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Ecmandu wrote:Zinnat,
I am an extremely spiritual atheist.

If Vishnu or anyone else held in high esteem came to this world and taught “zero sum realities are shit”, this species would be a billion times better. These are all false gods! I know all the eastern religions (except Shintoism) came from India.

The dharma should have been, “zero sum worlds are shit, but while you’re here, reduce consent violation as much as possible”

Now wouldn’t that have started a REAL conversation in this species!!!!!!!!!

Nobody said that before me! I don’t claim to be the king or queen. I’d never in forever sit on a fucking throne. I’d never forever decide it’s a good thing to be eternally the ‘best’. I want everyone on my level, not simply to be better than. This is a hard task in this species.

I always tell people that their concept of god is what they’d be if they were god!

Never an equal, always prayer and worship. I’m trying to wake this species up and you’re not letting me!

zinnat wrote:

Ecmandu wrote:Zinnat,
I am an extremely spiritual atheist.

If Vishnu or anyone else held in high esteem came to this world and taught “zero sum realities are shit”, this species would be a billion times better. These are all false gods! I know all the eastern religions (except Shintoism) came from India.

The dharma should have been, “zero sum worlds are shit, but while you’re here, reduce consent violation as much as possible”

Now wouldn’t that have started a REAL conversation in this species!!!!!!!!!

Nobody said that before me! I don’t claim to be the king or queen. I’d never in forever sit on a fucking throne. I’d never forever decide it’s a good thing to be eternally the ‘best’. I want everyone on my level, not simply to be better than. This is a hard task in this species.

I always tell people that their concept of god is what they’d be if they were god!

Never an equal, always prayer and worship. I’m trying to wake this species up and you’re not letting me!

Ecmandu,

Before replying me, you have to read my previous post addressed to MagsJ and consider it in your reply.

As I said there, the concept of spiritual atheist is oxymoron to me. An atheist cannot be spiritual in strict sence, unless you consider morality as spirituality, which is not logical. Moraliy is spirituality but only a part of it and does not cover spirituality completely. Means, one can be moral without being spiritual which is fine to me but being spiritual demands many others things also, of course including morality.

Not violating other consents is only morality not spirituality, unless you explain me otherwise.

Let me ask you one thing.
Think of a child suffering of diabetes. As we all know that it is not right for parents to let him have cakes and pastries but he continues to demand these.

Now, what should the parents do? Either they shoud reject the demand of the child to have more sweets because of his heath condition or should allow him having more sweets in order to honour his consent?

See, understanding and decoding even the morality is not as simple as only not violating others consent. That would not be enough. Spirituality is even more complicated.

With love,
Sanjay

phyllo wrote:If something isn't working, then I will try something else.

Although at this point, there may be nothing left to try.

zinnat wrote:

Ecmandu wrote:Zinnat,
I am an extremely spiritual atheist.

If Vishnu or anyone else held in high esteem came to this world and taught “zero sum realities are shit”, this species would be a billion times better. These are all false gods! I know all the eastern religions (except Shintoism) came from India.

The dharma should have been, “zero sum worlds are shit, but while you’re here, reduce consent violation as much as possible”

Now wouldn’t that have started a REAL conversation in this species!!!!!!!!!

Nobody said that before me! I don’t claim to be the king or queen. I’d never in forever sit on a fucking throne. I’d never forever decide it’s a good thing to be eternally the ‘best’. I want everyone on my level, not simply to be better than. This is a hard task in this species.

I always tell people that their concept of god is what they’d be if they were god!

Never an equal, always prayer and worship. I’m trying to wake this species up and you’re not letting me!

Ecmandu,

Before replying me, you have to read my previous post addressed to MagsJ and consider it in your reply.

As I said there, the concept of spiritual atheist is oxymoron to me. An atheist cannot be spiritual in strict sence, unless you consider morality as spirituality, which is not logical. Moraliy is spirituality but only a part of it and does not cover spirituality completely. Means, one can be moral without being spiritual which is fine to me but being spiritual demands many others things also, of course including morality.

Not violating other consents is only morality not spirituality, unless you explain me otherwise.

Let me ask you one thing.
Think of a child suffering of diabetes. As we all know that it is not right for parents to let him have cakes and pastries but he continues to demand these.

Now, what should the parents do? Either they shoud reject the demand of the child to have more sweets because of his heath condition or should allow him having more sweets in order to honour his consent?

See, understanding and decoding even the morality is not as simple as only not violating others consent. That would not be enough. Spirituality is even more complicated.

With love,
Sanjay

phyllo wrote:Have you considered toning it down ... avoiding words like idiocy, fucking and retarded?

phyllo wrote:The way you talk makes life crappier for other people than it has to be.

Do you think that Zinnat likes the way that you describe him and his posts?

How do you think he feels when he reads your posts?

phyllo wrote:The point is that you don't have to use those words.

In fact, people may be more open to what you are saying if you don't use those words.

Last week we completed our survey of the Four Noble Truths and in so doing the last topic that we dealt with was the Noble Eightfold Path to the end of suffering. We used the analogy of mountain climbing when we talked about treading the Eightfold Path to the end of suffering. We have said that just as when one climbs a mountain the first step depends on the last, the last depends on the first because we have to have our eyes firmly fixed on the summit of the mountain and yet we also have to be careful not to stumble while taking the first few steps up to the mountain path. So here in climbing a mountain, each portion of the path depends on the other portions. In this sense, regarding the Noble Eightfold Path, all the steps of the path are interrelated, are dependent on one another. We cannot do away with any one step. Nonetheless, for practical purposes the eight steps of the path have been divided into three ways of practice, or three divisions of training. These three divisions are good conduct or morality (Shila), mental development or meditation (Samadhi) and finally wisdom or insight (Prajna). Although conceptually and structurally, the first step depends upon the last and the last depends upon the first; although they are dependent on one another, still in practical terms when one climbs a mountain one has to climb the lowest slope first. One may be attracted to the summit, but in order to get there one has to cover the lower slope first. It is for this very practical reason that we find the eight steps of the Eightfold Path grouped into these three ways of practice.

Ecmandu wrote:Iambiguous,

I always tell people...

The goal of philosophy is not to learn how to die. The goal of philosophy is to learn how to live forever.

As much as death scares people! Living forever scares them more! What’s even worse than that is that people don’t ‘invest’ in forever. They invest in like 200 years max, maybe in their great, great grandchildren!

iambiguous wrote:

Ecmandu wrote:Iambiguous,

I always tell people...

The goal of philosophy is not to learn how to die. The goal of philosophy is to learn how to live forever.

As much as death scares people! Living forever scares them more! What’s even worse than that is that people don’t ‘invest’ in forever. They invest in like 200 years max, maybe in their great, great grandchildren!

Note to others:

He's all yours. I'm ending my exchanges with him. Why? Because I am really beginning to wonder just how close he might be to toppling over into, well, whatever the nature of his "condition" might precipitate: "I’ve resurrected at least 3 times, I’ve been to hell for a long time..."; "I deal with voices and possessions on a daily basis. I meet gods on a regular basis."

Unless this is all tongue and cheek, I don't want to be the one who pushes it all too far.

Really, this happened to me once before in an old Yahoo philosophy venue. I was accused of causing someone to attempt suicide. It turned out to be just a stupid prank, but you can never really be sure of these things online.

Whatever the actual reality here, I hope things turn out well for him. But that's it for me.

Ecmandu wrote:

iambiguous wrote:

Ecmandu wrote:Iambiguous,

I always tell people...

The goal of philosophy is not to learn how to die. The goal of philosophy is to learn how to live forever.

As much as death scares people! Living forever scares them more! What’s even worse than that is that people don’t ‘invest’ in forever. They invest in like 200 years max, maybe in their great, great grandchildren!

Note to others:

He's all yours. I'm ending my exchanges with him. Why? Because I am really beginning to wonder just how close he might be to toppling over into, well, whatever the nature of his "condition" might precipitate: "I’ve resurrected at least 3 times, I’ve been to hell for a long time..."; "I deal with voices and possessions on a daily basis. I meet gods on a regular basis."

Unless this is all tongue and cheek, I don't want to be the one who pushes it all too far.

Really, this happened to me once before in an old Yahoo philosophy venue. I was accused of causing someone to attempt suicide. It turned out to be just a stupid prank, but you can never really be sure of these things online.

Whatever the actual reality here, I hope things turn out well for him. But that's it for me.

Interesting how your reply borrowed from other posts and not the one you quoted. You didn’t respond to the post you quoted ...

That people are more terrified of living forever than dying.

phyllo wrote:That doesn't satisfy the people who think that conflicts ought to go away ... that there ought to be one solution that everyone accepts as the only right one.

Ecmandu wrote:Zinnat,
I am an extremely spiritual atheist.

zinnat wrote:As I said there, the concept of spiritual atheist is oxymoron to me. An atheist cannot be spiritual in strict sense, unless you consider morality as spirituality, which is not logical. Morality is spirituality but only a part of it and does not cover spirituality completely. Means, one can be moral without being spiritual which is fine to me but being spiritual demands many others things also, of course including morality.

felix dakat wrote:

Ecmandu wrote:Zinnat,
I am an extremely spiritual atheist.

zinnat wrote:As I said there, the concept of spiritual atheist is oxymoron to me. An atheist cannot be spiritual in strict sense, unless you consider morality as spirituality, which is not logical. Morality is spirituality but only a part of it and does not cover spirituality completely. Means, one can be moral without being spiritual which is fine to me but being spiritual demands many others things also, of course including morality.

“Spirituality must be distinguished from religion—because people of every faith, and of none, have had the same sorts of spiritual experiences.”
― Sam Harris, self-declared atheist, Waking Up: A Guide to Spirituality Without Religion

“In fact, we can directly experience that consciousness is never improved or harmed by what it knows. Making this discovery, again and again, is the basis of spiritual life.”
― Sam Harris, Waking Up: A Guide to Spirituality Without Religion

https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/2 ... t-religion