Best song ever written

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Re: Best song ever written

Postby promethean75 » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:26 pm

Holy shiznit did you just ask 'how' starship trooper is different from owner of a lonely fart? You seriously just axed that?

Then u can't know, Andy. You're unable to know or else you wouldn't have axed. Bro they are worlds apart in time, place, style and content.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby promethean75 » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:32 pm

"When you listen to Yes, do you have Zonk looking over your shoulder?"

So Zonk was hell bent on trying to play like bruford and he'd be on close to the edge for like two months straight or something. He only had a few of the oldest albums, see. I was the one who ventured forth into a complete investigation of the band. I found relayer before him and was listening to the eighties stuff while he was still on Fragile.

But he was the plug in any case. When I heard that panned track of just squire and bruford I was like what the shit dude that goes hard af.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:41 pm

To get off the topic of Yes for a moment...


Back to the OGWT's golden age, with this, which is MONUMENTAL...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8f-Qb-bwlU
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:43 pm

Magnus Anderson wrote:Popular.....


Fucking MacDOnald's is "popular".

I'd rather some real food.

Tie a Yellow Ribbon Round the Old Oak Tree is POPULAR.

But in 1973 I'd have been listening to Frankenstein by Edgar Winter
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby MagsJ » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:59 pm

DP
Last edited by MagsJ on Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ
I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Huh! - MagsJ
You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby MagsJ » Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:03 pm

Sculptor wrote:
MagsJ wrote:That is not what my argument is about, at all.
Not all of my post was directed at your argument (whatever it was), but a reaction to 3 pages of spats and my own reflections on the two links that seem to preceed your spats.

So, tell me, what exactly what your argument all about?

The actual words in Tribute say that it is the best song ever written, not I.. of which the response to that was one of animosity and not that of debate. We can decide how we choose to reply to others, and the reply I got was unnecessary.

The best song in the world? why, whatever I happen to be repeat-listening to at the time. : D
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ
I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Huh! - MagsJ
You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:08 pm

MagsJ wrote:
Sculptor wrote:
MagsJ wrote:That is not what my argument is about, at all.
Not all of my post was directed at your argument (whatever it was), but a reaction to 3 pages of spats and my own reflections on the two links that seem to preceed your spats.

So, tell me, what exactly what your argument all about?

The actual words in Tribute say that it is the best song ever written, not I.. of which the response to that was one of animosity and not that of debate. We can decide how we choose to reply to others, and the reply I got was unnecessary.

The best song in the world? why, whatever I happen to be repeat-listening to at the time. : D


If that is the case, then you have the argument.
For my part, the idea that there could ever be "the best song written" is absurd. I cannot even pick one for myself in that respect, nor should anyone be able to, since there are so many criteria from which to judge.

You might ask which has the most notes, which has the largest number of key changes, chord changes, the most dynamic in terms of volume or pitch - or you might decide that the best has all these qualities in LOW values rather than high.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Magnus Anderson » Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:36 am

Although you might not like it I'd chose this in preference anytime:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwPWGUhEtP0


That got me hooked at around 0:44. It started promising -- and only remained promosing -- until around 1:45. That change ruined the mood. Albeit, that change sounds much better when listening to a live performance.

Is it better than Owner of a Lonely Heart? Can't tell. It seems the difference between the two is so small, I can't see it without making extra effort. What I do know, however, is that I like it more than Starship Trooper. And I also like more than The Clap.

How about some songs that I think are significantly better than all four Yes songs?

How about 80's synth-pop such as Level 42 - Lessons in Love? Super simple but it does too many things right to be on the same level as any of the Yes songs mentioned so far.

Even Boney M - Rasputin is better. The first 40 seconds are majestic. That small part alone I find much more engaging than all four Yes songs combined. The rest of the song is of lesser quality, with that initial change being too abrupt; though I like the male-female exchange that takes place throughout the song. The chorus is the weakest -- the most disappointing -- part.

Obviously, you don't need to be much of an instrumentalist in order to make a good song. And I personally don't find that surprising given the two disciplines (that of composition and that of playing an instrument) are separate.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:40 am

Gordon Lightfoot has my two favorite opening lines...

“If you could read my mind love, what a tale my thoughts could tell...”

“Picking up the pieces of my sweet shattered dream”
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:33 pm

Ecmandu wrote:Gordon Lightfoot has my two favorite opening lines...

“If you could read my mind love, what a tale my thoughts could tell...”

“Picking up the pieces of my sweet shattered dream”


I'd never listened to him until now.
And I shall never again listen to him.
The sentiment is cheesy and his voice is a bit crap. so not much to recommend.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:37 pm

Magnus Anderson wrote:Even Boney M - Rasputin is better. The first 40 seconds are majestic. That small part alone I find much more engaging than all four Yes songs combined.

:o
I would hate to be you.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:02 pm

Sculptor wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:Gordon Lightfoot has my two favorite opening lines...

“If you could read my mind love, what a tale my thoughts could tell...”

“Picking up the pieces of my sweet shattered dream”


I'd never listened to him until now.
And I shall never again listen to him.
The sentiment is cheesy and his voice is a bit crap. so not much to recommend.


Dude, sculptor ... the man is a musical god.

Carefree Highway which has the last line as it’s intro is the opposite of cheesy.

He’s talking about “his old friend” ‘not giving a shit about anything’. Thus the name carefree highway. He also talks about one night stands that don’t mean anything and cause ‘the walk of shame’. When states that I feel the ‘morning after blues from my head down to my shoes’

Bob Dylan literally calls Gordon one of his mentors.

You think this is a cheesy song?

https://youtu.be/PXzauTuRG78
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:23 pm

Ecmandu wrote:
Sculptor wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:Gordon Lightfoot has my two favorite opening lines...

“If you could read my mind love, what a tale my thoughts could tell...”

“Picking up the pieces of my sweet shattered dream”


I'd never listened to him until now.
And I shall never again listen to him.
The sentiment is cheesy and his voice is a bit crap. so not much to recommend.


Dude, sculptor ... the man is a musical god.

Carefree Highway which has the last line as it’s intro is the opposite of cheesy.

He’s talking about “his old friend” ‘not giving a shit about anything’. Thus the name carefree highway. He also talks about one night stands that don’t mean anything and cause ‘the walk of shame’. When states that I feel the ‘morning after blues from my head down to my shoes’

Bob Dylan literally calls Gordon one of his mentors.

You think this is a cheesy song?

https://youtu.be/PXzauTuRG78


Incidentally, this song above has my favorite last line of songs with words.... “many are the dead men, too silent to be real”
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Jun 15, 2021 7:16 pm

Actually, I’ll throw this song into the ring...

The incomparable Don McClean at his best.

Dreidel.

Now, this song uses one Jewish reference ... the dreidel... it’s a six sided (star of David) spinning top.

Dreidel is a very ancient children’s toy...

I couldn’t find one with lyrics so you’ll have to make it out for yourself or look up the lyrics online without the music behind them.

This song blew my mind when I first heard it.

It talks about life and suicide.

https://youtu.be/BdKW0ZDTmxE
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:50 pm

Ecmandu wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:
Sculptor wrote:
I'd never listened to him until now.
And I shall never again listen to him.
The sentiment is cheesy and his voice is a bit crap. so not much to recommend.


Dude, sculptor ... the man is a musical god.

Carefree Highway which has the last line as it’s intro is the opposite of cheesy.

He’s talking about “his old friend” ‘not giving a shit about anything’. Thus the name carefree highway. He also talks about one night stands that don’t mean anything and cause ‘the walk of shame’. When states that I feel the ‘morning after blues from my head down to my shoes’

Bob Dylan literally calls Gordon one of his mentors.

You think this is a cheesy song?

https://youtu.be/PXzauTuRG78


Incidentally, this song above has my favorite last line of songs with words.... “many are the dead men, too silent to be real”


On a scale from Edam to Parmesan I'd give it a Wensledale
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:58 pm

th.jpg
th.jpg (16.76 KiB) Viewed 97 times

TARKUS
This has it all.
50th birthday yesterday!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKNOlDtZluU

starts in 5/4 time signature. Minor key; Dorian mode, Where the fuck are you going to get that in pop music today?

These guys were in their early 20s when they made this. This is the height of COOL.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:42 pm

Sculptor wrote:
th.jpg

TARKUS
This has it all.
50th birthday yesterday!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKNOlDtZluU

starts in 5/4 time signature. Minor key; Dorian mode, Where the fuck are you going to get that in pop music today?

These guys were in their early 20s when they made this. This is the height of COOL.


Really?!?! They’re just Zappa rip offs. I didn’t even like Zappa much.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby promethean75 » Wed Jun 16, 2021 1:43 am

Bruh you've heard Tarkus? You just went up a level. *knuckle bump*

Ecman shut the heck up ELP is not a zappa rip-off. Not even kinda, or a little.

It was really difficult to be a prog-rock rip-off band back in the seventies because there were very few existing formulas to be copied and everything was just generally considered progressive. For instance genesis and, say, YES will at times do similar stuff, but you'd not say one or the other was copying anything because they were all doing that kind of stuff at the same time... and nobody had yet owned it or stamped it as their sound. You had a general prog structure to your music or u didn't, and if it sounded like somebody else, that's only because their music too has a prog structure.

What happened here is your brain just recognized and compartmentalized that generally progressive rock sound in both zappa and the prog bands you've heard.

Like there are prolly a hunerd other bands that ELP sounds more like than zappa.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Ecmandu » Wed Jun 16, 2021 2:22 am

Sorry if you’re offended.

Zappa was first through the gate.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby MagsJ » Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:10 am

Sculptor wrote:
MagsJ wrote:
Sculptor wrote:Not all of my post was directed at your argument (whatever it was), but a reaction to 3 pages of spats and my own reflections on the two links that seem to preceed your spats.

So, tell me, what exactly what your argument all about?
The actual words in Tribute say that it is the best song ever written, not I.. of which the response to that was one of animosity and not that of debate. We can decide how we choose to reply to others, and the reply I got was unnecessary.

The best song in the world? why, whatever I happen to be repeat-listening to at the time. :D
If that is the case, then you have the argument.
For my part, the idea that there could ever be "the best song written" is absurd. I cannot even pick one for myself in that respect, nor should anyone be able to, since there are so many criteria from which to judge.

..including the fact that one person’s ‘best song ever’ is another person’s ‘what the hell..’, and that we all can have questionable tastes at times.

You might ask which has the most notes, which has the largest number of key changes, chord changes, the most dynamic in terms of volume or pitch - or you might decide that the best has all these qualities in LOW values rather than high.

So many elements to a song.. let alone the genres and eras to choose from.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ
I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Huh! - MagsJ
You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Wed Jun 16, 2021 12:41 pm

Ecmandu wrote:Sorry if you’re offended.

Zappa was first through the gate.

Not sure what you think the gate it to..

It is debatable is Zappa is prog in any sense. In fact I think he is something else entirely.
Pink Floyd, King Crimson, Led Zep, ELP, Cream had barely heard of him and were not really influnced by him.
Heavy rock started as early as the Kinks "You really Got Me".
Beatles Sgt Pepper and Stone His Satanic Majesty Albums set the world on the road to Prog Rock. Freak Out got out first but its a pretty confused bunch of stuff. Derivative and spoofy.

Zappa has his own genre.

It's more like Political Standup comedy set to music, and MOCK ROCK.

I'd not doubt his skill. In fact some of his stuff is so complex that only Frank could listen to it. And many people bought albums for show but could not listen to them.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Wed Jun 16, 2021 12:51 pm

Ecmandu wrote:Sorry if you’re offended.

Zappa was first through the gate.


You might know how to play keyboards but your sense of musical history is poor indeed, and your taste in music is very limited.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Ecmandu » Wed Jun 16, 2021 3:58 pm

Sculptor wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:Sorry if you’re offended.

Zappa was first through the gate.


You might know how to play keyboards but your sense of musical history is poor indeed, and your taste in music is very limited.


I don’t disagree with that. I have very particular taste buds (to use the analogy) and I’m also allergic to some foods.

That’s how it works with music.

What did you think of the McLean song?
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Magnus Anderson » Wed Jun 16, 2021 10:38 pm

Sculptor wrote:For my part, the idea that there could ever be "the best song written" is absurd. I cannot even pick one for myself in that respect, nor should anyone be able to, since there are so many criteria from which to judge.


I'm pretty sure it's doable. You just have to know how to do it. I'd kindly suggest you're conflating "I can't do it because I don't know how / have yet to learn how" with "It's not possible".

And I also think there might be a way to determine "the best song ever written".

These guys were in their early 20s when they made this. This is the height of COOL.


I think it's okay -- and fun -- but far, very far, from being "the height of cool".

They shouldn't call it "progressive". Rather pretentious term, if you ask me. The proper term would be "experimental". That's what they are doing -- they are experimenting. They are trying out new, previously untested, things and thereby discovering new interesting ways in which music can be fun. But overall, their efforts aren't really that great (since they aren't properly finalized.)

Time Out is also fun but far from being great piece of music. So is anything by Aphex Twin (such as this piece.)

I don't have narrow tastes and I wouldn't want to limit myself to these "progressive" pieces. And if I absolutely had to, I'd limit myself to a different kind of music.
Last edited by Magnus Anderson on Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Best song ever written

Postby Sculptor » Wed Jun 16, 2021 10:47 pm

Magnus Anderson wrote:
Sculptor wrote:For my part, the idea that there could ever be "the best song written" is absurd. I cannot even pick one for myself in that respect, nor should anyone be able to, since there are so many criteria from which to judge.


I'm pretty sure it's doable. You just have to know how to do it. I'd kindly suggest you're conflating "I can't do it because I don't know how / have yet to learn how" with "It's not possible".

No. It's not because I am stupid. quite the opposite. I know the difference between objective criteria and subective values.

And I also think there might be a way to determine "the best song ever written".

GO on then. But I won't hold my breath
What are your critieria for he best song ever written?

These guys were in their early 20s when they made this. This is the height of COOL.


I think it's okay -- and fun -- but far, very far, from being "the height of cool".

That's only because you are not cool, but I am.

They shouldn't call it "progressive". Rather pretentious term, if you ask me. The proper term would be "experimental". That's what they are doing -- they are experimenting. They are trying out new, previously untested, things and thereby discovering new interesting ways in which music can be fun. But overall, their efforts aren't really that great (since they aren't properly finalized.)

That's only because you are ignorant of the history of music. It is progressive because that words was used to best describe the emerging rack genre of 1970, from the Like of ELP, King Crimson, Pink Floyd and others.

I don't have narrow tastes and I wouldn't want to limit myself to these "progressive" pieces. And if I absolutely had to, I'd limit myself to a different kind of music.


But, you see, Progressive Rock is the best genre by far, and so that is exacly where you will find the best sing ever written.
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