The fact you say white people or white Europeans don’t have any culture shows it was a mistake thinking I could even talk to you as a rational adult. I won’t make that same mistake, enjoy this thread by yourself if you insist on being ignorant or irrational. I should of known better from the start.
Ignore this one Gloominary, he’s far too gone. Save your energy and don’t waste it on him.
He’s clearly a white self hating anti-white reject.
Gloominary: Kropotkin claims whites have no culture, cites rock and roll as an example.
K: yep and the reason is quite simple, that there is no such thing as a “white” culture,
society or science or technology…I am white and yet my mom who did one of those
ancestry DNA test came up with some surprises… we have a bit of Ashkenazi Jew in
us as well as two separate African hits and some native American… but we are mostly
Irish-English…take a DNA test and you will find that you are not white… you are a mixture
of a vast number of people… there is no such thing as a “white” culture because there
is no such thing as a “white” people… and in the beginning, in the beginning we all
came from Africa… every single human being on planet earth comes from Africa…
the Germans and their very proud Aryan heritage has some serious cracks in it…
as Germany was run over time after time after time by tribes from as far away
as Persia and Mongolia… there is no such thing as pure Aryan heritage… mix mongrels
at best…
you are taking pride in something that doesn’t exist…
G:
1stly, white music is more than popular music, it’s also folk and classical music.
2ndly, white popular music is more than rock, it’s also country, pop and electronic music.
3rdly, white artists like Bill Haley, Elvis Presley and Jerry Lee Lewis were arguably just as pivotal to rock’s formation as black artists like Chuck Berry.
4thly, black artists used instruments and technology like drum kits, electric guitars, pianos, amps , mics and recorded it on, records, instruments and technology invented by whites.
5thly, black artists were just as influenced by white music in general with its emphasis on chord progressions and harmony as they were by their own music with its emphasis on rhythm.
Finally, rock has evolved way beyond Chuck Berry e.g. prog rock, heavy metal, new wave, etcetera.
Rock is mostly a white thing.
K: Rock is mostly a white thing and what is “white”? you are simply wrong on the facts…
popular music like the Beatles who incorporated music from India like the Sitar
and Peter Gabriel and Paul Simon who has incorporated African music into their
songs… the basis of Rock music is the blues and that is descends from African
slave music… the very basis of Rock music is African music…
as for Elvis and Jerry lee Lewis and bill Haley… really, they were raised on
black music and gospels… read a biography of them… about Elvis for example,
Sam Phillips, the owner of Sun records where Elvis did his first recordings, said
“If I could find a white man who had the negro sound and the negro feel,
I could make a billion dollars” no black influence there :-" the very first hit of
Elvis was a 1946 blues remake…you are trying very hard to separate out
something that cannot be separated… music is based upon very diverse
styles and part of that diverse nature is the mixing of different styles…
G: Whites have their own music, just as we have our own everything, our own art, architecture, cinema, literature, fashion, cuisine, our own philosophy, religion and science (for me, science is partly cultural, I don’t see it as being this wholly objective, universal enterprise, for instance there’re scientific theories widely accepted by western scientists that’re widely rejected by Chinese and Indian scientists, but I digress), our own customs, history and values.
Of course we’ve been influenced by others, but in the last several centuries, who’s been doing the lion’s share of the influencing?
Whites invented the modern world, both materially, and culturally.
[/quote]
K: you are so wrong, I am not sure where to begin?..
ok, how about this, the beginning of the modern age came about when
the various text and manuscripts of the ancient Greeks and Romans
came back to the west from the Arabic world in the 11, 12 and 13 century…
we have a rebirth, a Renaissance of knowledge based upon these formerly
lost texts…from the Arabic world…
the building of the modern age comes from sources beyond some magical
thinking… much of the modern thinking comes from the travels
and adventures of those who travel the world… for example, much
philosophical thinking in the 16th and 17th century was about the
“noble savages” of the new world… which is found in much of Rousseau’s work
in the 18th century…the very existence of the American Indian created a
major rethinking into what it means to be human…
much of Darwin’s work involved the understanding of cultures outside of the
European world…much of science and philosophy and archeology and history
come from a understanding of the vast breath and width of ancient societies
like China and India and southeast Asia…but you do not take into effect the
existence of people like the greatest poet in Russian history… Alexander Pushkin…
what does an Russian writer like Pushkin have to do with your thesis Kropotkin?
Pushkin great grandfather came from Africa… Pushkin was part African…
this is the type of influence that rarely gets into the history books…
you cannot any type of case for white society or white culture because
it comes from somewhere else…
I would dig deeper into this but dinner calls my name…
Kropotkin
Hey Peter, does black people and black culture exist? Yes, or no? 
K: and I was wondering who would bring this old foolishness up first… just because
I dismiss your thesis, suddenly I am a “white self hating anti-white reject”
if any disagrees with you “white” types, that person is always a “self hating white”
you simply dismiss anyone who disagrees with you as “self hating”…I am clearly
not “self hating” (but I find it interesting that you always turn to hate first)
anyway, I am above such nonsense as nationalism and “white culture” it means
absolutely nothing…
nationalism and “white culture” has nothing to say about what it means to
be human… it is complete and udder nonsense to think we are simply separate
and distinct tribes… nationalism and “white culture” isn’t science and it isn’t
culture and it isn’t philosophical and it isn’t thinking…it is fear based emotions…
I am old and I have passed by your empty, shallow, narrow thinking decades ago…
I exist in the 21st century… your thinking is in the 19th century with its talk of
whites and nationalism and being fear base…you are dinosaurs…and the world
has already passed you by…you just don’t know it yet…I freely admit, I kinda feel
sorry for you… and off to bed…
Kropotkin
^^^ 
Of course they do.
Afro-Americans invented their culture ex nihilo, in vacuum or void, like God, whereas those soulless white devils had to appropriate theirs from everyone else. 
Same with DNA.
White people aren’t a race, we’re just albino Dravidians, or at least that’s what some unthinking, uneducated Afro-supremacists told me. 
Meatloaf: ‘ohhh peee-ete. I’ve got ketchup on me this time. You won’t regret it.’
Brussel sprouts: ‘shove off, meatloaf. Last time he completely ignored me because of you.’
Salad: ‘no, he ignored you because you’re BRUSSEL SPROUTS, dude. Nobody likes you… but keep blaming meatloaf if it makes you feel better.’
Meatloaf: ‘thanks, salad. He always does that when we’re together. Dude’s even got more issues than asparagus.’
Personal favorites and highlights of mine.
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7MaWyjio88[/youtube]
I took a DNA test from Ancestry, it came back 100% white, 50% Italian, 31% English and Welsh, 13% Irish and Scottish and 6% German.
I’m sure I’m not an anomaly.
That was tens if not hundreds of thousands of years ago.
We didn’t stop evolving after we left Africa.
Africans didn’t stop evolving either.
Modern Africans don’t have much, if anything more in common with paleolithic Africans than we do.
If it’s not absolutely white, it’s black right?
There’s specs of yellow, green and brown on red apples, does that make red apples not red?
You can find many genes all over the world, but some genes are much more common among the native populations of some regions of the world than others.
Some genes cooccur much more frequently with some genes than with others.
Tell that to the police officer when he asks you for the race of the man who robbed you.
The vast majority of rock doesn’t incorporate music directly from Africa or directly or indirectly from the rest of the 3rd world.
But the vast majority of modern 3rd world music incorporates 1st world music.
The basis of rock music is as much country as it is blues.
Did Africans develop blues in Africa some time in the 14th century, or was blues developed only after Africans came into contact with European instruments and compositions?
Elvis, Haley and Lewis were as influenced by country as they were by blues.
Rock began as a hybrid of black and white music, not wholly black as you maintain, but evolved into something mostly white.
There’s been few, if any black artists of note since Jimi Hendrix, and he wasn’t even black, he was part native.
Moreover, blacks aren’t even black, most blacks are mulattos, half black, half white, so really at most rock is 50% black, if not 75%, 87.5% or 93.75% white.
Greeks and Romans, again white.
Almost every artist, musician, thinker and inventor of note since the renaissance has been white.
Nearly every cultural, social, political, economic and technological revolution…
Savages had little to teach us, they inadvertently helped Rousseau and a few others to come up with some interesting thought experiments.
If observing criminals helps me better understand human nature, does that mean my insights were a product of their genius?
If observing apes helps me better understand primate nature, does that mean my insights were a product of ape genius?
No, they were a product of mine.
The savages, criminals and apes played a passive role in the philosophers’ insights, the philosophers’ played the active role.
To the philosophers belong the credit.
In any case, the vast majority of our revolutionary insights didn’t come from observing savages, they came from rediscovering European antiquity, turning inward, thinking about ourselves, our beliefs, thoughts, feelings and perceptions, our relationship with our fellow countrymen and the natural world, the civilization we lived in and imagining how it could be improved.
Did Asians invent constitutional monarchy, the republic and democracy?
Did they end serfdom and slavery?
And who’s idea was it to explore the entire globe, for that matter to explore the deep sea and outer space?
To examine all these cultures for insight, use what made sense and discard the rest?
But if anything the 3rd world, with all its barbarism and savagery, set a negative example
We learned how not to do things.
So much of European society came out of who we were, and what we dreamt of becoming, not aping Africans, native Americans or Asians.
The founding fathers of Canada, the US and Australia looked primarily to Athens, Rome and the UK for inspiration, not to Africa, the Americas or Asia.
thank you. So often one gets myth instead of reality that when reality is acknowledged it’s such a breath of fresh air.
For me, with the exception of healthcare, Obama was far right on economic, and foreign policy, and with the exception of the war-on-drugs, which he continued, far left on social policy.
Under Obama, the working and middle classes continued to get poorer, and foreigners, minorities and women continued to be propped up at the expense of citizens, the majority and men.
Republicrats aren’t right or left, they’re anti-populist and misandrist, the real opposition is populism and meninism.
K: if you ask that question, you still don’t get my point…
there is no such thing as “black” culture as there is no such thing
as “white” culture and no such thing as “Asian” culture…for two
reasons…
one there is no such thing as pure “white” or pure “black”
or pure say, “Chinese” for example… all human beings are genetically
within a 2% of each other… so what that means is genetically, we are
closer related to each other then the average Orangutan tribe in
Borneo… there is no white or black or Asian… there is only human
beings…in my family for example, I am the tallest one (and believe me,
I am not that tall) but everyone else is pretty short… does that difference
mean I am not related to my family… of course not…we have differences,
but the differences are minor, superficial… my wife and her sister are quite
different in the color of their skins… her sister is quite dark and my wife is
pretty white…if you look at them superficially, you might not realize that
they are sisters…but they are…which leads us to the second point…
which is you see the minor, superficial difference between people and
think that they are profound, deep differences between human beings…
and there is not profound, deep differences between human beings, either
physically or in their needs…you think there is some huge gulf between
people, be it in their superficial skin color to that imaginary line which
defines Americans from Mexicans…and there isn’t any deep divide between
people…
we are not black or white or Asian or American’s or British or French or
of some white culture or of a black culture… we are first and foremost,
human beings…I see that which unites people, you see that which divides
people…one might say, I am an American but the reality is that
the idea of being American is artificial… it is simply a line in the sand
which can and has changed in the past…the concept of nationality is
an artificial one… it really means nothing… be born on one side of
an artificial line and you are an American and be born on the other side and
you are Mexican…or be born on one side of this artificial line and you are born
French and on the other side, you are German…an artificial line that
you can’t see or hear or touch or taste or smell…nationalism is a made
up, artificial thing that doesn’t exists…a lie or a myth we tell our children…
it really is an identification thing… my family came from here…people like
to know those sort of things… but it doesn’t define who we are nor does
it tell us who we are…it is just a place my family came from…
and it is nothing more…
we human beings focus on the things that divide us instead of
focusing on the things that unite us, which quite frankly is far
more then what divides us…
you focus on this mythical thing call culture and think that
there is a white culture and a black culture and I say this,
there is only a human culture… black, white, Asian, they are
unimportant signs of where we came from instead of the important
matter of who we are and who we might be………culture is not
an isolated, independent thing… it is us… culture is about us,
not as an minor thing as being Americans or being white, but
culture is about what it means to be a human being…
and culture draws it inspiration from all kinds of sources,
sources that are independent of race, color, nationality…
the works of Mozart aren’t just White European music, it
is human music… written by a human being who happened
to be white and European…I can listen to music from India
and music from Africa and music from South America and enjoy it
not because I am white or an American but because I am a human being…
and culture is about what makes us human beings, not white or American
or European…
revel in what divides us, but you are alienated from what unites us…
and what unites us is far greater then what divides us……
Kropotkin
So you’re a naive idealist and humanist then.
Whether you like it or not a majority of other people around the world view things like historical culture and race as being real things. You sitting here saying it isn’t real or doesn’t exist accomplishes nothing.
Every time some asshole claims blacks invented rock’n’roll I calmly point out who invented the mandolin.
Truthfully Roman civilization collapsed because of the importation of slaves where there were more slaves than actual Roman aristocrats and Roman citizens themselves which caused civil unrest along with bankrupting the entire empire trying to conquer the rest of the known world at the time.
In some ways it’s much like the United States today where the American working class has become the new slaves but because today’s modern culture is all about illusion, false appearances, facades, and denial the political establishment bypasses modern slavery saying everybody is ‘free’ even though for many people freedom means nothing at all. If only the Romans back then could master political propaganda like the extent we have today when they went around enslaving others gleefully looking down upon them and saying, “You’re not slaves, you are free people!”
The United States today would make the ancient Roman blush if they could see how things are done now, we go around bombing other countries, organizing political coups, and overthrowing governments around the world. When their nations or societies collapse we tell them how great Americanism, democracy, and freedom is getting them to immigrate to the United States in mass right after we’ve destroyed their nation of origin so they can work at Wal-Mart for $8.25 an hour upon arrival through a local temp agency. That’s how Americanism, American freedom, and American democracy really works.
The Roman empire existed purely on utilizing slaves through foreign immigration along with enslaving its own domestic citizens through military imperialism or expansion and the modern United States is practically the same.
I will always remember Obama as the president that financially bailed out banks or corporations on Wallstreet at everybody’s expense and a president who claimed to have created a post-racial United States where only instead it backfired causing everyone to become even more racist especially since the radical left went around savagely attacking white people every chance they could get. [Especially white men.]
Finally, I’ll remember the Obama administration for the nine years straight I was homeless off and on. [More homeless than not.]
Peter and many neo-liberals will say race, ethnicity, or culture isn’t real yet every chance they get through their various demagogues will have no problem attacking white people along with white identity.
Race, culture, ethnicity, and identity isn’t real so much so that they have to attack or single out an entire group [race] of people every chance they can get.
They’ll say everybody is equal and yet through affirmative action laws have no problem discriminating against white people in terms of jobs, careers, and schooling. Well, which is it Peter, is race real or not real?
You can’t have it both ways. In short, neo-liberals make up some of the most asinine political hypocrites that have ever existed.
