Joe Biden 46th President

[Sculptor]

Gloominary:
Yea, I hope it doesn't come to violent revolution, I hope the masses wake up and support 3rd parties, independents and dissidents.
Trump was a start, he's far from my ideal candidate, but would rather see him in there than an establishment dem like Joe Biden or an establishment rep like Jeb Bush, John Kasich or Marco Rubio.
If the the masses don't wake up, then in my view, we will continue marching down the road to serfdom and slavery.
As things continue to fall apart, revolutionary groups may appear, I may join one of them if I believe in what they stand for.
We may lose, or we may succeed.
Or revolutionaries may not appear, the neofeudalists may get what they want, or something like it.
On the other hand, things may systemically collapse, in which case no one but the nihilists will get what they want, and I'll be just as fucked as the average person, I'm not a soldier or survivalist.
Where did I say I think everything will just work out for the people or me personally somehow miraculously?

K: if you don't have a plan for the revolution or the day after, then yes, you are hoping
for miracles...

Kropotkin

I've seen this sort of argument quite a lot.
There seems very little substance to it, such as basic name-calling. "Establishement Dem", does not mean anything.
What do you actually think is wrong and what do you think needs be done to fix things?

[Gloominary]

Gloominary:
Yea, I hope it doesn't come to violent revolution, I hope the masses wake up and support 3rd parties, independents and dissidents.
Trump was a start, he's far from my ideal candidate, but would rather see him in there than an establishment dem like Joe Biden or an establishment rep like Jeb Bush, John Kasich or Marco Rubio.
If the the masses don't wake up, then in my view, we will continue marching down the road to serfdom and slavery.
As things continue to fall apart, revolutionary groups may appear, I may join one of them if I believe in what they stand for.
We may lose, or we may succeed.
Or revolutionaries may not appear, the neofeudalists may get what they want, or something like it.
On the other hand, things may systemically collapse, in which case no one but the nihilists will get what they want, and I'll be just as fucked as the average person, I'm not a soldier or survivalist.
Where did I say I think everything will just work out for the people or me personally somehow miraculously?

K: if you don't have a plan for the revolution or the day after, then yes, you are hoping
for miracles...

Kropotkin

I hope for the best, but I don't expect it.
I'm hoping things can still be solved democratically, and through civil disobedience and unrest.
If they can't, as things continue to sociopolitically and economically decline, and they will in all likelihood, I hope populist revolutionaries will appear.
Again I'm not a soldier, so I'll leave the soldiering to them.
I'm a thinker and writer on subjects that interest me, like our decline and how things could be remedied sociopolitically and economically.

[Gloominary]

Gloominary:
Yea, I hope it doesn't come to violent revolution, I hope the masses wake up and support 3rd parties, independents and dissidents.
Trump was a start, he's far from my ideal candidate, but would rather see him in there than an establishment dem like Joe Biden or an establishment rep like Jeb Bush, John Kasich or Marco Rubio.
If the the masses don't wake up, then in my view, we will continue marching down the road to serfdom and slavery.
As things continue to fall apart, revolutionary groups may appear, I may join one of them if I believe in what they stand for.
We may lose, or we may succeed.
Or revolutionaries may not appear, the neofeudalists may get what they want, or something like it.
On the other hand, things may systemically collapse, in which case no one but the nihilists will get what they want, and I'll be just as fucked as the average person, I'm not a soldier or survivalist.
Where did I say I think everything will just work out for the people or me personally somehow miraculously?

K: if you don't have a plan for the revolution or the day after, then yes, you are hoping
for miracles...

Kropotkin

I've seen this sort of argument quite a lot.
There seems very little substance to it, such as basic name-calling. "Establishement Dem", does not mean anything.
What do you actually think is wrong and what do you think needs be done to fix things?

Establishment dems, like Biden and the Clintons, are typically career politicians.
They have the backing of the mainstream media and wall street.
They're what I call international fascists, by and large they're corporatists and war mongers, not true social democrats and peaceniks.
They're obsessed with divisive identity politics, altho not as obsessed as some relatively antiestablishment dems like 'the squad' (AOC and so on).
They're globalists, and Zionists, not protectionists, they fight Israel's battles for it.
Anti-establishment dems like Bernie Sanders and Tulsi Gabbard are their antithesis within the democratic party.
They're true social democrats, peaceniks, protectionists and they're not obsessed with divisive identity politics, they'd rather promote unity instead.
They're shunned by the MSM and wall street.

[Mr J]

*Looks at news today*

It would appear the short squeeze insurrection against Wallstreet was finally put down today. The feds squashed and annihilated it over the weekend, they must of had a pretty busy weekend. Nothing ever happens anymore.

I keep hoping for a fast quick accelerated collapse where instead we just get this slow painful drawn out bullshit [20yrs], I'm not happy with it. *sighs*

[Mr J]

*Looks at news today*

It would appear the short squeeze insurrection against Wallstreet was finally put down today. The feds squashed and annihilated it over the weekend, they must of had a pretty busy weekend. Nothing ever happens anymore.

I keep hoping for a fast quick accelerated collapse where instead we just get this slow painful drawn out bullshit [20yrs], I'm not happy with it. *sighs*

Also, if the Chinese were getting in on the action today, where the fuck were they? The Chinese equivalence of the C.I.A. must really suck over there, no wonder the Indians on their national border over there beat them with their bare hands, they must be really mentally inept or something.

The commie bastards had their chance to take advantage of the vulnerability or economic weakness of the United States in recent weeks, but didn't. Stupid bastards.

[Mr J]

Gloominary, there's very little difference between political parties anymore, they infiltrate, blackmail, and bribe everybody nowadays. On the rare occasion they come across a politician they can't manipulate, they'll kill them or do a public character assassination hit piece against them through the mainstream media thus removing them from office. The mainstream media has become almost a quasi religious institutional church in this country anymore and anybody that challenges their perception of things are deemed heretics. You all can keep wasting your time on voting or political parties, that's all it is, one giant waste of time.

[Mr J]

I'll say this about Wallstreet, they're absolute Sith Lords of economic, social, and political warfare, and of course they are because they have practically invented the whole game as its creators. Us political dissenters and rebels are new to the game barely able to conduct an operation to put a single dent into them. Ah well, the great game continues.

[Mr J]

I'll say this about Wallstreet, they're absolute Sith Lords of economic, social, and political warfare, and of course they are because they have practically invented the whole game as its creators. Us political dissenters and rebels are new to the game barely able to conduct an operation to put a single dent into them. Ah well, the great game continues.

Hmm, it's starting to look like everybody got played with Wallstreet Bets, well, glad I didn't invest any money even though I was half tempted there for awhile. The so called financial insurrection looks more and more by the day as a sort of astroturf ploy of hedgefund traders to bleed individual retail investors dry and give momentum to political economic regulations. [That comes next of course and Joe Biden with the democrats undoubtedly will lead that charge.]

If that is the case, it's sort of a good sign, shows how really desperate they are in a way. You wouldn't design something like that if you weren't desperate for something. And here I was hoping it was a genuine insurrection against Wallstreet by a handful of individual investors, silly me. Won't make that mistake twice.

[Kathrina]

Gloominary, there's very little difference between political parties anymore, they infiltrate, blackmail, and bribe everybody nowadays. On the rare occasion they come across a politician they can't manipulate, they'll kill them or do a public character assassination hit piece against them through the mainstream media thus removing them from office. The mainstream media has become almost a quasi religious institutional church in this country anymore and anybody that challenges their perception of things are deemed heretics. You all can keep wasting your time on voting or political parties, that's all it is, one giant waste of time.

I'll say this about Wallstreet, they're absolute Sith Lords of economic, social, and political warfare, and of course they are because they have practically invented the whole game as its creators. Us political dissenters and rebels are new to the game barely able to conduct an operation to put a single dent into them. Ah well, the great game continues.

I'm afraid, this will only stop after they have fought themselves so much, that they will either be willing to compromise or disappear altogether.

But the more important question for us is: Will we still be there then? And if so, how will we be then?

[Sculptor]

I'll say this about Wallstreet, they're absolute Sith Lords of economic, social, and political warfare, and of course they are because they have practically invented the whole game as its creators. Us political dissenters and rebels are new to the game barely able to conduct an operation to put a single dent into them. Ah well, the great game continues.

Did you realise that you are a Marxist?

[Mr Reasonable]

Lol traded that amc twice in 2 days free money some real American shit right there.

[Gloominary]

Gloominary, there's very little difference between political parties anymore, they infiltrate, blackmail, and bribe everybody nowadays. On the rare occasion they come across a politician they can't manipulate, they'll kill them or do a public character assassination hit piece against them through the mainstream media thus removing them from office. The mainstream media has become almost a quasi religious institutional church in this country anymore and anybody that challenges their perception of things are deemed heretics. You all can keep wasting your time on voting or political parties, that's all it is, one giant waste of time.

I don't think there's much difference between dems and reps, unless someone like Tulsi or Rand Paul managed to lead them, but I do think there's a difference between republicrats and 3rd parties and independents.
Unfortunately, people keep playing lesser of two evil politics, which at best, only slows our decent into evil.
It's like people have all these choices, but they keep choosing Coke or Pepsi, what a shame.

[Mr J]

The Wallstreet Bets scammed the individual retail investors that thought they were insurrecting against the big boys, they thought they had the corporations or hedgefunds trapped, but little did they know that the trap or ambush was instead set for them. Robinhood APP received multiple financial bailouts and the SEC has converged with the federal government to severely punish individual retail short traders that are now being bled dry. It was all an organized con, ploy, or trap from the very beginning that will aid the Biden administration to reign down on short and individual day traders in state economic regulations, thanks for playing the game. Rinse, and repeat.

[iambiguous]

You're the worst kind of nihilist, the kind that wants to threaten people's sense of themselves and their own identity, probably the same guy that gets off on the idea of uploading people's consciousness into computer mainframe matrixes. It's almost like your personal war or crusade is to extinguish individual consciousness itself. In some ways you remind me of a behaviour neurologist who tinkers with human consciousness viewing people as glorified automatons to be programmed.

Alas, when you post blustering bullshit like this I can only conclude that the reason you avoid taking your precious, pontificated political values to the discussion I would like to have with you is because you know [on some level] that you risk the "fulminating fanatic" certainty that you anchor psychologically to your conviction that you really do know Who You Think You Are.

Again, unless that is all just an "act" you pursue here as a cartoon character "antihero" caricature out of the comic books.

You tell me.

I don't threaten the "sense of self" or the "identity" of others. At least not in regard to their interactions with others in the either/or world. There their consciousness is exactly like mine: able to make clear distinctions between what is true objectively and what is false objectively.

No, instead, I ask them to explore their sense of who they think they are insofar as "I" is grappled with at the existential juncture of identity, value judgments, conflicting goods, and political economy.

I provide them with arguments here...

https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtop ... 1&t=176529
https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtop ... 5&t=185296
https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtop ... 1&t=194382

...and ask them to explore their own sense of self by noting how, given a particular context involving conflicting goods, their own "I" is or is not reflected in this:

If I am always of the opinion that 1] my own values are rooted in dasein and 2] that there are no objective values "I" can reach, then every time I make one particular moral/political leap, I am admitting that I might have gone in the other direction...or that I might just as well have gone in the other direction. Then "I" begins to fracture and fragment to the point there is nothing able to actually keep it all together. At least not with respect to choosing sides morally and politically.

I now become curious as to what motivates you and why you believe in what you do, but not in any of that rhetoric you spew fourth everywhere, I would like to know about your personal life that causes you to hate the human condition so completely that you wish to destroy it. Sure, I'm all for a violent global reset where maybe millions or billions will die, but at least in my reality people have their own sense of identity and consciousness still intact.

This is just gibberish to me. No one who has even the slightest understanding of my motivation here would make comments like this.

My own moral and political values -- my sense of my own consciousness about myself in the world around me -- is explored existentially/philosophically on this thread: https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtop ... 1&t=194382

Why don't you note the manner in which, in the same way, you construe your own "sense of identity and consciousness" and explain in more detail why the parts that remain intact do so.

[Mr Reasonable]

The Wallstreet Bets scammed the individual retail investors that thought they were insurrecting against the big boys, they thought they had the corporations or hedgefunds trapped, but little did they know that the trap or ambush was instead set for them. Robinhood APP received multiple financial bailouts and the SEC has converged with the federal government to severely punish individual retail short traders that are now being bled dry. It was all an organized con, ploy, or trap from the very beginning that will aid the Biden administration to reign down on short and individual day traders in state economic regulations, thanks for playing the game. Rinse, and repeat.

Only the greedy and/or dumb ones got trapped.

[Mr J]

Only the greedy and/or dumb ones got trapped.

Yes.

[Mr J]

Did you realise that you are a Marxist?

Nope, not even close. This kind of statement comes from somebody that doesn't know what they're talking about.

[Mr Reasonable]

Only the greedy and/or dumb ones got trapped.

Yes.

Like imagine if you just didn't care about any of the end of the world shit. And then you found a stock swinging like crazy every day for a week. Then you just had a few grand and threw it in there and out a few times and just made some cash and then laughed and spent it. That's not bad.
I started a vacation Friday afternoon, and went to New Orleans and now I'm in Houston. I've been eating and drinking and shit for a few days, and I have more money than when I started. Fuck whether it comes crashing down or not. If it does or if it doesn't, you're still better off with more cash. Play the game g. What do you have to lose besides a few grand?

[Sculptor]

Did you realise that you are a Marxist?

Nope, not even close. This kind of statement comes from somebody that doesn't know what they're talking about.

I love it when a moron digs himself deeper in his ignorance!!!
Bye!
And try not the breathe

[Peter Kropotkin]

Only the greedy and/or dumb ones got trapped.

Yes.

Like imagine if you just didn't care about any of the end of the world shit. And then you found a stock swinging like crazy every day for a week. Then you just had a few grand and threw it in there and out a few times and just made some cash and then laughed and spent it. That's not bad.
I started a vacation Friday afternoon, and went to New Orleans and now I'm in Houston. I've been eating and drinking and shit for a few days, and I have more money than when I started. Fuck whether it comes crashing down or not. If it does or if it doesn't, you're still better off with more cash. Play the game g. What do you have to lose besides a few grand?

K: I have made the argument that what you have to lose is quite substantial....

the modern world is based upon and functions on inconsequential baubles such
as the search for wealth, fame, titles, power for example......

one of the things we focus on is this concept of having enough money to retire on...
making wealth one of the key focus of our lives and yet, the search for wealth
is an empty and ephemeral search..... it doesn't add to what is important
which is the search for who we are and what does it mean to be human or to
be an American or what are our possibilities of being human is?

the search of humans isn't about such mundane things as wealth or titles but
an engagement what going from animal, to animal/human and then to human,
and then to the next step, whatever that might be.....

the search for riches and titles and fame, denies and prevent a far
more important search.... for who are we?... that is the question
we should be focused upon, not seeking frivolous goals like wealth or titles....

no one wants to do the hard word in some engagement with what is really
important in our lives... what really matters? who knows or who even cares?

no one this site give a shit about what it means to be human outside of IAM
and myself..... the battle of being human isn't a physical battle but
is a battle over the mental construct of what it means to be human....

what is important is our mental image of who we are, not how many
houses we own or how many cars we drive or how much money we
have for retirement.....

the search for, the seeking of wealth and money.. takes us away from
what is truly important and that is what we lose when we engage in
such frivolous pursuits of money enough to take a vacation on....

so what if you have enough money to party in Houston or New Orleans,
it is negligible compare to the knowledge we can gain by a pursuit
of what it means to be human......

think of Star Wars.... the seeking of becoming a Jedi is far more important
then the seeking of mindless baubles... this improvement of the soul has
far more worth then wealth, which can be lost or titles, one can be fired,
or fame, fame is a fleeting bitch ask "big" time TV or movie stars who have faded
from view....ask, say David Caruso for example...or perhaps Lee Majors...
and finally seeking power is also fleeting..... ask the village idiot, IQ45...
who was the most powerful man in the world and now is about to go to jail
for a wide variety of crimes.... everything we seek in the modern world is
simply something that is as fleeting as a fart in the wind.. money, fame,
titles, power....gone in seconds sometimes.... so why seek something that
are as ephemeral as the wind, as in money, power, titles, fame?

what can have values our entire lives? what can we hold on to that will
last our entire life? that which of our mental construct.... If I hold to
the values that are positive and have value in the world, then I have something
that will last me my entire life....... I cannot lose those values unless I actively
engage in losing those values.....

values such as peace, love, hope, charity, humanity, justice, responsibility,
integrity.... we can hold these values our entire life... we cannot lose them like
we might lose our money, our titles, our fame or our power......

seeking to find something, seek to find that which can be permanently
held by all human beings without ever being lost or taken away.....
values which make us human.....so what if you have a vacation that was
paid for by gambling..... that vacation is forgotten within weeks....
I have had plenty of vacations over these many years and how many can I
still remember? few... a memorable few....

but the values I seek which makes me human are values I can hold for
the rest of my life....to seek peace as a value is to seek something that
I can hold onto and use every single day of my life until the day I die.....

that is what is at stake........and that is what is important......

seeking something that has lasting and permanent value....

seeking values

Kropotkin

[Mr J]

I love it when a moron digs himself deeper in his ignorance!!!
Bye!
And try not the breathe

The words you're looking for are, to breathe. Don't let your misspelling keep your mental genius awake at night though.

Now, crawl back to your safe space you poor scared triggered thing.

[Mr J]

So here we are at this moment of national healing, unity, and reconciliation, if you're a republican you're a domestic terrorist, if you voted for Trump you're a domestic terrorist or insurrectionist, if you're a White European heterosexual man there's a good chance you're a domestic terrorist. Can't you just feel the healing, reconciliation, and unity everywhere? It's beautiful from an accelerationist point of view, I'm still amazed at the kind of political rhetoric democrats employ everyday. There's no point white nationalists need to do anything publicly through demonstration, the democrats now practically make our arguments for us.

They're virtually saying that the republican political party is equal to white supremacy or the KKK, simply amazing.

.....Healing time.....

[Mr Reasonable]

Peter I already know what it means and is to be human so we're good.

[Peter Kropotkin]

So here we are at this moment of national healing, unity, and reconciliation, if you're a republican you're a domestic terrorist, if you voted for Trump you're a domestic terrorist or insurrectionist, if you're a White European heterosexual man there's a good chance you're a domestic terrorist. Can't you just feel the healing, reconciliation, and unity everywhere? It's beautiful from an accelerationist point of view, I'm still amazed at the kind of political rhetoric democrats employ everyday. There's no point white nationalists need to do anything publicly through demonstration, the democrats now practically make our arguments for us.

They're virtually saying that the republican political party is equal to white supremacy or the KKK, simply amazing.

K: ah, now you are seeking national healing and unity after trying to overthrow the government
in a coup attempt and after 4 years of IQ45 denying and attacking values that actually
attempt to unite and heal? The right wing, THE GOP is a domestic terror group and
should be classified that way...after 4 years of denying the value of human beings by
throwing children into concentration camps, by attacking the worth of minorities and
women and the disabled.. you call that healing or a call to unity?

the GOP and apologist like yourself are attempting to rewrite history to
pretend you hold values that unite or heal when in fact, you have spent
40 years, since Ronald Raygun, trying to destroy minorities, homosexuals,
unions, and the middle and lower class......don't pretend to rewrite history
and hope that no one notices....the GOP and the right has practice warfare for
decades upon large segments of the American society... and you hope for unity
and healing now, after you have cost America its moral standing in the world?
after trying a coup attempt? of trying to erase history and pretend that
your fascism wasn't really fascism but some attempt to heal and unify
the America people?

if I was in your shoes, I too would try to rewrite history to make me
blameless for the current crisis in America but people have something
called memories and within those memories lies your attempt to bring
about the destruction of the constitution and freedom and the values
of every generation of Americans until now......

your party, THE GOP is, in fact, worse then the KKK because the KKK was
trying to eliminate black people whereas the GOP is trying to destroy
what it means to be an American.. a far larger and more dangerous task....

we are less then a month out of the GOP and the right wing attempt to
destroy America and the values which make us Americans.....
and you don't feel the slightest bit sorry for your attempt to overthrow
America and turn it into a dictatorship...... in fact, the only emotion I can
detect is anger that you didn't succeed in your task of overthrowing America's
government....

so now, in the midst of your failure to overthrow the American system of government
is the attempt to save yourself by appeals to "unity and healing".. through which
you hope includes your attempt to overthrow the American's system of government.....
oh, can you simply have unity and healing because then I might be saved
from going to prison for overthrowing the govenrment... that is the thought
process of the GOP and people like yourself...

had you succeeded, I and millions of other American's would be on our way
to concentration camps and death camps like the one faced by the Jews in
the Holocaust....

because we didn't believe in making America a dictatorship.....
and so you hope for "unity and healing" to hide your crimes.....

and I hope it doesn't work... I hope you and all your other domestic terrorists
spend your lives in jail....

Kropotkin

[Peter Kropotkin]

Peter I already know what it means and is to be human so we're good.

K: you know what I hold to be true and I believe you do to, but
I call bullshit.... what does it mean to be human?

what are the values that make us human?

I don't believe you.....

prove me wrong....

Kropotkin