A solution to Libet's puzzle

The origins of the imperative, "know thyself", are lost in the sands of time, but the age-old examination of human consciousness continues here.

A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby bahman » Thu May 09, 2019 9:01 pm

We can do one conscious act at any time. There are two time points in performing the Libet setup: (1) Time of decision and (2) time of conscious reading time from the clock. Therefore we either do (1) then (2) or (2) then (1). If time of (1) to (2) is bigger than (2) to (1) then Libet problem is resolved.
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby MagsJ » Thu May 09, 2019 9:52 pm

Physically yes, mentally no!
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby bahman » Thu May 09, 2019 10:02 pm

MagsJ wrote:Physically yes, mentally no!

I am tqalking about our mental ability: We can perform one conscious act at a time.
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby MagsJ » Wed May 22, 2019 2:15 am

bahman wrote:
MagsJ wrote:Physically yes, mentally no!

I am tqalking about our mental ability: We can perform one conscious act at a time.

Have you never been in a situation where your mind tells you to do many things at once, but you have to stop and choose one to physically do? a flood of thoughts, that trigger a moment of a call to many actions, then either.. none are done out of sheer exacerbation and we give up, or one is settled on out of the need of necessity of having to get something out of the way before we can move on.

Having said that.. sometimes multi-tasking is the only option we have due to time constraints, and more than one task can be undertaken, but with a necessary focus applied to achieve the feat.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby bahman » Sun Jun 02, 2019 4:32 pm

MagsJ wrote:
bahman wrote:
MagsJ wrote:Physically yes, mentally no!

I am tqalking about our mental ability: We can perform one conscious act at a time.

Have you never been in a situation where your mind tells you to do many things at once, but you have to stop and choose one to physically do? a flood of thoughts, that trigger a moment of a call to many actions, then either.. none are done out of sheer exacerbation and we give up, or one is settled on out of the need of necessity of having to get something out of the way before we can move on.

Having said that.. sometimes multi-tasking is the only option we have due to time constraints, and more than one task can be undertaken, but with a necessary focus applied to achieve the feat.

I can do only one conscious act at any given time. Subconscious mind helps me to handle a situation when I am overwhelmed with too many things.
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby MagsJ » Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:47 am

bahman wrote:I can do only one conscious act at any given time. Subconscious mind helps me to handle a situation when I am overwhelmed with too many things.

..I cannot remember where or when, but I do recall a male acquaintance attempting to multitask and failing miserably, as he simply couldn't mentally achieve his goal, then he gave props to us females for being able to.. although some men can, but not to the extent of we.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:56 pm

MagsJ wrote:
bahman wrote:I can do only one conscious act at any given time. Subconscious mind helps me to handle a situation when I am overwhelmed with too many things.

..I cannot remember where or when, but I do recall a male acquaintance attempting to multitask and failing miserably, as he simply couldn't mentally achieve his goal, then he gave props to us females for being able to.. although some men can, but not to the extent of we.
First multitasking is not dependant on being conscious of both actions at the same time. Second the sex difference on multitasking is a myth.

https://hbr.org/2018/09/research-women- ... ltitasking

And multitasking is generally a bad choice, though with employers acting the way they do these days, few of us can avoid it and the bad side effects of it.
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby Meno_ » Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:50 pm

How about when employers are not the authority , what if You are the employer and the employee? Does that make a lot of difference?
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby Meno_ » Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:28 pm

https://youtu.be/bAJqw9SF_QQ



https://books.google.com/books?id=FzEI6 ... th&f=false




How did I get here? Well that has to do with the supposition that there IS infinite and transcendental reincarnation, (can / could offer proof, but I am bound not to); .....
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby Meno_ » Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:57 pm

https://books.google.com/books?id=0E-aF ... th&f=false


Maybe it has no relation to needs as opposed to requirements
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby Meno_ » Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:53 pm

A “requirement” is defined by the International Institute of Business Analysis (IIBA) as a condition or capability required by a stakeholder to solve a problem or achieve an objective, while a “need” is a high-level representation of the requirementneeded. The need is the end result or purpose
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby MagsJ » Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:52 am

Karpel Tunnel wrote:First multitasking is not dependant on being conscious of both actions at the same time. Second the sex difference on multitasking is a myth.

https://hbr.org/2018/09/research-women- ... ltitasking

And multitasking is generally a bad choice, though with employers acting the way they do these days, few of us can avoid it and the bad side effects of it.

Playing some instruments, is dependent on a dual cognitive-coordination, of both hands.. consciously, I’d say. Same can be applied in the workplace and home etc.

I don’t know about the gender-dependency of it, but the more I came out of my torpor, the more I wanted to multi-task.. and did.

I think it’s more natural to multi-task than not.. but to varying degrees and reasons. Perhaps it’s a case of not letting the engine run idle, so as not to pollute the senses with..
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby surreptitious75 » Sun Sep 06, 2020 3:35 am

Women may or may not be better at multi tasking but they do have a significantly larger corpus callosum than men [ thirty per cent difference ]
The reason for that may be evolutionary and while it may not confer advantage today it would have been important at other times in our history
A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby MagsJ » Sun Sep 06, 2020 7:17 am

surreptitious75 wrote:Women may or may not be better at multi tasking but they do have a significantly larger corpus callosum than men [ thirty per cent difference ]
The reason for that may be evolutionary and while it may not confer advantage today it would have been important at other times in our history

“The corpus callosum.. a veritable superhighway of connectivity” ..haha, what an analogy it has.

Tests have revealed subtle differences in higher cortical function compared to individuals of the same age and education without an active corpus callosum (ACC), and an ACC still has many useful benefits today, and an inactive one can lead to dual consciousness that would separate the conscious from the subconscious.. I’m sure we can all experience that on a wavy lazy day, lol.

How are ya doin, these days, Surrep? all-good, in the Surreptitious hood, n all that?
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby surreptitious75 » Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:33 pm

Very slowly letting go of more of the mental chains that bind me as I realise how easy my life has become
Also your cat wandering through my mind these last few days for reasons that are not entirely clear to me
A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby MagsJ » Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:21 pm

surreptitious75 wrote:Very slowly letting go of more of the mental chains that bind me as I realise how easy my life has become
Also your cat wandering through my mind these last few days for reasons that are not entirely clear to me

Whatever brought about that change, is something that you must be pleased, happened?

In-keeping with the thread title.. that’s puzzling, but what’s even more puzzling is that his fur is looking mighty-shinier than usual.. I suspect that a neighbour has been brushing him.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby surreptitious75 » Mon Sep 07, 2020 1:59 pm

I have slowly been letting go for quite a while now and with each passing year I feel a little less restricted mentally and philosophically
My time here is limited and so I try to avoid getting too hung up on anything which does not really matter in the grand scheme of things
Ultimately nothing at all matters but some things matter more than others while we are here while everything else is merely distraction
And so I keep said distraction to a minimum while keeping myself busy as Nature slowly counts down the time left to me in this existence
A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby MagsJ » Mon Sep 07, 2020 2:26 pm

surreptitious75 wrote:I try to avoid getting too hung up on anything which does not really matter in the grand scheme of things

That’s definitely something we learn, and master, as we start to get older.. in unburdening ourselves from both the ‘unhelpful’ thoughts and the material, that we have acquired over time.

Ultimately nothing at all matters but some things matter more than others while we are here while everything else is merely distraction
And so I keep said distraction to a minimum while keeping myself busy as Nature slowly counts down the time left to me in this existence

That sounds a bit unhealthy, but whatever works for you..
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby promethean75 » Mon Sep 07, 2020 2:48 pm

Yes but all existential attitudes toward this nihilism that surrep75 is alluding to still permit a rational hedonism as the justification for human existence. This is the 'purpose' given to man, by himself, after having come to philosophical maturity and recognizing that he is indeed most likely mortal and living in an indifferent universe.

So this has to be the foundation of world politics; a rational, utilitarian hedonism pertaining to the physical and material existence of the species... with the premise that maximizing the quantity and quality of pleasure is the goal.

But this has to be carefully done and built out of radically new concepts of property and labor. You want to both raise the standard of living for everyone while not lowering the standard for the standard of living by standardizing the standards the collective recognizes as it standardizes these concepts. This is difficult to do. Very difficult. But possible.
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby surreptitious75 » Mon Sep 07, 2020 3:06 pm

I dont think its unhealthy to be aware of ones own mortality
I dont obsess over it but it is something that is always there

I think to avoid it is far more unhealthy since to me that is no less than a denial of reality and even moreso given that it will eventually have to be confronted
I have no trouble looking into the abyss so when death smiles at me I smile back as that is all I can do but its also to acknowledge that I know its watching me
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby MagsJ » Mon Sep 07, 2020 3:33 pm

surreptitious75 wrote:I dont think its unhealthy to be aware of ones own mortality
I dont obsess over it but it is something that is always there

Awareness is one thing, daily dwelling.. another.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby surreptitious75 » Mon Sep 07, 2020 3:43 pm

I dont actually know how often because its mostly spontaneous but its definitely not every day
I have had it for about seven years and like most things that come into my mind I just let it be
A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN
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Re: A solution to Libet's puzzle

Postby MagsJ » Mon Sep 07, 2020 4:04 pm

surreptitious75 wrote:I dont actually know how often because its mostly spontaneous but its definitely not every day
I have had it for about seven years and like most things that come into my mind I just let it be

Oh those thoughts, yeah, they happen.. perhaps when the old tired ones give way for the new, and they are forced upon us by our psyche, as a placeholder of sorts.. but some placeholder, huh?

I think it happens to most, if not all.. but I don’t have the stats for that. I found that once people find that they are not alone in that regard, that the gravity of the thoughts becomes less-severe and starts to diminish further.

@Prom: nice post.. as a natural hedonist, I approve.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I, just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a really bad DJ - MagsJ
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