2nd Amendment

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2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Sun Oct 25, 2020 12:20 am

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

It doesn't read,

"Bearing arms, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to form well regulated militias, shall not be infringed."

The whole point is that you might, if things get ugly, need to form a militia. So, to make sure you are able to do that, your right, your personal right, to bear arms, not to have a gun or to hunt, to bear arms, will not be fucked with.

A well regulated militia being important, the right to bear arms shall not be infringed. Pretty simple. If not, it would read "the right of militias to bear arms," or, "the right of the people, once constituted in militias, to bear arms."

the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Sun Oct 25, 2020 12:30 am

The obvious implication of the amendment, in the way it was written, is that you obviously could not trust a government or any official body to decide what constitutes a well regulated militia, because that would go against the whole concept. Your right to bear arms are to protect your personal freedom, not the government. So, the militias are important, but no regulations thereof are mentioned because, that is the people's problems. They are just reminding you, it is important. The implication is that the only way to make sure that people can form these militias, is for them to be well armed, every single paying one of them. They can't force you to get armed, but the law is pretty clear that your right to do it will not be infringed.

So that the people can resist anything they feel needs resisting,

They will all of them not be restricted in their keeping and bearing of Arms.

Does anybody think that, mentioning well regulated militias, they meant hunting? Or a shotgun to fend off robbers? Arms, Militia, these words suggest war, suggest weapons, not hunting utensiles or home protection.

If government officials were honest, this should include things like bazookas, grenades, tanks if you can afford them.

But obviously also, it must be everybody, the people, who must be allowed to do this, nay, who will not be impeded in doing this. Because if some people are impeded, if you start choosing, than it is not the people, and it is not the people that will be armed, but some specific group of people.
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby iambiguous » Sun Oct 25, 2020 4:04 am

Pedro I Rengel wrote:"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

It doesn't read,

"Bearing arms, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to form well regulated militias, shall not be infringed."

The whole point is that you might, if things get ugly, need to form a militia. So, to make sure you are able to do that, your right, your personal right, to bear arms, not to have a gun or to hunt, to bear arms, will not be fucked with.

A well regulated militia being important, the right to bear arms shall not be infringed. Pretty simple. If not, it would read "the right of militias to bear arms," or, "the right of the people, once constituted in militias, to bear arms."

the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.


Right, like there are not both liberal and conservative renditions of what it means for a militia or for gun owners in general to be "well regulated".

After all, the amendment could have read "A militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

But, as usual, it's the fierce extremists from both ends of the political spectrum who insist that only their own interpretation of it actually counts.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
And here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=194382

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iambiguous: a post from Pedro?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Sun Oct 25, 2020 4:15 am

There is a saying among a certain branch of republicans:

"For my friends, everything. For my enemies: the law."

With commies like iam (as proven via robolutionary) it becomes:

"For my friends, everything. For my enemies: who knows, Joe says A, Mary says B, but we say C, and we're gonna enforce C."


Well, good luck with that you dirty commie.
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby iambiguous » Sun Oct 25, 2020 4:29 am

Pedro I Rengel wrote:There is a saying among a certain branch of republicans:

"For my friends, everything. For my enemies: the law."

With commies like iam (as proven via robolutionary) it becomes:

"For my friends, everything. For my enemies: who knows, Joe says A, Mary says B, but we say C, and we're gonna enforce C."


Well, good luck with that you dirty commie.


What's that got to do with my points, Kid? 8)
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
And here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=194382

tiny nietzsche: what's something that isn't nothing, but still feels like nothing?
iambiguous: a post from Pedro?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby iambiguous » Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:52 pm

iambiguous wrote:
Pedro I Rengel wrote:There is a saying among a certain branch of republicans:

"For my friends, everything. For my enemies: the law."

With commies like iam (as proven via robolutionary) it becomes:

"For my friends, everything. For my enemies: who knows, Joe says A, Mary says B, but we say C, and we're gonna enforce C."


Well, good luck with that you dirty commie.


What's that got to do with my points, Kid? 8)


Note to phoneutria:

Let him get you back. I really am curious as to what this retort has to do with my points above. Unless, of course, you can tell me.

:lol:
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
And here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=194382

tiny nietzsche: what's something that isn't nothing, but still feels like nothing?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Mr Reasonable » Thu Nov 12, 2020 2:43 am

so youre saying that only well organized militias can bear arms? or are you doing a liberal interpretation that goes beyond the plain language of the text?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 2:55 am

I'm going with a literal interpretation.

Where does it say that only well organized militias can bear arms?

"...the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

As opposed to:

"...the right of well armed militias to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Walk us through your reading?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Mr Reasonable » Thu Nov 12, 2020 2:57 am

Ok fine. I'll change the goalpost. Should felons be allowed to have guns? Or people who are threatening to shoot up a school? Or a guy who just got out of prison for a mass shooting? Can we infringe on those people?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:10 am

No, don't.

Enlighten us with your reading, whereby the plain text says something different than what it says.
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Mr Reasonable » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:10 am

you dont think we should take guns away from people who shot up a school?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:12 am

You first my nigga.

That was quite a claim you made.
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Mr Reasonable » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:13 am

i think that when it refers to the right of "the people" that it means the ones that are well organized in a militia like the proud boys
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:14 am

That's what you call plain text? That when it says "the people" it doesn't actually mean "the people"?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:15 am

Anyway, if it means that, the link should be established in plain text. Show us where?

Something like "the people, being constituted in well regulated militias,"?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Mr Reasonable » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:16 am

the militias are people like corporations
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:16 am

Pedro 1

Mr Snyde 0
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:17 am

Mr Reasonable wrote:so youre saying that only well organized militias can bear arms? or are you doing a liberal interpretation that goes beyond the plain language of the text?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:17 am

Pedro I Rengel wrote:
Mr Reasonable wrote:so youre saying that only well organized militias can bear arms? or are you doing a liberal interpretation that goes beyond the plain language of the text?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Mr Reasonable » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:17 am

Pedro I Rengel wrote:Pedro 1

Mr Snyde 0



fair

now what about those kids shooting up schools can we take their guns?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:19 am

Well, they are underage.

Nobody considers children to be people. Don't fuck with me Reasonable.

In other countries, like mine, guns are heavily restricted, yet chillrens from the age of 10 have no problem getting them, so strike 2.

I get it that you want to make guns illegal. But do you have to be dishonest to do it?
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:21 am

I would like, out of politeness and manners, for you to acknowledge that you came in here demanding that the very second amendment of no less than the US constitution said, in plain text, something different than it does.

And, if you are brave, I would like you to admit that you did it on purpose, for political agendas.
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:22 am

If you don't like people, all adults, all of them, obviously that aren't in jail, having the right to keep and carry arms, that's something else.

And there are mechanisms, in the constitution, for repealing amendments.

But don't try to shit on our faces Rease. The law is that they can.
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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Mr Reasonable » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:26 am

Pedro I Rengel wrote:Well, they are underage.

Nobody considers children to be people. Don't fuck with me Reasonable.

In other countries, like mine, guns are heavily restricted, yet chillrens from the age of 10 have no problem getting them, so strike 2.

I get it that you want to make guns illegal. But do you have to be dishonest to do it?


i don't want to make guns illegal and come on man you have to be dishonest to get anything done in politics dont single me out
You see...a pimp's love is very different from that of a square.
Dating a stripper is like eating a noisy bag of chips in church. Everyone looks at you in disgust, but deep down they want some too.

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Re: 2nd Amendment

Postby Mr Reasonable » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:26 am

are we even going by the constitution anymore what about emoluments
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Dating a stripper is like eating a noisy bag of chips in church. Everyone looks at you in disgust, but deep down they want some too.

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