peacegirl wrote:Ecmandu wrote:You stated outright that your definition of determinism is THE accurate one (as a universal qualifier) which means: for all possible beings in existence
Don't play games with me here, your exact words are only 6 short posts back.
Give me this definition and stop playing games.
Ecmandu, I am not playing games. You have had an aggressive attitude toward me from day one. We're adults and hopefully we can enter into a calm conversation without verbal attacks. It's clear that determinism rubs you the wrong way, and I do understand. I would feel the same way if I thought that we had no say in anything we do because the external (what you call determinism) gives a person no say, or makes him a non-entity.
I'm upset with you because I have a perfect definition of determinism, which includes "if you know everything that's going to happen to you before it happens and yet can change none of it, even though it might be highly undesirable to you, then you're in a deterministic system"
However, this is just a subset of knowing every reason why you know everything you know.
For another example: this exactvneuron in my brain moved to that spot because Phil farted
Once perfect deterministic knowledge hits 100%, it's impossible for the being to be sentient, as I demonstrated with logical catatonia.
Since we are aware that we exist, we demonstrate self evidently that we are not completely determined, as a 100% determined system has no choice but to be itself. I put all my cards on the table here and you still haven't taken the time to define determinism since it was requested that this minimal amount of effort on your part would keep the thread on topic, and provide interest on your part in this thread continuing along these lines.
Instead of leaving it an open question whether you are projecting your fear that you may be wrong onto me, perhaps, you can simply engage like a person who's interested in getting to the truth.
What my argument and definition does is to take the limit of the only hypothetical state of consciousness that can prove determinism, and show self evidently that it cannot achieve this state of consciousness without not existing.