Deterministic capitalism

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Deterministic capitalism

Postby Gamer » Tue Nov 17, 2020 5:16 am

If we hold that the universe is deterministic and free will is a non-starter, then shouldn’t we be a bit more mindful of the role luck plays in well-being?

And if that’s the case, why do we lack compassion when we see people struggle; why do we blame them for their moral failings, stupidity, or lack of hard work?
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Re: Deterministic capitalism

Postby obsrvr524 » Tue Nov 17, 2020 5:26 am

Gamer wrote:If we hold that the universe is deterministic and free will is a non-starter, then shouldn’t we be a bit more mindful of the role luck plays in well-being?

I think that if the universe is determinate, there is no such thing as luck, right?

Gamer wrote:And if that’s the case, why do we lack compassion when we see people struggle; why do we blame them for their moral failings, stupidity, or lack of hard work?

Don't we treat others in a way we feel will either encourage or discourage behavior? When someone doesn't have a job we tell them to "go get a job". They might not be able to do that, but if they are not willing to try when encouraged - where would the compassion fit in? Feel sorry for them as they die? Or poke them with a stick?
              You have been observed.
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Re: Deterministic capitalism

Postby iambiguous » Tue Nov 17, 2020 5:51 am

Gamer wrote:If we hold that the universe is deterministic and free will is a non-starter, then shouldn’t we be a bit more mindful of the role luck plays in well-being?

And if that’s the case, why do we lack compassion when we see people struggle; why do we blame them for their moral failings, stupidity, or lack of hard work?


Again, this rendition of it!

We hold that, "the universe is deterministic and free will is a non-starter", and then ask if we should be a bit more mindful of luck, as though anything that we are mindful of here is not also embedded inherently, necessarily in a wholly determined universe!!

Look, I'll admit I'm just not thinking this through correctly, but if "I" is derived from a mind that is derived from a brain that is no less matter wholly in sync with the immutable laws of matter, being mindful about anything is only what we were ever able to be mindful of.

Right?
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
And here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=194382

tiny nietzsche: what's something that isn't nothing, but still feels like nothing?
iambiguous: a post from Pedro?
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Re: Deterministic capitalism

Postby fuse » Thu Nov 19, 2020 10:53 am

obsrvr524 wrote:
Gamer wrote:If we hold that the universe is deterministic and free will is a non-starter, then shouldn’t we be a bit more mindful of the role luck plays in well-being?

I think that if the universe is determinate, there is no such thing as luck, right?

When someone gains an advantage through no control of their own -- inheritance, for example -- it's commonly said to be lucky. If luck is too loaded a term, try 'unearned advantage' in its place.

Gamer wrote:And if that’s the case, why do we lack compassion when we see people struggle; why do we blame them for their moral failings, stupidity, or lack of hard work?

Because the cosmic joke is that there should be a deterministic universe where life thinks itself free.
Or alternatively, because victim blaming avoids the cognitive dissonance of knowing that people struggle through no fault of their own and that we're not as compassionate as we think?
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Re: Deterministic capitalism

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:05 pm

Gamer wrote:If we hold that the universe is deterministic and free will is a non-starter, then shouldn’t we be a bit more mindful of the role luck plays in well-being?

And if that’s the case, why do we lack compassion when we see people struggle; why do we blame them for their moral failings, stupidity, or lack of hard work?

1) very few people are consistant. We have been raised in a mix of paradigms - through media, school, peers, parents, religious organisations and each of these already contains mixed paradigms.
2) someone could say they are themselves determined not to feel sympathy. They can't help it.
3) One could still feel superior, if merely by luck. If I was 6'9" I would likely feel superior to shorter basketball players, at least some of the time, while also at other times realizing it was the luck of the draw. One can have a pride in being. IOW being good can be seen as inherent not something achieved. It's not a moral state, per se, but one could see oneself as simply greater. It would be a fact rather than an achievement.
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