Moderator: Only_Humean
Ecmandu wrote:
you are rambling and clawing like a psychotic
surreptitious75 wrote:Ecmandu wrote:
Continuity of consciousness is your existence should it ever cease to exist by time travelers in the past or a death in the infinite future poof you couldnt be right now
Continuity of consciousness and time travellers in the past are simply mental constructs of your own imagination
Eternal existence is not possible because of the Second Law Of Thermodynamics while death is eternally possible
Ecmandu wrote:
Explain to me : how does entropy work on the unassailable proof I just rendered about continuity of consciousness ?
We already know existence itself is a perpetual motion machine ( how about identity ) same proof ?
surreptitious75 wrote:Ecmandu wrote:
Explain to me : how does entropy work on the unassailable proof I just rendered about continuity of consciousness ?
We already know existence itself is a perpetual motion machine ( how about identity ) same proof ?
Existence is a state of being not a machine
Perpetual motion is not possible without infinite energy that does not exist and cannot be created
Also after the heat death of the Universe has occurred maximum entropy will have been attained
Ecmandu wrote:
We can prove by virtue of our existence that existence never stops ( we are a subset ) remember existence is every
thing if everything ceases to be ... us being a subset of existence would not be here making posts on a web board
A hallucinated reality isn't reality. It's imagined. It's not real.A hallucinated reality
surreptitious75 wrote:Ecmandu wrote:
We can prove by virtue of our existence that existence never stops ( we are a subset ) remember existence is every
thing if everything ceases to be ... us being a subset of existence would not be here making posts on a web board
Existence existed long before we did so while it is eternal we are merely finite. Only abstract things can possibly exist for ever because they are
not affected by reality. Things such as existence and death and numbers for example while physical things such as human beings cannot exist for
ever. Existence is therefore not conditional on my own existence. It will carry on long after I have died just as it did long before I was ever born
phyllo wrote:A hallucinated reality isn't reality. It's imagined. It's not real.A hallucinated reality
It's still only an imagined world.People can have tactile hallucinations, emotional hallucinations etc... they are actually reflected images of eternal forms, how you use them is imaginary, and because they are images and not the actual form, it's impossible to hurt any being in existence against its will.
phyllo wrote:It's still only an imagined world.People can have tactile hallucinations, emotional hallucinations etc... they are actually reflected images of eternal forms, how you use them is imaginary, and because they are images and not the actual form, it's impossible to hurt any being in existence against its will.
In the real world, people get hurt. One has to accept it and decide how to live with it.
One can be indifferent, one can be caring, one can be paralyzed by the it. There are all sorts of possibilities.
But you don't solve the problem. You imagine a solution - a hallucinated solution. IOW, you avoid dealing with it in a real workable way.Yes, and apparently you missed the part where I stated that this type of world structure is damned if you do, damned if you don't ... that any structure that solves this problem is objectively superior, I
also stated that you can use the exact consciousness signatures and bodies depending on how difficult you want your life to be, my point, don't dump on others because you want a hard life, do it to yourself.
phyllo wrote:But you don't solve the problem. You imagine a solution - a hallucinated solution. IOW, you avoid dealing with it in a real workable way.Yes, and apparently you missed the part where I stated that this type of world structure is damned if you do, damned if you don't ... that any structure that solves this problem is objectively superior, I
also stated that you can use the exact consciousness signatures and bodies depending on how difficult you want your life to be, my point, don't dump on others because you want a hard life, do it to yourself.
Accept that people will be hurt and move on from there. Build a solution which has that as its base.
It's not a zero sum problem. You got a big gift - conscious life - essentially out of nothing. You get value in life which outweighs the suffering. You're not getting it in exchange for someone else's loss.I did solve the problem, you don't see the problem, zero sum is the problem...
Now in this type of world system it is moral to make desirable states less zero sum, but to make it non zero sum, you need a different world system.
In this world system you need to go through the 4 stages that a sex dimorphism species must go through ...
WendyDarling wrote:Life without opposition is death. Hallucinating a life that you control is not actually living. It would miss out on all the elements that make life challenging and worthy of hard work, effort, and growth. Your idea sucks EC. Nothing would ever be accomplished or gained by your fantasy life for the only person consciously living it.
phyllo wrote:It's not a zero sum problem. You got a big gift - conscious life - essentially out of nothing. You get value in life which outweighs the suffering. You're not getting it in exchange for someone else's loss.I did solve the problem, you don't see the problem, zero sum is the problem...
Now in this type of world system it is moral to make desirable states less zero sum, but to make it non zero sum, you need a different world system.
In this world system you need to go through the 4 stages that a sex dimorphism species must go through ...
That doesn't make any sense.You live in a certain neighborhood, have certain friends... all zero sum, you should be ashamed of yourself for having them.
phyllo wrote:That doesn't make any sense.You live in a certain neighborhood, have certain friends... all zero sum, you should be ashamed of yourself for having them.
Other people live in their own neighborhoods and they have their own friends. They don't need MY friends. There are plenty of friends to go around.
Well, you wrote that I "had" them ... "you should be ashamed of yourself for having them".YOUR friends? You own them?
That's nice. You can be with others who live in your neighborhood.We are all curious by nature ... we want to be with others by nature at some point.
phyllo wrote:Well, you wrote that I "had" them ... "you should be ashamed of yourself for having them".YOUR friends? You own them?
Did you mean that I owned them? Did you mean that I support human slavery by virtue of having "certain friends"?That's nice. You can be with others who live in your neighborhood.We are all curious by nature ... we want to be with others by nature at some point.
Not enough for you? Chat with others on the internet. Get a penpal. Join a club.
Ecmandu wrote:WendyDarling wrote:Life without opposition is death. Hallucinating a life that you control is not actually living. It would miss out on all the elements that make life challenging and worthy of hard work, effort, and growth. Your idea sucks EC. Nothing would ever be accomplished or gained by your fantasy life for the only person consciously living it.
That's your choice to live that way in a hallucinated reality.
We all still have higher selves in the ether to observe how everyone is living their hallucinated life, and we import what we like, we are still helping each other.
WendyDarling wrote:Ecmandu wrote:WendyDarling wrote:Life without opposition is death. Hallucinating a life that you control is not actually living. It would miss out on all the elements that make life challenging and worthy of hard work, effort, and growth. Your idea sucks EC. Nothing would ever be accomplished or gained by your fantasy life for the only person consciously living it.
That's your choice to live that way in a hallucinated reality.
We all still have higher selves in the ether to observe how everyone is living their hallucinated life, and we import what we like, we are still helping each other.
You are not addressing my points. A hallucinated life is not a lived one. Are we split individuals living in this reality, a hallucinated reality, and our higher selves living in the ether? How many aspects of us are we currently...higher self, earth self, ...?
I neither deserve them nor not deserve them - they simply are.You don't understand the 5 heartbreaks of relationship. In you're greed, your ultimate spirit is to hold your friends and neighborhood over others who are less fortunate, somehow, you've probably even talked yourself into believing you deserve them.
I'm opposed to hallucinated realities because they are not real. They don't solve any problem.The sense of power that zero sum games offer are too alluring to you, abuse is your calling card, which is why you are so vehemently opposed to hallucinated realities ... you have no more reason to gloat, and that scares you.
phyllo wrote:I neither deserve them nor not deserve them - they simply are.You don't understand the 5 heartbreaks of relationship. In you're greed, your ultimate spirit is to hold your friends and neighborhood over others who are less fortunate, somehow, you've probably even talked yourself into believing you deserve them.I'm opposed to hallucinated realities because they are not real. They don't solve any problem.The sense of power that zero sum games offer are too alluring to you, abuse is your calling card, which is why you are so vehemently opposed to hallucinated realities ... you have no more reason to gloat, and that scares you.
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