Origin of our beliefs

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Origin of our beliefs

Postby locke_key » Tue Jul 30, 2002 4:23 am

this is a very touchy subject with myself and fellow "collaberators." many poeple would like to believe themeselves completely independant of "popular" cultural norms, behaviors, and ideas, but how can we determine what is truly original or evolved. (evolved being an improved idea)

i have plenty of thoughts, but i would first like to see what kinda response i get.

once again i say goodbye...
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Postby Brad » Tue Jul 30, 2002 9:30 am

I'm unclear as to what you're asking here. I suppose I could give a brief narrative on my philosophical/theological/poltical positions since high school but why that would interest anyone is beyond me. If you're asking about origins of new thoughts, I see them as the reweaving of old ones. Something completely new is incomprehensible (for anyone). In this sense, 'new thoughts' are generated by restructuring vocabularies in terms of siginificance and by borrowing descriptions from other vocabularies (from other fields, other cultures, other professions etc.). This in turn stimulates other reformulations and reweavings and so on and so forth.

I believe we're all influences by cultural norms, beliefs, behaviors etc.
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Postby nomen nescio » Tue Jul 30, 2002 11:21 am

heh, everytime I think I've come up with something original, I go and read a book a month later and find out someone else has thought along those same lines.

Don't know where I read this but apparently someone said that crosswords are easier in the afternoon rather than the morning since many people have solved them in the morning, and we who do it in the afternoon 'pick up' others answers psychically or.. somethign......
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Postby Magius » Tue Jul 30, 2002 7:06 pm

In serendipity I believe it is still evolved because the person is not aware of there already being something. Any idea that you do not have knowledge of is for yourself, and evolved thought. Ie. If I have never read Einstein or heard anything about his theories and I one day come up with the same theories as he, then in societies eyes it is not evolved. But for the person it is. Only the person themselves can know whether a thought they had was an innovative one or not.
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Postby locke_key » Wed Jul 31, 2002 2:30 am

i think our main hinderance must be language. actually sit down and think about it, even our thought process works in language. how can we make something new into language: even new words sound silly and uncomprehensive...

i know that this is extremely loosely worded, sometimes i find it difficult to get straight to my point, or is it my unwillingness. anyhow, i do agree with brad, hesaid...
[quote]I believe we're all influences by cultural norms, beliefs, behaviors etc.[quote/]

although, i also agree with magius. i believe this will take more reflection on my behalf...
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Postby anima » Wed Jul 31, 2002 7:16 pm

I'm assuming your question is "are we shaped more by environment or genetic composition?"

Our "norms, beliefs, behaviours" do probably affect us. But it is people that determine societies "norms, beliefs, behaviours". So it works both ways. Kind of a chicken - egg scenario. I am, however, more inclined to believe it is genes that determine the person, and not environment.

As a father of 3, having watched each grow up in a similar environment -- same state, same neighborhood, same house, same mother, same values, same everything (practically), it struck me how they could be so COMPLETELY different.

Differences in people's character probably goes back to their egg/sperm makeup. Then again, it probably goes back even further than that. :wink:
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Postby locke_key » Thu Aug 01, 2002 10:54 pm

having no children (as of right now anyways), it is hard to make those observations. boiling back down to the genetic versus society topic... what would one think actually determines the "flavor" of a person?

obviously our "flavor" colours our believes, but if a person had a slight change of character, could that be an gene type effect? it sounds kinda out there...
"Eagles soar, but a weasel never gets sucked into a jet engine" -Lady Hedgehog
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Postby cba1067950 » Thu Aug 01, 2002 11:51 pm

If you're asking about origins of new thoughts, I see them as the reweaving of old ones.


Einstein came up with the idea of black holes. There is such few things in nature that resemble them that it's kind of amazing that he was able to imagine them. Now that it's so obvious I like to think of them as astronomical whirlpools. But the concept of them are totally different. I could be totally wrong though. Then the concept of 0 was invented in persia right? That's almost original especially for the time. Then there is apes evolving into man assuming you beleive in evolution. Have you ever seen damn I forgot... I think it was space oddesy... damnit the movie with the monkey using the bone as a club? That would be a totally original idea. Something to contribute to the evolution of mankind. Whatever seperated us from normal apes assuming evolution is correct. That was really horribly typed o well...
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Postby HVD » Fri Aug 02, 2002 1:03 pm

0 was invented (or discovered?) in India
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pondering......

Postby joesmum » Fri Aug 02, 2002 7:11 pm

:lol: i am pondering ..... where does inspiration come from?
As an artist I am often inspired to do an origional picture after absorbing the energy of other artists.a friend of mine ...a potter ...watches old black and white movies constantly as she decorates her pottery .The work is nothing like the movies ...yet it does have a flavor of the drama within those movies ...and her colors are all sepia tones except for a few threads of gold.(very little color).
I did a painting recently ...very different from my usual style ....I was thrilled with it ....and thought my idea very origional. a couple of weeks later I discovered a whole genre of artists ...painting in this style.
we are all connected... somehow ...some way I think! :wink: cheerio for now.
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Re: pondering......

Postby joesmum » Fri Aug 02, 2002 7:12 pm

joesmum wrote::lol: i am pondering ..... where does inspiration come from?
As an artist I am often inspired to do an origional picture after absorbing the energy of other artists.a friend of mine ...a potter ...watches old black and white movies constantly as she decorates her pottery .The work is nothing like the movies ...yet it does have a flavor of the drama within those movies ...and her colors are all sepia tones except for a few threads of gold.(very little color).
I did a painting recently ...very different from my usual style ....I was thrilled with it ....and thought my idea very origional. a couple of weeks later I discovered a whole genre of artists ...painting in this style.
we are all connected... somehow ...some way I think! :wink: cheerio for now.
to thine own self be true.....
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