Thank God for Evolution

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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Ierrellus » Sat Nov 23, 2019 3:31 pm

duplicate
Last edited by Ierrellus on Sat Nov 23, 2019 3:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aware-ness » Wed Nov 27, 2019 4:17 am

I don't want to diminish "The Greatest Story Ever Told." I think deep time and deep space, and the evolution of it is a great way of looking at our development, and that of the universe, both present and future (evolution is not done) ; a great 'world view,' if you will. But I'm not sure about personifying it.

I'm not sure about imbuing it with personhood like that of the evangelical belief in a personal God. And, unlike Michael Dowd, I don't think I can worship it ... again, like evangelicals and others worship Yahweh.

However, Dowd does consider that his gospel of evolution reveals "Ultimate Reality." Reality is God, to hear Dowd tell it. And worship of that God is to honor it to such an extent that we align ourselves to Reality.

It does sound like that would produce the best mental health possible ; if our brain chemistry doesn't work against it, producing delusion, or misalignment to Reality.

So maybe I can have a type of worship toward Realty, if that means aligning with it. And maybe it helps to personify it.

I don't know. I'm new to all of this. I don't even know what Ultimate Reality is.
"The religion that is afraid of science dishonors God." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby felix dakat » Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:24 pm

From my point of view ultimate reality is inferable intuitively but unknowable as it is in itself. It is the object of philosophical faith although some like Rorty reject the intuition as illusory.

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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby phoneutria » Fri Dec 06, 2019 8:09 pm

I too just got a thesaurus. Dunno how to use it yet tho.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby promethean75 » Fri Dec 06, 2019 10:42 pm

Yeah right. Dinosaurs have been extinct for millions of years, dumbass.

Let me guess, it's like a stegosaurus or a brontosaurus, right? Fuck outta here.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aegean » Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:26 pm

I think she meant dick-tionary.
She got it, but doesn't know how to use it.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Sat Dec 07, 2019 12:14 am

Omg... Aegean...
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby phoneutria » Sat Dec 07, 2019 10:07 pm

It's a good thing we named most of the dinosaurs like a hundred years ago when all we were into was mythology and speaking Latin, if they just learned about dinosaurs now and had to name 100s there'd be a Heckin Chonkosaurus and a Northern Thicc Scaleyboy

Yeah I stole that, eat me.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Sat Dec 07, 2019 10:27 pm

Worse.

They would be called frook and quinor. That's even too flattering.

Clooc. Swarn. Bitor.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Sat Dec 07, 2019 10:28 pm

Lol those are actually good names.

Listen I can't do it.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aware-ness » Fri Dec 13, 2019 6:43 pm

Creatheism
“We have all heard some
fundamentalist-minded person say
something like, ‘Don’t tell me I’m
related to monkeys.’
The fact of the matter is that now
that we have discovered DNA and
its code, we know that we are not
only related to monkeys, we are
related to zucchini. So let’s get over it.”

—MARLIN LAVANHAR

Hey everybody. Sorry for being absent for awhile ; heath issues.

First off I'm a newbie out here. I'm just beginning to get my see (sic) legs.

I feel to admit that I'm drawn to Thank God for Evolution because I identify with the author's life journey. We both were 'born-againers.' We have that in common. And we both left it behind but can't get it out of our system. After all -- as Dowd has it, now that he's a evangelist of evolution -- that we're in the middle of a so far 13.8 billion process of evolution, evolution has brought us to here, and is continuing when we -- the royal we at present -- are long gone.

In short, Dowd does claim that we evolved from early life forms, like reptiles, apes and such (simplifying), even earlier of course, so evolution has left those inborn natures lingering within us ; such as, the basics : "Eat, Survive, Reproduce." But those natures and instincts were for challenges back then, don't fit well today, and give us problems and challenges in our modern age (and maybe is why we live in a postmodern age -- produced by those inborn natures, mixed with modernism ... IMHO.

Here Dowd speaks of what he likes to call, "The Monkey Mind" :

"Why does our “Monkey Mind” exhaust us with incessant chatter, and what can we do about it?

This part of our brain, the neocortex, could be called our chatterbox, calculator, or computer brain because it is incessantly talking to itself (fretting about the past and worrying about the future), performing rudimentary cost-benefit analyses, and computing the balance of favors and debts in each of Furry Li’l Mammal’s social relationships. Monkey Mind is the nickname I shall choose here, because that name is already in use by Buddhists, . . ."
Dowd, Michael. Thank God for Evolution (p. 16 and p. 150). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.


Taming Our Monkey Mind
How can we be guided by the divine within and around us, rather than distracted by our ceaselessly chattering Monkey Mind? How can we develop a habit of periodically silencing the thinking, interpreting, judging part of our brain so as to pay attention to the still small voice of the Holy One to whom we ultimately belong? The following two exercises are elegant means for quieting the rational, verbal part of the brain and thereby facilitating a state of joy and peace.
Dowd, Michael. Thank God for Evolution (p. 211). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.
"The religion that is afraid of science dishonors God." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aegean » Fri Dec 13, 2019 6:45 pm

I thank god for absolute order and Universal determinism.
Actually, that's redundant.
I thank the uni-verse for its absoluteness.

Saves me from myself.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aware-ness » Sun Dec 15, 2019 7:28 pm

Okay, thank God for evolution. But who do we thank for devolution? As Mark Twain quipped : "I don't believe in evolution. Man devolved. Into the lowest form of animal on the earth." - Paraphrased from memory.

What does Dowd do with that?
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby felix dakat » Tue Dec 17, 2019 2:09 am

Aware-ness wrote:Okay, thank God for evolution. But who do we thank for devolution? As Mark Twain quipped : "I don't believe in evolution. Man devolved. Into the lowest form of animal on the earth." - Paraphrased from memory.

What does Dowd do with that?


He'd have to somehow integrate two seemingly conflicting myths: i.e. that of the fall of man and that of human progress.

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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aware-ness » Fri Dec 20, 2019 5:48 pm

felix dakat wrote:
Aware-ness wrote:Okay, thank God for evolution. But who do we thank for devolution? As Mark Twain quipped : "I don't believe in evolution. Man devolved. Into the lowest form of animal on the earth." - Paraphrased from memory.

What does Dowd do with that?


He'd have to somehow integrate two seemingly conflicting myths: i.e. that of the fall of man and that of human progress.

But Dowd does do that. As to the lowest form of animal on the earth, Dowd does admit our animal ancestry. He names them :

    Furry Li’l Mammal
    Lizard Legacy
    Monkey Mind

According to Dowd, these are latent animal instincts within us, that give us challenges and troubles we have to deal with in life. He calls them "inherited proclivities." To Dowd these are what produced the notion of the fall, formed by people long in the past, that knew nothing of evolution from simple chemical reactions in the prebiotic soup, to animals and plants. So not knowing evolution they named these 'lower' animal instincts 'the fall.'

But Dowd contradicts Twain. To him man didn't devolve into the lowest form of animal on the earth, but into the highest form of animal on the earth.

So Dowd does "integrate two seemingly conflicting myths."
"The religion that is afraid of science dishonors God." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aware-ness » Sat Dec 28, 2019 5:56 pm

Dowd, apparently not able to let go of his Baptist indoctrination, now preaching to fellow Christians, about thanking God for evolution, blending evolutionary theory with Christian teachings and principles, writes in this book, of "day and night language."

Day language is :

"the realm of what’s so: the facts, the objectively real, that which is publicly and measurably true."
Dowd, Michael. Thank God for Evolution (p. 113). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.


Night language is :

"grand metaphors, poetry, and vibrant images. Our attention is focused on What does it mean? This side of our experience is subjectively real, like a nighttime dream, though not objectively real. Night language is personally or culturally meaningful. It nourishes us with spectacular images of emotional truth."
Dowd, Michael. Thank God for Evolution (pp. 113-114). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.


Dowd admits, in so many words, that, his target audience is those in Christendom. He passionately wants Christians to catch onto the deep time and deep space of what he considers "The Greatest Story Ever Told." Therefore he wants them to still cling to their night language/experience, of their religion and Bible, while embracing the day language/experience of facts and 13.8 billion years evolution.

Facts are God's native language, says Dowd. God is still revealing His truths today, with discoverings of the scientists, like He was in night language days, but now revealing them in day language.
"The religion that is afraid of science dishonors God." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
"Praying to an otherworldly God is like kissing thru glass." - Paul West
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Ierrellus » Sun Dec 29, 2019 2:28 pm

Almost finished reading Dowd's book. I find it a delight to read and for some time have been in full agreement with his findings on science and religion as being compatible. Great read, well written and thought out. Thanks for suggesting the work, Awareness.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby felix dakat » Sun Dec 29, 2019 7:14 pm

Aware-ness wrote:Dowd, apparently not able to let go of his Baptist indoctrination, now preaching to fellow Christians, about thanking God for evolution, blending evolutionary theory with Christian teachings and principles, writes in this book, of "day and night language."

Day language is :

"the realm of what’s so: the facts, the objectively real, that which is publicly and measurably true."
Dowd, Michael. Thank God for Evolution (p. 113). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.


Night language is :

"grand metaphors, poetry, and vibrant images. Our attention is focused on What does it mean? This side of our experience is subjectively real, like a nighttime dream, though not objectively real. Night language is personally or culturally meaningful. It nourishes us with spectacular images of emotional truth."
Dowd, Michael. Thank God for Evolution (pp. 113-114). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.


Dowd admits, in so many words, that, his target audience is those in Christendom. He passionately wants Christians to catch onto the deep time and deep space of what he considers "The Greatest Story Ever Told." Therefore he wants them to still cling to their night language/experience, of their religion and Bible, while embracing the day language/experience of facts and 13.8 billion years evolution.

Facts are God's native language, says Dowd. God is still revealing His truths today, with discoverings of the scientists, like He was in night language days, but now revealing them in day language.


Prehistoric evidence shows that the gods were there when humanity became self-conscious. When modernity banishes the gods it does so at the cost of the depth of the human soul.

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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aware-ness » Tue Dec 31, 2019 4:23 am

Ierrellus wrote:Almost finished reading Dowd's book. I find it a delight to read and for some time have been in full agreement with his findings on science and religion as being compatible. Great read, well written and thought out. Thanks for suggesting the work, Awareness.

Golly ... gee willikers (pun intended) ... I'll be darned ... someone out here read the book ... and enjoys it as much as I.

I think the title is attractive to some -- maybe magnetic -- intriguing to some, and downright stupid to some. And it's the latter Dowd wishes to reach ; those that think evolution is a hoax ; the Bible believers, that take it literal.

And judging by the Creation Museum here in Kentucky, also take The Flintstones literal, with pictures of humans riding dinosaurs.

Thanks Ierrellus ....
"The religion that is afraid of science dishonors God." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby promethean75 » Tue Dec 31, 2019 2:28 pm

When modernity banishes the gods it does so at the cost of the depf of the human soul.


https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/1 ... s-religion
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aware-ness » Wed Jan 01, 2020 4:38 am

promethean75 wrote:
When modernity banishes the gods it does so at the cost of the depf of the human soul.


https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/1 ... s-religion

Great quotes promethean75. Thanks.
Methinks Dowd would agree with Ludwig's anthropological materialism. To Dowd God is Reality, that is immanent in every tiny-weeny part of what she/he/it/they have produced, thru -- The Greatest Story ever Told -- of the evolution of the universe, up to the thoughts reading this page.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby Aware-ness » Wed Jan 01, 2020 4:16 pm

Dowd's targeted audience is the Biblically based young earth creationists -- otherwise known as young-earther's ; those that want no part of evolving, that are hanging onto what Dowd terms 'books written by "flat earthers."'

Still today, they seek to deny deep space and deep time, and hold that evolution is one of the greatest hoaxes ever imposed upon MANkind (not humankind).

But isn't their source/ancestry the same as everything else that exists today? Has evolution evolved anti-evolution resistance?

What we know about evolution is informed by the past, like archaeology, and anthropology. We know not where evolution is going. The dinosaurs went extinct. Is that the fate of the human species too?

Dowd, in his book -- Thank God for Evolution -- waxes rather preachy at times. In fact, entire sections of his book waxes preachy. It like he's trying to push evolution along, trying to transform the human race into a more fair and just society, seeking to transform our institutions, religions, and corporations.

But that might not be where evolution is going at all. The human race might need to become extinct, to make room for another more improved species, like humans replaced dinosaurs.

As a result, In his preaching, his efforts to improve humankind, Dowd might be trying to piss up a rope. Some things are just impossible ... without starting all over.
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Re: Thank God for Evolution

Postby felix dakat » Sat Jan 18, 2020 5:25 pm

Aware-ness wrote:Dowd's targeted audience is the Biblically based young earth creationists -- otherwise known as young-earther's ; those that want no part of evolving, that are hanging onto what Dowd terms 'books written by "flat earthers."'

Still today, they seek to deny deep space and deep time, and hold that evolution is one of the greatest hoaxes ever imposed upon MANkind (not humankind).

But isn't their source/ancestry the same as everything else that exists today? Has evolution evolved anti-evolution resistance?

What we know about evolution is informed by the past, like archaeology, and anthropology. We know not where evolution is going. The dinosaurs went extinct. Is that the fate of the human species too?

Dowd, in his book -- Thank God for Evolution -- waxes rather preachy at times. In fact, entire sections of his book waxes preachy. It like he's trying to push evolution along, trying to transform the human race into a more fair and just society, seeking to transform our institutions, religions, and corporations.

But that might not be where evolution is going at all. The human race might need to become extinct, to make room for another more improved species, like humans replaced dinosaurs.

As a result, In his preaching, his efforts to improve humankind, Dowd might be trying to piss up a rope. Some things are just impossible ... without starting all over.

The human species has brought the 6th great extinction on the planet. Without a radical change in direction, it looks like we will destroy ourselves. Saving ourselves and life on the planet would require an unprecedented level of global cooperation. Apocalyptical Christians expect divine intervention from above and sometimes use it on as an argument for doing nothing to save ourselves from global environmental disaster. Spiritually minded evolutionists have repeatedly hoped for and sometimes worked towards a rise in global environmental consciousness that will lead to effective world-wide action. We may have already passed the tipping point where we can't do anything about it. But despair which leads to doing nothing becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

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