My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

The origins of the imperative, "know thyself", are lost in the sands of time, but the age-old examination of human consciousness continues here.

Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby lizbethrose » Wed Jun 15, 2011 6:33 am

WWIII, I read your entire 12 1/2 pages--did you write that as part of your therapy? It seems to have been published in some sort of journal to which I have no access.

No matter, I read it and I appreciate your posting it. You have humanized MI and I hope it teaches people to the point where they'll stop using terms they think they understand to define things they really don't understand at all. I hope you've also taught that suffering an MI isn't a reason to be stigmatized in any way. It happens to both the best of us and the least of us--there is no differentiation.

Did you ever finish the journal?
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby WW_III_ANGRY » Wed Jun 15, 2011 2:57 pm

lizbethrose wrote:WWIII, I read your entire 12 1/2 pages--did you write that as part of your therapy? It seems to have been published in some sort of journal to which I have no access.

No matter, I read it and I appreciate your posting it. You have humanized MI and I hope it teaches people to the point where they'll stop using terms they think they understand to define things they really don't understand at all. I hope you've also taught that suffering an MI isn't a reason to be stigmatized in any way. It happens to both the best of us and the least of us--there is no differentiation.

Did you ever finish the journal?


Thank you. I've gotten a little further I was actually looking to publish with chipmunka publishing in London who specialize with Mental Illness writings but with work and an inability to refine it to my standards which are probably a little too high I have been slacking on it. But this wasn't really part of my therapy, I wrote this all down after everything occurred, at least a year after I was recovered so to speak, off medication and thinking clearly. But it was therapeutic also. I still run through those days in my head, meditating on it, kind of keeping it fresh in my mind and making sure I don't forget what exactly I went through as well.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Silhouette » Wed Jun 15, 2011 3:24 pm

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:off medication and thinking clearly.

I read the whole thing too, and also thought about suggesting you publish it. If anything it's an engaging read.

How have you managed to not relapse despite coming off medication? - since the time you did that in what you wrote, you relapsed.

It's interesting how a lot of it makes sense to me, in the sense that I've experienced similar things myself - only without the violence and probably not quite to the same degree as you did. Perhaps things like violence are the difference between mental illness and mental healthiness, and perhaps severity of episode.

Experimenting with a fair few types of drugs didn't seem to affect me - are you so sure that weed definitely had something to do with your condition? Probably a widely debated subject, I know, perhaps it's one of those things that reacts more with certain genes than others. But atm I'm inclined to think drugs don't cause mental illness, but rather those with a propensity toward mental illness are more likely to get into drugs.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby WW_III_ANGRY » Wed Jun 15, 2011 4:35 pm

Silhouette wrote:
WW_III_ANGRY wrote:off medication and thinking clearly.

I read the whole thing too, and also thought about suggesting you publish it. If anything it's an engaging read.

How have you managed to not relapse despite coming off medication? - since the time you did that in what you wrote, you relapsed.

It's interesting how a lot of it makes sense to me, in the sense that I've experienced similar things myself - only without the violence and probably not quite to the same degree as you did. Perhaps things like violence are the difference between mental illness and mental healthiness, and perhaps severity of episode.

Experimenting with a fair few types of drugs didn't seem to affect me - are you so sure that weed definitely had something to do with your condition? Probably a widely debated subject, I know, perhaps it's one of those things that reacts more with certain genes than others. But atm I'm inclined to think drugs don't cause mental illness, but rather those with a propensity toward mental illness are more likely to get into drugs.


I think you asked if I relapsed? Or are you telling me I relapsed? I've had minor residual effects since then, probably continuing through today. I think the voice in my head though is clearly not the voices of other people, and while it is a voice in my head of voices of other people, I understand this and recognize it as such. Its very quiet and very faint. Its almost as if I even have to strain to hear it when it does occur, to understand what it is. I understand though that it is just my projection of other people being thought out in my head as if they were actually speaking. Sometimes I'm not sure I overhear people or if it is a voice I made up, such as when I'm at the grocery store or something. Usually it happens with people I don't know. Usually its about me. So its very ignorable. Nobody will ever know I'm experiencing it. I could say it never occurred at all, and nobody else would think it did, it doesn't change me.

The intensity of these residual effects increases drastically after smoking marijuana, it is blatantly obvious that marijuana increases my symptoms. I couldn't say it caused my symptoms though. It certainly seems to be a genetic predisposition with my mother suffering from hallucinations after some stressful period in her late life and she never smoked marijuana.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby WW_III_ANGRY » Wed Jun 15, 2011 6:23 pm

Silhouette wrote:
WW_III_ANGRY wrote:off medication and thinking clearly.

Perhaps things like violence are the difference between mental illness and mental healthiness, and perhaps severity of episode.


Forgot to address this, in short no.

If someone slapped you for taking what was rightfully yours (as I thought in my mind) a violent reaction would be natural for some, that is my nature not a psychotic nature. What caused it was delusions thinking everything was free for me.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Silhouette » Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:04 pm

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:I think you asked if I relapsed? Or are you telling me I relapsed?

I asked if you relapsed since coming off meds. Because in your story you relapsed when you came off your meds. But you've answered that one fine, thanks :)

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:What caused it was delusions thinking everything was free for me.

If you think everything is free for you because you've given everyone ESP then that seems fair. But if you think people are acknowledging your gift of ESP in a different way that's not breaking the law (e.g. stealing, violence or endangering people's safety) then you still have the "delusions" but without any of the legal repercussions.

But I don't see anyone arresting me, medicating me and putting me in hospitals or jail because I have delusions. I don't hear voices, but I've silently understood communications from things that most people wouldn't pay any heed to and it's made me do strange stuff, just not break the law. But I'm just classed in with all the mentally "healthy", so that's why I suggested that division between mentally ill and mentally healthy.

Mental "illness" is a strange classification anyway when it's sometimes healthy for things like creativity and straying for the norm in general, but that's another point entirely. I'm not saying paranoia and depression is nice, but it's potentially very useful. Stop me if I'm offending you, I do get that traumatic experiences can render some people particularly sensitive about certain kinds of talk/suggestion concerning their episodes.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby WW_III_ANGRY » Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:45 pm

Silhouette wrote:
WW_III_ANGRY wrote:I think you asked if I relapsed? Or are you telling me I relapsed?

I asked if you relapsed since coming off meds. Because in your story you relapsed when you came off your meds. But you've answered that one fine, thanks :)

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:What caused it was delusions thinking everything was free for me.

If you think everything is free for you because you've given everyone ESP then that seems fair. But if you think people are acknowledging your gift of ESP in a different way that's not breaking the law (e.g. stealing, violence or endangering people's safety) then you still have the "delusions" but without any of the legal repercussions.

But I don't see anyone arresting me, medicating me and putting me in hospitals or jail because I have delusions. I don't hear voices, but I've silently understood communications from things that most people wouldn't pay any heed to and it's made me do strange stuff, just not break the law. But I'm just classed in with all the mentally "healthy", so that's why I suggested that division between mentally ill and mentally healthy.

Mental "illness" is a strange classification anyway when it's sometimes healthy for things like creativity and straying for the norm in general, but that's another point entirely. I'm not saying paranoia and depression is nice, but it's potentially very useful. Stop me if I'm offending you, I do get that traumatic experiences can render some people particularly sensitive about certain kinds of talk/suggestion concerning their episodes.


You've offended me by thinking you can offend me :D (not really. )

There is a time when mania will result in some very great things for people, its pretty apparent. If it is working for that person, society will typically accept the illness, however there is a fine line between prolific mania and being detrimental to yourself, there is no predictability and the next day could bring dire consequences. There's no telling what will happen when your perception of reality is completely skewered as which occurs while being mentally ill.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Nah » Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:59 pm

As I think the basic nature of awareness and existence is already crazy that it's normal for material universe and creatures including humans to be crazy.
So, I don't worry if someone is diagnosed clinically insane.
It just means (to me) the person is insane in slightly different way compared to majority of people.


Once I rented some rooms in my house, and I lived with (probably) typical paranoia-schizo person for about a year. He thought I was a secret government agent watching him.
When he started to talk his story in his episode of crisis, I played the role he talked about, and somehow it seemed the acceptance/acting disturbed (or at least confused) him a bit.
Maybe he was expecting other people to deny his story (to keep the integrity of his story line that no-one understand/believe him).

Maybe everyone is trying to maintain and protect some strange story line (to cope with something, to dream about something, etc) without knowing, to different degree. :)
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Please put me in your ignore list if you don't like what I write. I don't mind it at all
Since it's not my intention to increase the suffering of others, please don't read my posts if you don't like them.
I do think existence, awareness, material, beings, and humans including you and me to be insane and stupid for structural reasons and from observable behaviors.
I don't think most humans have the preference for logical honesty/integrity that would make us to think in reasonable manner.
I don't think most of us have enough emotional stability to face simple anxiety and fear including existential anxiety.
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Combination of these may make some of you uncomfortable, irritated, and turn into emotional, irrational, and even fanatic mental state.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby WW_III_ANGRY » Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:44 pm

Nah wrote:As I think the basic nature of awareness and existence is already crazy that it's normal for material universe and creatures including humans to be crazy.
So, I don't worry if someone is diagnosed clinically insane.
It just means (to me) the person is insane in slightly different way compared to majority of people.


Once I rented some rooms in my house, and I lived with (probably) typical paranoia-schizo person for about a year. He thought I was a secret government agent watching him.
When he started to talk his story in his episode of crisis, I played the role he talked about, and somehow it seemed the acceptance/acting disturbed (or at least confused) him a bit.
Maybe he was expecting other people to deny his story (to keep the integrity of his story line that no-one understand/believe him).

Maybe everyone is trying to maintain and protect some strange story line (to cope with something, to dream about something, etc) without knowing, to different degree. :)


Or he probably wasn't expecting a secret government agent to admit it to him... There could be alot of things here why you surprised him, which we may not even understand. Going along with his story however probably didn't do him any good.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Silhouette » Thu Jun 16, 2011 1:29 pm

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:Or he probably wasn't expecting a secret government agent to admit it to him... There could be alot of things here why you surprised him, which we may not even understand. Going along with his story however probably didn't do him any good.

I would have thought that delusions were the attempt to take ingredients of what you know to be real, and make them into a "reality" that would explain the new, different way you feel/are sensing things. So it wouldn't be the delusion that makes you e.g. paranoid, but the paranoia that makes you grab onto delusion in order to make sense of your paranoia.

In the case of paranoid delusions, when nobody else confirms the "sense" you've made, this just feeds the paranoia. So if you confirm the delusions, then you would ease the paranoia, which in turn would lessen the person's grip on their delusion in order to make sense of their paranoia... That plus medication and/or therapy would then make sure the paranoia didn't just come back as soon as the delusions stopped being confirmed, and gradually the person could be reintroduced to the accepted interpretation of reality.

Of course this is all just speculation, and I'm no expert. But it would explain the guy's confusion when Nah disrupted his delusion. It just seems that it's not the delusion that's the primary problem (despite the obvious dangers of acting on the delusion), but the paranoia that's at the root. Mental illness is some neurochemical imbalance right? - which then causes emotional and sensory imbalances, and only then causes an imbalanced interpretation of reality.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby WW_III_ANGRY » Thu Jun 16, 2011 1:55 pm

Silhouette wrote:
WW_III_ANGRY wrote:Or he probably wasn't expecting a secret government agent to admit it to him... There could be alot of things here why you surprised him, which we may not even understand. Going along with his story however probably didn't do him any good.

I would have thought that delusions were the attempt to take ingredients of what you know to be real, and make them into a "reality" that would explain the new, different way you feel/are sensing things. So it wouldn't be the delusion that makes you e.g. paranoid, but the paranoia that makes you grab onto delusion in order to make sense of your paranoia.

In the case of paranoid delusions, when nobody else confirms the "sense" you've made, this just feeds the paranoia. So if you confirm the delusions, then you would ease the paranoia, which in turn would lessen the person's grip on their delusion in order to make sense of their paranoia... That plus medication and/or therapy would then make sure the paranoia didn't just come back as soon as the delusions stopped being confirmed, and gradually the person could be reintroduced to the accepted interpretation of reality.

Of course this is all just speculation, and I'm no expert. But it would explain the guy's confusion when Nah disrupted his delusion. It just seems that it's not the delusion that's the primary problem (despite the obvious dangers of acting on the delusion), but the paranoia that's at the root. Mental illness is some neurochemical imbalance right? - which then causes emotional and sensory imbalances, and only then causes an imbalanced interpretation of reality.


Well if you have "emotional and sensory imbalances" you already would have an "imbalanced interpretation of reality" *- if we have a sensory imbalance
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Silhouette » Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:22 pm

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:Well if you have "emotional and sensory imbalances" you already would have an "imbalanced interpretation of reality" *- if we have a sensory imbalance

You don't think one precedes the other? Without emotional and sensory experience, you have nothing to interpret. I get that interpretation seems immediate and simultaneous to what is being interpreted, but you can't have interpretation of nothing: you need to sense/feel first.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby WW_III_ANGRY » Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:46 pm

Silhouette wrote:
WW_III_ANGRY wrote:Well if you have "emotional and sensory imbalances" you already would have an "imbalanced interpretation of reality" *- if we have a sensory imbalance

You don't think one precedes the other? Without emotional and sensory experience, you have nothing to interpret. I get that interpretation seems immediate and simultaneous to what is being interpreted, but you can't have interpretation of nothing: you need to sense/feel first.


Well sure, by milliseconds yes? Yes, the longer these hallucinations and feelings go on the more detailed and complex your false reality will become as your interpretations will build off each other. But in context you stated something along paranoia as being the inducer for having a false interpretation of reality, well it could also be a hallucination. As with myself, I recall it beginning with auditory hallucinations. I really wasn't paranoid, it was just the opposite. Whether the emotional imbalance (mania) came prior and went by undetected by myself or the hallucinations began first, I couldn't tell you, but my recollection is that the hallucinations induced the mania.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Silhouette » Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:15 pm

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:Well sure, by milliseconds yes? Yes, the longer these hallucinations and feelings go on the more detailed and complex your false reality will become as your interpretations will build off each other. But in context you stated something along paranoia as being the inducer for having a false interpretation of reality, well it could also be a hallucination. As with myself, I recall it beginning with auditory hallucinations. I really wasn't paranoid, it was just the opposite. Whether the emotional imbalance (mania) came prior and went by undetected by myself or the hallucinations began first, I couldn't tell you, but my recollection is that the hallucinations induced the mania.

I have a question about hallucinations: are they ever "just from nothing", or are they always "mistaken" interpretations of whatever sensory/emotional information? For example, when I was on acid, I experienced a Derridean undecidable: something that was not yet a rock or a horse that I could interpret as either until I got close enough to identify it as a horse (at which point I was much less able to consider it as a rock anymore). And things reaching out to grab me were just stationary branches, details could be made to appear very enhanced or erased - all of which could be decribed as hallucinations, but "false" interpretations inspired by what was "there already" (sensed/felt). Are your voices a translation of noises that are actually something else, or is it too hard to tell?

Perhaps verbalised thoughts lose their "volume control" and sometimes jump out at you as though coming from outside your head? - in which case hearing voices would just be hearing what you're thinking (what's "already there"), but hallucinated as being outside your thoughts.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby WW_III_ANGRY » Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:45 pm

Silhouette wrote:
WW_III_ANGRY wrote:Well sure, by milliseconds yes? Yes, the longer these hallucinations and feelings go on the more detailed and complex your false reality will become as your interpretations will build off each other. But in context you stated something along paranoia as being the inducer for having a false interpretation of reality, well it could also be a hallucination. As with myself, I recall it beginning with auditory hallucinations. I really wasn't paranoid, it was just the opposite. Whether the emotional imbalance (mania) came prior and went by undetected by myself or the hallucinations began first, I couldn't tell you, but my recollection is that the hallucinations induced the mania.

I have a question about hallucinations: are they ever "just from nothing", or are they always "mistaken" interpretations of whatever sensory/emotional information? For example, when I was on acid, I experienced a Derridean undecidable: something that was not yet a rock or a horse that I could interpret as either until I got close enough to identify it as a horse (at which point I was much less able to consider it as a rock anymore). And things reaching out to grab me were just stationary branches, details could be made to appear very enhanced or erased - all of which could be decribed as hallucinations, but "false" interpretations inspired by what was "there already" (sensed/felt). Are your voices a translation of noises that are actually something else, or is it too hard to tell?

They can be both. They are "from nothing" when it is most severe.
Silhouette wrote:Perhaps verbalised thoughts lose their "volume control" and sometimes jump out at you as though coming from outside your head? - in which case hearing voices would just be hearing what you're thinking (what's "already there"), but hallucinated as being outside your thoughts.


Yes, but whats interesting is that these thoughts seem to be another part of your consciousness, in which the moment you are in, you disconnected from that area and it is not within your control.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Silhouette » Thu Jun 16, 2011 10:59 pm

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:They can be both. They are "from nothing" when it is most severe.

I presume you use inverted commas because that is how they appear, undoubtedly at the time - as though from nothing. A full dissociation from cause and control, much like being subject to a magician's trick?

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:whats interesting is that these thoughts seem to be another part of your consciousness, in which the moment you are in, you disconnected from that area and it is not within your control.

I see, so the thoughts are not exactly interpreted as coming from outside, but likewise not from "yourself" - which explains the confusion as to their origin. There is an automatic dissociation from them, yet they must be from "within" and linked up with your decision-making or they would not be so compelling to follow.

The reason I am so interested in this is due to an epistemic complaint (nothing new btw).

Knowledge of sensory information as "actual" relies on it being normal and congruent with other people. Hallucinations may seem very real, though they are regarded as unreal due to comparison with others and possibly one's conception of something being slightly wrong. If everyone played along with hallucinations and they never seemed abnormal then the effect would be the same as living a normal life. If you add in the conception of others as hallucinations, then your benchmark for agreement on reality is as "unreal" as your "unreal" hallucinations. And if your benchmark is as unreal as what you are comparing, there are no grounds for what is "real" or "unreal", making the question of reality redundant.

What you're left with is the question of whether your benchmark and your experiences are in line with one another, or not - with the former being mental health and the latter being mental illness. This pushes mental illness into the domain of "severe enough incongruence of experience".

Not that this changes anything about mental health as a kind of question of "balance", but I just think that the above framing is just as valid as any normal framing of this issue.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby lizbethrose » Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:51 am

My only 1st hand experience of psychosis came from the man in Paris who read Robinson Jeffers. I was about 17 at the time and was stranded in the Mar Beouf (sp?) Building because I didn't have the money to get home. I was there, because it was a US Military installation, and safe.

The man came over to where I was sitting--the shelf of a closed magazine rack--and asked if I'd every read Robinson Jeffers. I hadn't, so he started to explain his interpretation of Jeffers to me. Robinson Jeffers was a Big Sur poet who distrusted human contact. Everything had to be transported to him via helicopter. The man went on to say that he was in Paris and in the Mar Beouf Building because "they" had somehow discovered him, despite his various methods of evasion, and were going to test him for 'competency' before he was inducted into the Army. He recounted how "they" had done this to him before and how "they" had used hidden cameras and microphones to "catch" him being "crazy." "They" couldn't 'catch' him because he wasn't crazy--he simply believed Robinson Jeffers.

He spent quite a lot of time 'explaining' himself to me--discussing how he'd made his plans to outwit "them" because they didn't know about the poet, Robinson Jeffers, and how Jeffers had eluded any contact with humanity, which he was also going to do.

I asked him several questions--was Jeffers married and was his wife with him (yes;) did Jeffers not have contact with the various people needed to bring him and his wife their supplies (yes;) didn't that mean he had contact with the outside world? He couldn't answer that.

Finally, after about an hour of this--in my early morning, 17 yr. old's frustration with his unreasonableness, I said, "Well, if you really want to get away from the world, why not just kill yourself?"

He looked at me strangely, got up and walked away, and I laid down on the shelf and fell asleep. He wasn't around when I woke up.

I'll never know what happened to him or if I harmed him in any way. He obviously had an impact on my memory. I don't know if he had an impact on my life any more than I know if I had an impact on his. I hope not.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby WW_III_ANGRY » Fri Jun 17, 2011 2:11 pm

Silhouette wrote:
WW_III_ANGRY wrote:They can be both. They are "from nothing" when it is most severe.

I presume you use inverted commas because that is how they appear, undoubtedly at the time - as though from nothing. A full dissociation from cause and control, much like being subject to a magician's trick?

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:whats interesting is that these thoughts seem to be another part of your consciousness, in which the moment you are in, you disconnected from that area and it is not within your control.

I see, so the thoughts are not exactly interpreted as coming from outside, but likewise not from "yourself" - which explains the confusion as to their origin. There is an automatic dissociation from them, yet they must be from "within" and linked up with your decision-making or they would not be so compelling to follow.

The reason I am so interested in this is due to an epistemic complaint (nothing new btw).

Knowledge of sensory information as "actual" relies on it being normal and congruent with other people. Hallucinations may seem very real, though they are regarded as unreal due to comparison with others and possibly one's conception of something being slightly wrong. If everyone played along with hallucinations and they never seemed abnormal then the effect would be the same as living a normal life. If you add in the conception of others as hallucinations, then your benchmark for agreement on reality is as "unreal" as your "unreal" hallucinations. And if your benchmark is as unreal as what you are comparing, there are no grounds for what is "real" or "unreal", making the question of reality redundant.

What you're left with is the question of whether your benchmark and your experiences are in line with one another, or not - with the former being mental health and the latter being mental illness. This pushes mental illness into the domain of "severe enough incongruence of experience".

Not that this changes anything about mental health as a kind of question of "balance", but I just think that the above framing is just as valid as any normal framing of this issue.


response for the bolded
No, some thoughts at the time are interpreted as coming from the outside, (thus the psychic ability, esp, etc). Some thoughts are not.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Nah » Fri Jun 17, 2011 3:01 pm

WW_III_ANGRY wrote:Or he probably wasn't expecting a secret government agent to admit it to him... There could be alot of things here why you surprised him, which we may not even understand. Going along with his story however probably didn't do him any good.

There is a possibility that the way I acted might have caused bad effect on his state.
Maybe he developed a new delusion in which other people agreeing with him would cause no surprise.
Maybe his level of confusion increased, after that.
I don't really know because I had to put him away soon after that because he was screaming a bit too much in and out of our house.

I called local medical center and asked if someone can give him some help and they said they can do nothing unless he goes to them by his own will, or unless his is harming others.
(Screaming a lot wasn't enough, for them ....)
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Please put me in your ignore list if you don't like what I write. I don't mind it at all
Since it's not my intention to increase the suffering of others, please don't read my posts if you don't like them.
I do think existence, awareness, material, beings, and humans including you and me to be insane and stupid for structural reasons and from observable behaviors.
I don't think most humans have the preference for logical honesty/integrity that would make us to think in reasonable manner.
I don't think most of us have enough emotional stability to face simple anxiety and fear including existential anxiety.
And I like to think and dig things many of us don't really want to see.
Combination of these may make some of you uncomfortable, irritated, and turn into emotional, irrational, and even fanatic mental state.
So, please ignore my posts if you don't like them or if they make you feel uneasy.

Thank you for your understanding. :)
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Nah » Fri Jun 17, 2011 3:19 pm

Silhouette wrote:Of course this is all just speculation, and I'm no expert. But it would explain the guy's confusion when Nah disrupted his delusion. It just seems that it's not the delusion that's the primary problem (despite the obvious dangers of acting on the delusion), but the paranoia that's at the root. Mental illness is some neurochemical imbalance right? - which then causes emotional and sensory imbalances, and only then causes an imbalanced interpretation of reality.

I'm not very sure if the mental condition is really created by chemical imbalance, or mental condition AND chemical imbalance are just associated and happens side by side.

And maybe what you say about paranoia is right in this case.
I think what he was doing was to create the perspective in which he is "right/correct/good" BECAUSE he was afraid (of being wrong/bad/accused) and especially being looked down by others.
He was screaming against others (calling others "moron") because it helped him to feel it's others who were wrong, I'd say.
Delusion is similar. It allowed him to be a good person (in his view) as anyone who isn't kind/nice enough for his taste can become a government agent and/or a drug dealer.
In this way, he tried to look away and to omit the possibility that others see him as bad/stupid/insane/etc (always in his view).
But the very method he took was the "clinically insane" one, ironically, resulting other to look him down, most probably.
And the vicious cycle can rock and roll.
Perspective Logic - (Unofficial) ILP Wiki
Please put me in your ignore list if you don't like what I write. I don't mind it at all
Since it's not my intention to increase the suffering of others, please don't read my posts if you don't like them.
I do think existence, awareness, material, beings, and humans including you and me to be insane and stupid for structural reasons and from observable behaviors.
I don't think most humans have the preference for logical honesty/integrity that would make us to think in reasonable manner.
I don't think most of us have enough emotional stability to face simple anxiety and fear including existential anxiety.
And I like to think and dig things many of us don't really want to see.
Combination of these may make some of you uncomfortable, irritated, and turn into emotional, irrational, and even fanatic mental state.
So, please ignore my posts if you don't like them or if they make you feel uneasy.

Thank you for your understanding. :)
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby eyesinthedark » Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:07 am

I guess the real world was too much for you to handle- the sudden and unexpected loss of your job, so you created an alternate one where you had more security and importance. Living with your parents allowed you to do that. You were able to create any world you wanted from the safety of your room. It's really reflective of your ego, our ego, neh? Of course, everyone wishes to be God, as opposed to just another worker peon that can be sacked, anytime, that the world revolves around us, that we can fly, but reality forces us to repress those urges for fear of disappointment, that, and, we naturally love truth, but can learn to dismiss truth when it becomes too horrible to bear. So, we try to satisfy our vain, human desires for fame, fortune, omnipotence etc through reality as much as we can, where as you gave up, seeking to satisfy those desires through a manufactured unreality. You intentionally misinterpreted things in a way that would confirm your imagined divinity, your need for importance and security that you no longer sought in the real world. Suddenly, reality lost all value, since it disappointed you so, but still having desires, you attempted to satiate them in fiction. I don't see your schizophrenia, or rather, delusion, as the negative kind, but of the positive variety. Your mind, perhaps consciously/intentionally or even unconsciously/unintentionally, as a survival mechanism, as a way to escape your depression, was working overtime, making false connections and interpretations to shield you from reality, everything passed through extra mental filters, guarding your fragile heart from being harrased with truth, hence the voices, the overactive imagination, the subjectivism, to protect you.. sometimes just out of habit. Yes, it all makes sense, I understand perfectly why this happend to you. You ceased being a philosopher, a rational person, you became a lover of fiction, an artist, an idealist, rather than a camera. I'm surprised no one else here was able to ascertain your condition, yours was at least a partially intentional, subconscious delusion, a forsaking of reality, fueled by your seclusion from the external world and stress, fatigue, depression, marijuana etc. Not much different than the organized, systematic, mass-delusions peddled by the priestcraft, just their's are government sanctioned/conducive to the agenda of the ruling class(es), where as your's were not.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby eyesinthedark » Sun Jun 19, 2011 7:41 am

A few more things-

Your second episode was fairly obvious, to me at least. I think that at some point, you felt anxiety at the prospect of losing your job again (rejection- relived trauma)- the prospect of your high hopes being shattered was too much for you to endure, so you began to edit reality. We all edit reality on a daily or even hourly basis. Certain thoughts about ourselves or others bother us, so we tend to construe those thoughts in a way that'll make reality seem better than actuality, it's just that most people, most of the time, do this moderately, or at least we think we do, where as yours was more extreme, because of your excessive need to esteem yourself highly (along with your imaginative talents and disdain for truth). Ultimately, I don't think you were prepared for how harsh, how cruel life/society can be (sheltered). You used your illusions as coping mechanisms, the same way others use drugs, alcohol and religion. I think the motivations behind multiple personality disorder (aka disassociative identity disorder) and psychosis are one in the same. Sometimes, It could be triggered psychologically, others, physiologically. In any case, it's just another one of humanities responses to overwhelming stimuli. Subjective creatures, we are. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to read part 2 of your memoir. I should add- it was a very compelling read.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby eyesinthedark » Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:04 am

From the time you were a boy, you were sold a pack of lies, that's 20 years of brainwashing. You were told that, you're special (wrong, you're just another human resource out of 7 billion), you were told most people are descent (wrong, most people are selfish, hyper-competitive, greedy little parasites), you were taught that if you got a "good" education, worked hard and played by the rules- you were assured success, that the red carpet would be rolled out for you (wrong, politicians lie, cheat and steal, doctors lie cheat and steal, for profit/to advance their position at your expense, your employer and "fellow" employees are no exception, you, are no exception), you were taught to ignore death, infact, you were taught death doesn't exist (wrong again, we are fallible, we are finite, society makes mistakes, individuals make mistakes). The sudden realization, the unexpected thwarting of your many, many, high expectations, resulted in your depresion and subsequent retreat and withdrawl from society. Here, in your comfortable, safe and sound little world, you were able to manufacture fantasies to escape the harsh, cold and indifferent universe. Your dreams turned to nightmares upon re-entering society and nearly realizing reality was indifferent to your delusions of Godhood, or, self-importance (I'm special, the world revolves around me) society sold you, that you so desperately, desperately wanted to believe, so you invented other fictions to support the central one. If they don't recognize my divinity, that is because they are fools, or, they are envious, or, I am the devil, yes, that's it. The way I see it, this was your revenge on the universe, you said fuck the world, I don't have to deal with it, I can be a solipsist architect of my own world. Now, I should add, none of these things took place consciously, but subconsciously, organically, over a period of several months, little by little, the imagination took over as reality faded. It happend physiologically, as well as psychologically. It was perhaps a series of subconscious, psychological choices as well as an automatic, biological safety mechanism. Much like a drug addict or alcoholic, this addiction to delusion will resurface from time to time, prompted by the continued realization of realities shortcomings. You will have relapses, you will be tempted by to self-medicate through delusion, so be prepared, or do you medicate through other means, now (prescription drugs)? Hmmm, perhaps these bouts with psychosis sparked your interest in philosophy, subjectivity and objectivity?
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby Ierrellus » Sun Jun 19, 2011 3:36 pm

WWIII,
You were able to survive your "decent into the maelstrom" and to emerge into what the MI (Mental Illness) professionals call a positive outcome. I have a dear friend who may not be so lucky. In support of your remembering psychotic events and ideas I can state that my friend does also. Best wishes for your continued success. You might want to see my thread or to read Torrey's "Surviving Schizophrenia". The latter covers all bases of questions asked and is a reputable guide for exploring the latest research, for explaining how parents and friend can deal with a shizophrenic and how one can advocate for better therapies for the mentally ill.
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Re: My 1st Hand experience of Psychosis

Postby lizbethrose » Mon Jun 20, 2011 6:02 am

Ierrellus wrote:WWIII,
You were able to survive your "decent into the maelstrom" and to emerge into what the MI (Mental Illness) professionals call a positive outcome. I have a dear friend who may not be so lucky. In support of your remembering psychotic events and ideas I can state that my friend does also. Best wishes for your continued success. You might want to see my thread or to read Torrey's "Surviving Schizophrenia". The latter covers all bases of questions asked and is a reputable guide for exploring the latest research, for explaining how parents and friend can deal with a shizophrenic and how one can advocate for better therapies for the mentally ill.


Thank you Ier, I think this may be your step 2.

WWIII, Ier and I have been corresponding through his thread about MI and the future of treatment. He started the thread because he was, at the time, against the use of drug therapy in dealing with mental illness. Obviously, I disagreed or we wouldn't have had a continued conversation.

I often shudder over the lack of understanding the majority of people have about mental illness--mental dysfunction. Pseudo science seems to have become the norm and pseudo science jargon is the language of the 'norm.' In my mind, this is a grave injustice to the mentally ill, especially those on Medicaid. But that's another thread.

As a functioning paranoid schizophrenic,imm, you're very much like the true alcoholic who stops drinking. No matter what you've done or how you've gone beyond your disease to reach equanimity, you're still schizophrenic and always will be. The same is true with the non-drinking alcoholic--s/he will always be an alcoholic. I really hope you can accept this. I'm sure you can, or you wouldn't have come so far.

BTW, marijuana use has been shown not to result in paranoid schizophrenia.
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