Mad Man P wrote:
I do not recall doing this. Can anyone point out where I brought up the idea of “punishment,” or where I discounted the desire we have to see justice done when we witness ethical violations, or blatant disregard of what we consider to be valued norms - whether they are cultural norms (traditions) or institutional norms.
What I did imply is that vengeance reminds us of the Hatfields and McCoys with their endless feuding. Sure, it will reduce the population, but is it ethical to murder? Not in the Hartman/Katz system of Ethics. No way.
To commit violence is to harm, and Ethics deduces that minimizing harm is the way to go. If we want to maximize the value we get out of our time on Earth and/or if we want to see the advent of an ethical society in this world, one in which it would be a joy to inhabit, then we would aim to reduce suffering, including the pain which violence inflicts. To explain it more directly, to be ethical is to be kind, helpful, act decently, be responsible, be willing and ready to be held accountable, be compassionate, empathic, etc.
In ancient India - and there evidently are traces of this sentiment still today - if someone violated a man’s daughter, they buried the accused in the ground with only his head showing. Or they buried someone alive. They believed this vengeance to be just.
I, for one, am glad humanity has evolved from that stage; today in India that practice is, for the most part, frowned upon and refected.
I would like to ask Mad Man to define for us the notion “deserves.” It would be a fine contribution to Ethics to hear a rational analysis of how people [who he tells us are very influenced by rewards and what Skinner called ‘negative reinforcement,’ namely punishment] – how they "deserve" what they may get, if their behavior is determined by earlier conditioning (by positive or negative reinforcement
Up till recently, Promethian held that Skinner’s analysis is correct: we are just products of our conditioning. Thus how can an individual be held responsible for any crime he or she commits?! {This is also similar to the “I am a victim, Your Honer, of the bad childhood I was subject to !!” defense.}
Earlier I asked Readers what they are interested in, in the field of ethics. That inquiry still stands. We know that at least two care deeply about the inadequacy of our current system of justice. In contrast, what I was doing in the initial post is suggesting what an Ethical system of Justice would be.
Any comments or observations about any other aspect of Applied Ethics?