Peter, you really don’t get it.
You still believe votes in the US are actually tabulated for mayors, congressmen, senators, governors and even the president. Dude! You are so 30 years ago!
You are in denial and you don’t know shit.
K: I ask for facts and you give me something about me being in denial…
feel free to offer us some facts about what you say… for example, proof
that “ALL” voting machines have modems…
you point out some conspiracy about how votes are manipulated,
great, show me the evidence… to do such a manipulation requires
thousands of people to be in the loop of the conspiracy……
where is your proof that thousands of people are manipulating
our elections?
who is committing the crime?
and how does the crime go unreported given
that thousands of people are required to make
a conspiracy like this work
any facts or evidence to show us you are right?
it has nothing to do with denial and that ain’t a river
in Egypt…
show us your proof…
I know enough not to believe in some wild eye conspiracies…
Kropotkin
Sure, if, in any particular community, everyone can agree that only after an absolutely safe and effective vaccine has been created will an actual public policy be established.
And the odds of that?
After all, those of particular religious faiths already start out by insisting that all of this is in the hands of God.
Okay, what of their children and the state?
And, until a vaccine is created that all parents accept, what of the laws requiring children to obtain particular vaccinations before being admitted into public schools?
How on earth is it realistic to take the fact of power/politics out of this in the interim?
Reported? Propaganda has come a LONG way since Nazi Germany Peter!!! A really long way!! The US is a propaganda state and a Nazi state.
It’s been massively reported that
a.) yes, all vote counting machines have modems.
b.) because of what’s known about defeating this technological truth, we can conclude that the “government” doesn’t want votes to count.
Dude, Peter, you don’t know shit about voting machines, you’ve read no literature, you haven’t seen them in person and you know nothing about modems or hacking.
People who do know this shit, can’t say for 100% certain that our votes are being hacked, but they can say for 100% certain that they can be hacked.
Since the problem has already been solved and not implemented, now they can say for 100% certainty that they are being hacked.
Peter, let me give you a little fact about the US propaganda state.
Who won WWII?
The US?
No! It was the Russians!
Every country outside the US knows this.
K: and I rest my case…
Kropotkin
Peter,
70 million Russians died in WWII!
Only 6 million Jews
The Russian front was so brutal that the only way they didn’t starve to death was to eat their own dead! And many of them did starve to death!
You think you had some strange QED
Truth is, you don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about.
If the Americans had never entered the war, the Russians would have conquered Berlin anyways.
Here’s a link for you…
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties
This link states that only 27 million Russians died:
Big difference from my 70 million.
You see… hitler never expected the Russians to get involved… but fuck! Did they ever get involved!
What I’ve heard from scholars is that it was 1/3rd of the Russian population at the time.
Scholars can be wrong about the numbers.
What they all say unanimously is that had the Americans not entered the war, that Russians would have conquered Germany anyways.
Again, you simply insist that it has to be discussed through your perspective.
Anyways, we veered off a bit from the point I raised earlier. We do have whistle blowers like Kennedy but they don’t effect change.
The nazis won ww11 in the form of America from project paperclip. The propaganda ministers from Nazi germany learned a lot of lessons after the German attempt about how to control a state, give people the perception of threat, peace and freedom
Anyways… like a Nazi state, the US is experimenting massively on the US population both psychologically and physiologically.
Another thing about this… presidents don’t have the security clearance to know that they weren’t elected.
The global elites pick them for the DRAMA!!! The vote counting machines have been hacked by the US government for 30 years now.
It’s the biggest news story in the world!
Have you ever seen a movie or television or news snippet about this in the major papers? No!
That’s because ALL of this has to be CLEARED by the ministry of propaganda first!
Back when the internet first became public, this was a huge talking point, then the internet became controlled as well.
Back in the 90’s, the internet was the ‘Wild West’!
The ‘dark web’ was just part of the regular internet back then!
It’s all sanitized now.
But: My own perspective here is no less a profoundly problematic existential contraption rooted subjectively in dasein. Now, if what you are arguing is that I am arguing that everyone else is obligated to view their own perspective in that manner in turn then, well, sure, if that’s what you believe “in your head” then that makes it true. For you.
But beyond just believing it, how would you go about demonstrating to others that they are obligated to believe what you do too?
I will flat out admit that I can’t demonstrate my own frame of mind here. On the contrary, the gist of my argument in regards to things like vaccinations is that, sans God, mere mortals are only able to exchange moral and political assessments rooted in prejudices rooted in dasein rooted in the understanding that given new experiences, new relationships and access to new information, knowledge and ideas, “I” am always confronted with at least the possibilty of reconfiguring my point of view about the rightness or the wrongness of vaccines.
Again, this, in my view, is what the objectivists among us most fear. Not that they aren’t right about their own point of view here, but that no point of view can ever be clearly, definitively demonstrated to be either right or wrong.
The fragmented and fractured “I”.
I’m saying that you insist that everyone discuss it in terms of your perspective … political economy, dasein, definitive demonstrations. And in the religious threads … morality, salvation and afterlife.
Why do you think that you are accused of being a spammer and a troll? You go into a thread and switch the topic to dasein and your interests.
Come on, most of my contributions/posts at ILP revolve around threads that I started. In fact, I don’t participate at all in the preponderance of threads.
And, over and over and over again, I make it crystal clear that my interest in philosophy revolves around morality here and now and immortality there and then. At the existential juncture of identity, value judgments and political economy.
This and such “metaphysical” quandaries as determinism and the nature of existence itself.
No, I think those here inclined to label me a spammer and a troll are pissed off at me for others reasons. I have my own take on that and they have theirs.
After all, in forums of this nature some are more readily made to look like, say, stooges than others. If I do say so myself. 
Nice anecdotal ‘evidence’. Notice no response to any of the research. So basically you decided to re-assert your position. And you consider yourself, for some reason, on the rational team.
And there are those people who believe that. I don’t. I think it is much more nuanced than that. But pick the most extreme position, dismiss it without evidence or argument, if that makes you think you actually just did something or contributed to a conversation.
In a world where the tobacco industry managed to create vast amounts of scientific research befuddling all sorts of government regulartion for decades, you’d think people who simply trust industry generation pr and research would consider it possible that SOME vaccines are problematic and unsafe.
But no. People like you feel not the slightest need to investigate a damn thing. You come with anectdotal evidence, make blanket assertions, respond as if the only counter-position is binarily opposite yours, and investigate nothing.
You should be embarrassed but you’re smug.
Perhaps I nearly died, or stopped breathing at the very least… perhaps.
Vaccines debilitate many and thus the quality of their lives, but that’s ok right?
My question still stands… why aren’t they made safer?
And so my question still stands… why aren’t they made safer?
A classic oops moment was when the German government was given one type of vaccine for the special people (politicians etc.) and one for the regular citizens. The special people got one that all the crap that supposed conspiracy theorists complain about were removed. It was so embarrassing they recalled the special vaccines, but that begs the question of why important people got a vaccine that lacked things like thimersol and other adjuvants that supposedly make the vaccines better. If they made them better than you damn well know the special rich powerful people would have gotten them, but they were not going to.
Lie big and people can’t believe you are lying.
Lol… that’s so bait, they might as well just have come clean and told the truth… after that fact! 
The majority of the population here are not in support of being vaccinated… many, in the political SM-groups and circles I’m in, are complaining of developing autoimmune issues from having had jabs in the past… looks like I’m not the only one then, but am one of many.