How one should live.

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Re: How one should live.

Postby Fixed Cross » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:02 pm

I contend that Iamb's question is resolved in this dialogue.

"You are fond of him Spiros. You should have had a son."
"But then I would have had a wife."
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Fixed Cross » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:04 pm



If goods weren't conflicting there would be no way of knowing them as goods.
Instead of just causing a great deal of pain for the beauty to shine through, all would a priori be lost.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:27 pm

"Goods" are always conflicting. Nietzsche quickly solved this. But I won't spoil it for those who haven't read him.

I will say that as soon as Nietzsche effortlessly defined good he made clear that he wasn't a moralist. And indeed: can anyone say good taste is "good?"

Nietzsche wasn't good. He was just the first decent human being.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:28 pm

Or, you know, wasn't good on purpose.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Fixed Cross » Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:48 pm

Nietzsche wasn't good. He was just the first decent human being.

Well said.
It clarifies good as the dirtiest word of all.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Fixed Cross » Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:53 pm

Except when used not addressing man, where it retains its pristine original meaning effortlessly.

"Good" becomes dirty when applied to man.
Good pie is great. Good apples, yum. A good man?
Thats your one excuse to run.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Fixed Cross » Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:55 pm

But whenever they stand over someones grave and say 'he was a good man', there was nothing else to say.
"No harm done" on the tombstone.
Good by life is different from good in death.
Like chicken is good in death, where a cat is good in life.
Chickens even really don't seem to mind the prospect of death as gravely as say pigs or ducks. In the first moments they don't even notice that they're dead. There must not be a very stark change.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Aug 28, 2018 10:50 pm

I'm going to be perfectly honest, you guys are shoveling shit.

Who thinks they'd be most suited to debate me?

I will debate you that morality is objective.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:48 pm

Ecmandu wrote:There are billions of victims, simply because the man or woman down the block either is or is not sexually active with you - zero sum - immoral

Go back to my op.

What this proves is that this world system itself is immoral. Any solution to that, has to, by definition be moral.
Could you give some examples of how one should live based on the OP. Actual situations lived as one should as opposed to other options.

I don't get the OP. Here it seems you are saying reality is immoral. I don't know what that means. Is this a version of the problem of evil?
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Ecmandu » Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:51 pm

Karpel Tunnel wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:There are billions of victims, simply because the man or woman down the block either is or is not sexually active with you - zero sum - immoral

Go back to my op.

What this proves is that this world system itself is immoral. Any solution to that, has to, by definition be moral.
Could you give some examples of how one should live based on the OP. Actual situations lived as one should as opposed to other options.

I don't get the OP. Here it seems you are saying reality is immoral. I don't know what that means. Is this a version of the problem of evil?


What I'm saying is that zero sum is immoral... as long as another person is in your reality, zero sum kicks in. It's not a POE, it is evil. It makes cunts and douchebags of us all.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby surreptitious75 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:58 am

Ecmandu wrote:
I was talking about completely hallucinated realities

Hallucinated because each reality can only be perfect when it has only one person in it ?
It is a wonderfully Utopian notion except for the fact that it is still one person too many
For if you want truly perfect realities then you need to remove human beings altogether
The best reality of all is death because it is a place free from all suffering for all of time
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Ecmandu » Wed Aug 29, 2018 1:26 am

surreptitious75 wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:
I was talking about completely hallucinated realities

Hallucinated because each reality can only be perfect when it has only one person in it ?
It is a wonderfully Utopian notion except for the fact that it is still one person too many
For if you want truly perfect realities then you need to remove human beings altogether
The best reality of all is death because it is a place free from all suffering for all of time


if anyone could have their dreams come true forever, the thought of the impossible eternal death would never cross their minds. This is only a situational truth, not a universal truth for all being (which is why we still exist and always will)
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Re: How one should live.

Postby surreptitious75 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 1:38 am

My dream would be to be dead forever then I would no longer be able to suffer anymore
But because I am going to die I do not need to dream it as it is actually going to happen
Living forever is worse than being dead for you can never leave not even if you want to
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Ecmandu » Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:51 am

surreptitious75 wrote:My dream would be to be dead forever then I would no longer be able to suffer anymore
But because I am going to die I do not need to dream it as it is actually going to happen
Living forever is worse than being dead for you can never leave not even if you want to


I'm sorry. I'm going to have to hold your hand for a second. You see, if you ever die, then you cease to exist, throughout all space and time and beyond.

Wait! You do exist! You do the math!

Now since the stakes ARE infinite, you'll start considering morality. Obviously, finite lives have a stake of 0%.

Maybe you folks will stop being cocky for a change and listen and pay attention.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby surreptitious75 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:01 am

Ecmandu wrote:
if you ever die then you cease to exist throughout all space and time and beyond

Just because you want to live forever does not mean everyone else wants to
I have absolutely no problem with death either philosophically or in reality
And eternal non consciousness free from all suffering is as good as it gets
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Ecmandu » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:18 am

surreptitious75 wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:
if you ever die then you cease to exist throughout all space and time and beyond

Just because you want to live forever does not mean everyone else wants to
I have absolutely no problem with death either philosophically or in reality
And eternal non consciousness free from all suffering is as good as it gets


The point I am making. I agree with you, but that's not how reality is. Use logic. If you die, you were never born. Proof through contradiction.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby surreptitious75 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:20 am

Ecmandu wrote:
Now since the stakes ARE infinite you will start considering morality

Maybe you folks will stop being cocky for a change and listen and pay attention

The stakes are not infinite and death is the answer not morality

I can only pay attention while I am still alive and before eternal non consciousness occurs
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Ecmandu » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:26 am

surreptitious75 wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:
Now since the stakes ARE infinite you will start considering morality

Maybe you folks will stop being cocky for a change and listen and pay attention

The stakes are not infinite and death is the answer not morality

I can only pay attention while I am still alive and before eternal non consciousness occurs


I gave you the proof through contradiction, and you're plugging your ears saying "I can't hear you!"

And you're projecting states to me that aren't true, I've tried harder than most to try to destroy existence... I learned the hard way... existence doesn't get destroyed. You don't think I was you at one point? Search deep in your heart. Why don't you then just commit not only suicide but destroy the earth...

Because you know like I do that we never really die.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby surreptitious75 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:26 am

Ecmandu wrote:
If you die you were never born

If you never existed you were never born
Death is just a transition between states
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Ecmandu » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:28 am

surreptitious75 wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:
If you die you were never born

If you never existed you were never born
Death is just a transition between states


And states are not eternal non consciousness.

*keeps holding your hand*
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Re: How one should live.

Postby surreptitious75 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:35 am

Ecmandu wrote:
existence doesnt get destroyed

No but every thing changes over time and the most obvious change is that from life to death
My death will only destroy me not existence which will carry on being long after I have gone
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Ecmandu » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:38 am

surreptitious75 wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:
existence doesnt get destroyed

No but every thing changes over time and the most obvious change is that from life to death
My death will only destroy me not existence which will carry on being long after I have gone


*still holding your hand*

Continuity of consciousness is your existence, should it ever cease to exist by time travelers in the past or a death in the infinite future *poof* you couldn't be, right now.

I know this is hard for you
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Re: How one should live.

Postby surreptitious75 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:43 am

Ecmandu wrote:
And states are not eternal non consciousness

keeps holding your hand

Death is the state of eternal non consciousness

No need to hold my hand once I am dead
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Re: How one should live.

Postby Ecmandu » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:49 am

surreptitious75 wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:
And states are not eternal non consciousness

keeps holding your hand

Death is the state of eternal non consciousness

No need to hold my hand once I am dead


Yes it is. And no, it doesn't occur... just like nothing at all doesn't occur. In your panic, you're rambling and clawing like a psychotic.
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Re: How one should live.

Postby surreptitious75 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:52 am

Ecmandu wrote:
Continuity of consciousness is your existence should it ever cease to exist by time travelers in the past or a death in the infinite future poof you couldnt be right now

Continuity of consciousness and time travellers in the past are simply mental constructs of your own imagination
Eternal existence is not possible because of the Second Law Of Thermodynamics while death is eternally possible
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