Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Ecmandu » Sat Mar 07, 2020 11:31 pm

Felix,

In all honesty, you and Carl have no clue what you’re talking about.

I’ll reiterate a recommendation to you:

When the gods come after you, say this very simple thing:

“It’s MUCH easier to break something (every time) than it is to fix, build or maintain something!

Gods want to be seen as powerful.

They’ll listen to you if you say this!

It’s much easier to torment people than it is to send them to bliss.

Felix, you’ve never met a god, so I give you a pass.

But to think Jung is THE WORD, is ignorance. Jung is an idiot.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby child_in_time » Sat Mar 07, 2020 11:59 pm

Greatest I am wrote:
child_in_time wrote:[

War, genocide, raping, pillaging, murdering. That's been pretty much the history of humanity, hasn't it?

Regards


Yes; along with enforced religiosity to divide people.

Male god s of war should get a two thumbs down.

Regards
DL


This is why I've said that "Gone with the Wind" is my "Bible"
The New Testament, with its supposedly more enlightened views of peace, love, brotherhood, sisterhood, turning the other cheek etc., instead of being an agent of peace and good will, has made Christianity to appear as the most hypocritical of all religions. Why have Christians done so poorly at practicing what they preach? One of the reasons has to be that none of the authors of the Bible ever makes that Male Pride - Misogyny - War connection. You see it numerous times in "Gone with the Wind", but few people pick up on it.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby felix dakat » Sun Mar 08, 2020 3:23 am

Ecmandu wrote:Felix,

In all honesty, you and Carl have no clue what you’re talking about.

I’ll reiterate a recommendation to you:

When the gods come after you, say this very simple thing:

“It’s MUCH easier to break something (every time) than it is to fix, build or maintain something!

Gods want to be seen as powerful.

They’ll listen to you if you say this!

It’s much easier to torment people than it is to send them to bliss.

Felix, you’ve never met a god, so I give you a pass.

But to think Jung is THE WORD, is ignorance. Jung is an idiot.


Thanks for the advice.

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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby felix dakat » Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:05 am

Ecmandu wrote:Felix,

In all honesty, you and Carl have no clue what you’re talking about.

I’ll reiterate a recommendation to you:

When the gods come after you, say this very simple thing:

“It’s MUCH easier to break something (every time) than it is to fix, build or maintain something!

Gods want to be seen as powerful.

They’ll listen to you if you say this!

It’s much easier to torment people than it is to send them to bliss.

Felix, you’ve never met a god, so I give you a pass.

But to think Jung is THE WORD, is ignorance. Jung is an idiot.


Did the gods you encountered tell you their names?

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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Greatest I am » Mon Mar 09, 2020 9:40 pm

Tab wrote:
Greatest wrote:No. Our last 5,000 years of war, thanks to our male Gods of War, belies your view.

Now if you want to talk of the 20,000 years of relative peace under goddesses, you might get a yes.


Ah, so religions with goddesses, are good..? So religions are useful, sometimes. Promoting peace..? However...

...Slaine the Barbarian begs to disagree.

Image

Ok, so he's a comic book character, but the celts, and their goddess Danu, were real. They gave the romans a headache or two, back in the day.

celts.png


Seems Goddesses like expansionist wars too.

Our scientific progress has been from war and not peace. We have been stressing ourselves into early graves and can now take the planet with us given our great success at killing.


So you agree then, war drives scientific progress, and religion drives war. Ergo, religion drives scientific progress. Scientific progress is beneficial to humanity, so religion, driving this benefit, is also beneficial in this regard if no other.


I give religions their dues.

I cannot see them as repenting for creating homophobic and misogynous religions, --- till they stop preaching and promoting those sins.

I partially agree with you. Do not play your word games. There is nothing that says that we would not and do not do better science in peacetime has yet to be shown.

The last 70 years also bellies what you put.

Regards
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Ecmandu » Mon Mar 09, 2020 10:56 pm

felix dakat wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:Felix,

In all honesty, you and Carl have no clue what you’re talking about.

I’ll reiterate a recommendation to you:

When the gods come after you, say this very simple thing:

“It’s MUCH easier to break something (every time) than it is to fix, build or maintain something!

Gods want to be seen as powerful.

They’ll listen to you if you say this!

It’s much easier to torment people than it is to send them to bliss.

Felix, you’ve never met a god, so I give you a pass.

But to think Jung is THE WORD, is ignorance. Jung is an idiot.


Did the gods you encountered tell you their names?


Some gods see and hear and feel everything that happens on earth. Not just one, but many of them do.

Name wise ? I’ve met both god and death, I’ve also met Satan I’ve also met the Buddha, I’ve also met Thor.

I’ve met many more gods from non western cultures and have known their names and can’t remember them... like a 12,000 year old rain goddess from South America and the like.

One of the “advantages” of being “king” is that you always know who’s talking to you. Sometimes gods come in their own bodies, mostly, it’s just a human spirit talking to you at the moment through someone you know very well.

You may think it’s your mom talking to you, when really it is a girl talking through your mother who you knew only in second grade.

Like I said, I can’t explain everything I know to you on ILP. Kings get extensive training from gods, angels (devas) and people. I have literally the best training on earth.

Everyone on earth will know everything I know someday. In a format much more efficient than a discussion forum.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby felix dakat » Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:22 am

Ecmandu wrote:
felix dakat wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:Felix,

In all honesty, you and Carl have no clue what you’re talking about.

I’ll reiterate a recommendation to you:

When the gods come after you, say this very simple thing:

“It’s MUCH easier to break something (every time) than it is to fix, build or maintain something!

Gods want to be seen as powerful.

They’ll listen to you if you say this!

It’s much easier to torment people than it is to send them to bliss.

Felix, you’ve never met a god, so I give you a pass.

But to think Jung is THE WORD, is ignorance. Jung is an idiot.


Did the gods you encountered tell you their names?


Some gods see and hear and feel everything that happens on earth. Not just one, but many of them do.

Name wise ? I’ve met both god and death, I’ve also met Satan I’ve also met the Buddha, I’ve also met Thor.

I’ve met many more gods from non western cultures and have known their names and can’t remember them... like a 12,000 year old rain goddess from South America and the like.

One of the “advantages” of being “king” is that you always know who’s talking to you. Sometimes gods come in their own bodies, mostly, it’s just a human spirit talking to you at the moment through someone you know very well.

You may think it’s your mom talking to you, when really it is a girl talking through your mother who you knew only in second grade.

Like I said, I can’t explain everything I know to you on ILP. Kings get extensive training from gods, angels (devas) and people. I have literally the best training on earth.

Everyone on earth will know everything I know someday. In a format much more efficient than a discussion forum.


Have your encounters with gods affected your ability to love and work and if so how?

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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby promethean75 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:46 am

Dammit Felix stop being an enabler. We've been trying to get this fruitcake off philosophy, a decent job and a girlfriend for two years... and here you go asking him about conversations with god. You're gonna throw the guy into regression and ruin all the work we've done.

We would kindly ask that you cease and desist immediately.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby felix dakat » Tue Mar 10, 2020 1:19 am

promethean75 wrote:Dammit Felix stop being an enabler. We've been trying to get this fruitcake off philosophy, a decent job and a girlfriend for two years... and here you go asking him about conversations with god. You're gonna throw the guy into regression and ruin all the work we've done.

We would kindly ask that you cease and desist immediately.


Isn't that what they said to Socrates?

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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby felix dakat » Tue Mar 10, 2020 1:20 am

... and Jesus?

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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Tab » Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:07 am

Hey Greatest,

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of religion, nor a practitioner, but I do accept that the rise and evolution of religions throughout history was inevitable as our societies grew and competed. To say "they are/were useless" is stress-inducing, because gives you a worse view of people in general than you need to have, and we all belong to the group 'people'. :D

I hated religion for a long time. Denied it, bargained with it, accepted it, now I've come to a point of forgiving it. I still know it's all baloney, but eh. You gotta move on.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Aware-ness » Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:13 pm

Ecmandu wrote:Some gods see and hear and feel everything that happens on earth.

Can these gods cure the coronavirus?
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:19 pm

Aware-ness wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:Some gods see and hear and feel everything that happens on earth.

Can these gods cure the coronavirus?


Lol... of course they can!

The thing you put to the gods is “can you make everyone’s dreams come true?” Implied here is that nobodies consent is ever violated as well.

That’s the North Star of gods.

Watch how many cower!
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby MagsJ » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:20 pm

Aware-ness wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:Some gods see and hear and feel everything that happens on earth.

Can these gods cure the coronavirus?

Good (topical) question. =D>

If gods existed, then they would be committing sin.. by their own definition, in letting pain and suffering abound all around them without coming to the immediate aid of the suffering masses. Or is it one rule for them, another for us?
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. - MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something at some point in time.. Wait, What! - MagsJ


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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Tab » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:31 pm

Or lol, why did they create corona virus, or any virus, in the first place.

Oh right, we sinned probably.

But then, why did the gods make us to be capable of sin..?

Oh right, that would violate free-will.

But hang on. Gods don't have to obey paltry human logic. So they could have engineered a universe where humanity has free-will, and yet still cannot sin. Because mysteriousness.

Those gods yeah. Tch. What a bunch of bastards.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:40 pm

Tab wrote:Or lol, why did they create corona virus, or any virus, in the first place.


That’s a good question !!

The thing about gods is that most of them are quite impotent, the only power they REALLY have is destruction... the easiest thing to do in all of existence.

They demonstrate their “power” through torment and destruction. The ONE GOD doesn’t exist yet. The truly powerful god.

I know gods and goddesses exist now. They dictate their plans to our spirits, it’s a demented case of control that makes them this way (planning all of our lives at their discretion)

Everyone, ultimately wants to learn and be on their own terms... a god giving us that is the TRUE demonstration of power... the rest is garbage.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby promethean75 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:13 pm

So they could have engineered a universe where humanity has free-will, and yet still cannot sin.


Nah they couldn't do it. It's logically impossible. A god's omniscience would prevent it from happening.

If a God knows that in five minutes you're gonna go to the refrigerator, one of two things logically follow.

a) you're not free to not go to the refrigerator in five minutes.

b) you are free to not go to the refrigerator in five minutes, and God was wrong about what he thought would happen.

if b, we ain't talking about a god here, because gods are omniscient and aren't able to be wrong.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Aware-ness » Wed Mar 11, 2020 5:28 am

Ecmandu wrote:
Aware-ness wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:Some gods see and hear and feel everything that happens on earth.

Can these gods cure the coronavirus?


Lol... of course they can!

Great. Tell the WHO and CDC ... and Trump and Congress ... and the Stock Market. Don't waste your time on China. They don't believe in gods.

Turns out they might not help me either. I'm an atheist of most gods. As far as I know you haven't named all these gods you've met. So I don't know if I'm an atheist of them or not.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Aware-ness » Wed Mar 11, 2020 5:41 am

Tab wrote:But hang on. Gods don't have to obey paltry human logic. So they could have engineered a universe where humanity has free-will, and yet still cannot sin.

Of course I don't know firsthand experientially, but I understand that heaven has freewill, and sin ain't a problem there.

But then, according to tradition, there's the fallen brother of Jesus and his band of fallen angels.

So the evidence so far is, God is unable to create anything of perfection, and without sin.

And so we're inflicted with the sin of viruses. Proving, that even God himself is not without sin. I guess, like father like son ... made in his image ... a sinful image.
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Tab » Wed Mar 11, 2020 5:54 am

promethean75 wrote:
So they could have engineered a universe where humanity has free-will, and yet still cannot sin.


Nah they couldn't do it. It's logically impossible. A god's omniscience would prevent it from happening.

If a God knows that in five minutes you're gonna go to the refrigerator, one of two things logically follow.

a) you're not free to not go to the refrigerator in five minutes.

b) you are free to not go to the refrigerator in five minutes, and God was wrong about what he thought would happen.

if b, we ain't talking about a god here, because gods are omniscient and aren't able to be wrong.


Paltry human. God laughs at your logickmancery. God creates a weight so heavy He Himself cannot lift it. Then He lifts it, hallelujah !

Or ofc. he's just Xarblgarp the very powerful alien. I dunno. hallelujah..?
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby felix dakat » Wed Mar 11, 2020 2:02 pm

Jung's proposition that the gods are archetypes of the collective unconsciousness as evidenced by world mythology, dreams and other spontaneous imagery makes sense to me.

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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Ierrellus » Wed Mar 11, 2020 2:09 pm

felix dakat wrote:Jung's proposition that the gods are archetypes of the collective unconsciousness as evidenced by world mythology, dreams and other spontaneous imagery makes sense to me.

Yes!
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Arcturus Descending » Wed Mar 11, 2020 2:43 pm

felix dakat wrote:
Arcturus Descending wrote:Greatest I Am,

I have asked why A & E chose knowledge over eternal life and that does not get an answer either.


They made a choice. Perhaps living in the moment and becoming all that they could become (which would be impossible in a patriarchal world) was much more important to them than an eternal life which they could never be sure of. Our first rebels. :evilfun:


The Adam and Eve story isn't the recounting of a historical event. It's a myth that shows us the contrast between paradise and our existential situation. If Adam and Eve ate the fruit the tree of life and lived happily ever after forever the story wouldn't reflect the way things are.


Felix, I know that I am not the most intelligent being in the world by far but I think that you have insulted what intelligence I do have here. lol
Are you telling me that you thought that I believed this was "real"? Even when I believed in God, I knew this was myth, kind of like a fairy tale actually. We just cannot "swallow" everything that is told to us.
Perhaps the writers of the bible put that down to keep us lowly human beings in tow hoping that we would think that if we went in search of knowledge, we would evolve and rebel and the powers that be would not have much control of us. They wanted us to think that we just might burn in hell. lol
"Look closely. The beautiful may be small."


"Two things fill the mind with ever new and increasing admiration and awe, the oftener and more steadily we reflect on them: the starry heavens above me and the moral law within me."


“Whereas the beautiful is limited, the sublime is limitless, so that the mind in the presence of the sublime, attempting to imagine what it cannot, has pain in the failure but pleasure in contemplating the immensity of the attempt.”

Immanuel Kant
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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby felix dakat » Wed Mar 11, 2020 2:52 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:
felix dakat wrote:
Arcturus Descending wrote:Greatest I Am,



They made a choice. Perhaps living in the moment and becoming all that they could become (which would be impossible in a patriarchal world) was much more important to them than an eternal life which they could never be sure of. Our first rebels. :evilfun:


The Adam and Eve story isn't the recounting of a historical event. It's a myth that shows us the contrast between paradise and our existential situation. If Adam and Eve ate the fruit the tree of life and lived happily ever after forever the story wouldn't reflect the way things are.


Felix, I know that I am not the most intelligent being in the world by far but I think that you have insulted what intelligence I do have here. lol
Are you telling me that you thought that I believed this was "real"? Even when I believed in God, I knew this was myth, kind of like a fairy tale actually. We just cannot "swallow" everything that is told to us.
Perhaps the writers of the bible put that down to keep us lowly human beings in tow hoping that we would think that if we went in search of knowledge, we would evolve and rebel and the powers that be would not have much control of us. They wanted us to think that we just might burn in hell. lol


I'm sorry you felt insulted by my words. I was merely analyzing the garden of Eden story structurally instead of looking at the characters as if they were historical persons. The writers of the Hebrew Bible didn't have the Christian view that people would burn in hell for eternity. That interpretation was superimposed on the story later by Christian theologians.

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Re: Did sin enter the world through Adam, Satan or Yahweh?

Postby Arcturus Descending » Wed Mar 11, 2020 2:59 pm

child in time,

Eating from the tree was inevitable, and shouldn't be thought of as an eventful choice between two alternatives. Certain choices were available to them, but they did everything exactly as was expected of them.


Why do you say this?
That statement kind of points to God as a puppeteer in my opinion. If it was inevitable that they ate from the tree, it seems to me that they had no free will in the first place.

Well, perhaps in a sense, they did have free choice and made it. What responsibility belongs to God since this entity had knowledge of what they would do? You might think that a discussion between the three of them would have been fair before their God kicked them out of paradise.

Again I am interested in knowing why eating from the tree was inevitable? Basic curiosity of us humans? The inevitability of the Word having to come to pass?
"Look closely. The beautiful may be small."


"Two things fill the mind with ever new and increasing admiration and awe, the oftener and more steadily we reflect on them: the starry heavens above me and the moral law within me."


“Whereas the beautiful is limited, the sublime is limitless, so that the mind in the presence of the sublime, attempting to imagine what it cannot, has pain in the failure but pleasure in contemplating the immensity of the attempt.”

Immanuel Kant
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