challenge, just anti-religious vomit.

Go pray to God for comfort.

[LaughingMan]

@statiktech

@LaughingMan

Science has always been about power.

Increasing the power of a few at a great majority’s expense.

These utopian notions of science and technology is just silly.

What the hell are you even talking about? Do you know? Have you ever known?

The application of science is very political and has everything to with power.

Go ponder that.

[LaughingMan]

@Atheris

Science has always been about power.

Increasing the power of a few at a great majority’s expense.

These utopian notions of science and technology is just silly.

Hey, knowledge is power, right?

Those aren’t utopian, just realistic. Anarchy is your utopia, is it not? How is it any less silly?

I’d go as far as to argue that any sort of long term anarchy is impossible because people are naturally inclined to some sort of society, order, hierarchy, government, whatever you want to call it.

Anarchy can only occur during a short state of transition from one political system to another.

At one point we had 10,000 years of anarchy during the neolithic era.

There are two kinds of people in this world.

Those that benefit from and support government.

Then there are those that don’t benefit from government who support its removal such as myself.

[Wizard]

Faith, therefore theism, is a necessary force in life.

Do you believe, have faith, that you will live beyond today, tomorrow, next week? You do have faith in this belief. You don’t know it for certain. You may die next week, tomorrow, or today. You don’t know.

Faith is the necessary response to doubt. Faith represents hope. Doubt represents fear. Everybody fears death, and so uses hope (faith) as the catharsis against death.

Everybody who believe they’re going to live tomorrow, is a theist, as a necessary logical conclusion to this equation.

You have faith in something. You believe, you act as if, you will live beyond tomorrow. Therefore you are a theist, and religious, to a small degree at least.

[Wizard]

If you truly believed you had one week to live, then would you go to work? Probably not. Would you save money? Probably not. People only work, and only save money, because they believe, have faith, that their lives will be longer than they maybe.

[Ben_JS]

@Wizard

Faith, therefore theism, is a necessary force in life.

Faith - Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.

Theism - Belief in the existence of a god or gods, especially belief in a personal God as creator and ruler of the world.

Faith does not imply theism.

This is a mistake on your part.

=

LaughingMan,

Science is a tool.

Criticize the assholes wielding the tool, not the tool itself - unless the tool has no valuable applications.

[James_S_Saint]

Faith is the willingness to stick to the plan.

[Ben_JS]

Many definitions of faith.

Many don’t imply faith.

The faith relating to the scenarios given by Wizard don’t require belief in god[s].

I want to note this.

[James_S_Saint]

No one does anything without a degree of faith, not even insects … or GIA.

[Chakra_Superstar]

@Ierrellus

Dan, Dan, Dan,
Why poke a stick into a hornet’s nest? Have you nothing better to do?

That’s what I thought and they/we are swarming around looking for a nice bit of naked flesh or open wound…

[LaughingMan]

@Ben JS

@Wizard

Faith, therefore theism, is a necessary force in life.

Faith - Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.

Theism - Belief in the existence of a god or gods, especially belief in a personal God as creator and ruler of the world.

Faith does not imply theism.

This is a mistake on your part.

=

LaughingMan,

Science is a tool.

Criticize the assholes wielding the tool, not the tool itself - unless the tool has no valuable applications.

The tool of science has always been about wielding, consolidating, and expanding power.

Science and human greed go hand in hand.

[LaughingMan]

@James S Saint

No one does anything without a degree of faith, not even insects … or GIA.

Faith or primordial instinct?

[Uccisore]

We used to have a good variety of religious thinkers from various perspectives, even theists, that posted in here regularly. Now this thread is basically a microcosm for this section of the forums!

[Dan1 (Dan~)]

Is it a good thing that the majority of humans are religious?
Is it good that they would want to serve an ultimate, loving, just figure from ancient history?
Or should we only serve our self?

[phyllo]

Is it a good thing that the majority of humans are religious?

The non-religious will say no and the religious will say yes.

Probably a similar split along the lines of atheist and theist.

Is it good that they would want to serve an ultimate, loving, just figure from ancient history?
Or should we only serve our self?

What does it mean to serve God or serve self?

[Dan1 (Dan~)]

@phyllo

What does it mean to serve God or serve self?

It has to do with priorities.

[Ben_JS]

@Dan~

Is it good that [the religious] would want to serve an ultimate, loving, just figure from ancient history?
Or should we only serve our self?

To serve ‘God’ is self serving, because it is the self that values ‘God’.

It is the self that actively chooses to pursue the interests of ‘God’, due to one’s own interests.

Psychological egoism is the view that humans are always motivated by self-interest, even in what seem to be acts of altruism. It claims that, when people choose to help others, they do so ultimately because of the personal benefits that they themselves expect to obtain, directly or indirectly, from doing so. This is a descriptive rather than normative view, since it only makes claims about how things are, not how they ought to be.

Enlightened self-interest is a philosophy in ethics which states that persons who act to further the interests of others (or the interests of the group or groups to which they belong), ultimately serve their own self-interest.

Also, serving oneself doesn’t exclude serving others.

One can serve oneself and others, without the need for ‘God’, or serving ‘God’. One does not need a religion in order to a valuable member of society.

[James_S_Saint]

@Ben JS

@Dan~

Is it good that [the religious] would want to serve an ultimate, loving, just figure from ancient history?
Or should we only serve our self?

To serve ‘God’ is self serving, because it is the self that values ‘God’.

It is the self that actively chooses to pursue the interests of ‘God’, due to one’s own interests.

Psychological egoism is the view that humans are always motivated by self-interest, even in what seem to be acts of altruism. It claims that, when people choose to help others, they do so ultimately because of the personal benefits that they themselves expect to obtain, directly or indirectly, from doing so. This is a descriptive rather than normative view, since it only makes claims about how things are, not how they ought to be.

Enlightened self-interest is a philosophy in ethics which states that persons who act to further the interests of others (or the interests of the group or groups to which they belong), ultimately serve their own self-interest.

Also, serving oneself doesn’t exclude serving others.

One can serve oneself and others, without the need for ‘God’, or serving ‘God’. One does not need a religion in order to a valuable member of society.

All good points, but what does it mean “to serve God”?
Is God someone/thing that needs servicing? I don’t think so.

@Dan~

It has to do with priorities.

Yes, but what does it mean?

[AutSider]

At one point we had 10,000 years of anarchy during the neolithic era.

Even the most primitive humans established some sort of social hierarchy and roles. We can even observe this behavior in pack animals. It’s in the nature of the more intelligent living beings, especially those of same species to form bonds and live in packs.

Anarchy just doesn’t quite cut it for the large majority of people because we enjoy the living standards of a political system, even if it isn’t perfectly just.

I love having water, electricity, food and such available to me easily because it lets me focus on the more important stuff, such as reading books and studying, and that is exactly what makes us humans evolve and gain knowledge so quickly, the fact that we don’t have to worry about basic things.