How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

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How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Sun Jun 02, 2019 7:37 am

For 55 years I have been thinking about how to construct better ethical theories than those with which we are familiar. By themselves, the conventional standard theories do not seem to me to have done the job. Yes, they make you think, but do they result in more ethical people? A good Ethical theory should change lives, in my humble opinion.

During this time of reflection I also did some research and, as a result have come up with this:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf

or, if you wish to see a preview first, read the first three pages here: https://tinyurl.com/yd6wafvm then continue on by scrolling down further.
Check it out and let me know what you think. Did I succeed in the project of creating a better ethical theory

Can you offer an ethical theory that is superior to the one linked to above, and tell us why it is superior? I am curious to study your alternative.
You may wish to print out the document (at the above link) before you read it. Their might be something in this essay that you can use in class. If you are a student, you can teach it to the professor. If you are a mentor, or a coach, or are an instructor, you can teach it to your students.


For brief selections that offer applications - resolutions for which you can deduce from this theory, namely from the Unified Theory of Ethics, presented in the Structure booklet - see the links given in the Bibliography of The Structure of Ethics. Also, for further ideas and applications, see this paperback reader: Modern Ethics in 77 Arguments.

Your views?
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:27 am

Do check out this video on the topic referred to in THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS book as "Ethical technologies." These are technologies that make life easier and less ruthless; they remove some of the incentive for doing bad, unethical things; and/or they transform life as we know it today. Here is a link to the talk by Dr. Peter Diamandis, (the author of ABUNDANCE - - a tiny but profound book everyone should read.) See this video:


https://www.diamandis.com/peters-keynotes#

Enjoy this enlightening video!

Tell us what you think about all this. Do you agree that education may be quite different in the years to come -- as AI, virtual reality, networking, computer printing and disign, etc., are incorporated into schooling?
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby surreptitious75 » Wed Jun 05, 2019 9:11 am

Microchips / nano technology containing specific types of knowledge / information for everyone is the most obvious difference I can imagine
So instead of machines like computers and phones being external and independent of us they will be part of us but significantly scaled down
A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Wed Jun 05, 2019 9:16 pm

Greetings, surreptitious75

I think you're on to something there!

Thanks for contributing to the discussion.

BTW, did you read the book?
What is your opinion of the new paradigm for ethics?
Do you believe the proposed theory is adequate to handle most of the issues that may arise in the general field of Ethics? {If not, what theory is?}
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Sat Jun 08, 2019 2:47 am

Taking a poll:

If you agree that it would be good to have a series of Ethics Teaching and Research Institutes across the United States, or across your country, vote : Yes.

If not, vote No.


My argument for it: People need to be able to recognize a cunning faker, or con-artist, the instant they see him, or hear him. If someone encourages a chant to jail his opponents - recall: "lock her up!"- does that not give him away as a potential despot, or authoritarian ruler? Wouldn't people who know their values and ethics immediately recognize him for what he is? If so, wouldn't they vow (to themselves) never to vote such a cunning rascal into a position of power? If folks knew their Ethics, they would detect such a conniver the moment he came upon the scene!!

Which way would you vote?
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby phyllo » Sat Jun 08, 2019 1:52 pm

My argument for it: People need to be able to recognize a cunning faker, or con-artist, the instant they see him, or hear him. If someone encourages a chant to jail his opponents - recall: "lock her up!"- does that not give him away as a potential despot, or authoritarian ruler? Wouldn't people who know their values and ethics immediately recognize him for what he is? If so, wouldn't they vow (to themselves) never to vote such a cunning rascal into a position of power? If folks knew their Ethics, they would detect such a conniver the moment he came upon the scene!!
Maybe political candidates ought to be required to pass an ethics test before running for office.

After all, what's the value in being able to detect a "cunning rascal" if all the candidates on the ballot have one issue or another.
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby phyllo » Sat Jun 08, 2019 2:07 pm

Then there is the issue that an unethical leader may have an advantage over the ethical leaders of other countries/states. So he/she may be "good" for the citizens in terms of foreign policy.

That's why there is a disproportionate number of psychopaths running successful corporations.
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Sat Jun 08, 2019 8:38 pm

Greetings, phyllo

What ethics test would you propose?

Here is an excerpt from my treatise, THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS, from p. 47:

According to Political Science, where it overlaps with Ethics, an administration (or government) is good if it makes the lives of the vast majority of its citizens better than before; that is to say, if it provides opportunity for advancement in life-quality. People don't just want to "make a living"; they want to make a life ....a Quality Life


Our foreign policy ought to be to encourage and to spread democracy and human rights. Also encourage the meme that we are all one human family, with the same basic needs. Why not urge a Quality Life for everyone alive?! The book, THE STRUCTURE, explains the components of a Quality Life. It goes into detail as to the meaning of "well-being." In addition, it cites references that discuss how to achieve economic security

For now, I will make this observation:

A good economic system creates wealth.
A bad economic system gives rise to poverty; and permits abject poverty to exist.
Moral value has primacy over economic value. The lack of morality leads to impoverishment. [As to a definition of, and an analysis of the concept "morality" see Chapter Three of the book -- the first link in the signature below.]
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Sat Jun 08, 2019 8:47 pm

Greetings, phyllo

What ethics test would you propose? Maybe for each candidate to volunteer to tsake The Hartman Value Inventory would be a good idea.

Here is an excerpt from my treatise, THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS, from p. 47:
According to Political Science, where it overlaps with Ethics, an administration (or government) is good if it makes the lives of the vast majority of its citizens better than before; that is to say, if it provides opportunity for advancement in life-quality. People don't just want to "make a living"; they want to make a life ....a Quality Life


Our foreign policy ought to be to encourage and to spread democracy and human rights. Also encourage the meme that we are all one human family, with the same basic needs. Why not urge a Quality Life for everyone alive?! The book, THE STRUCTURE, explains the components of a Quality Life. It goes into detail as to the meaning of "well-being." In addition, it cites references that discuss how to achieve economic security

For now, I will make this observation:

A good economic system creates wealth.
A bad economic system gives rise to poverty; and permits abject poverty to exist.
Moral value has primacy over economic value. The lack of morality leads to impoverishment. [As to a definition of, and an analysis of the concept "morality" see Chapter Three of the book -- the first link in the signature below.]
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Sun Jun 09, 2019 2:47 am

It may be helpful for everyone to recall what the Unified Theory of Ethics taught earlier: means need to be compatible with ends (with the goals in view.) If the goal is life, and its enhancement, then the means used to get to it ought to be life-enhancing, or health-giving.

The opposite of this is to have a fine-sounding noble end in mind, such as freedom or democracy, or choice, or liberation, and to employ violent, or other morally-questionable, means to reach that end. Torture will not get us worthwhile information. War will not attain for us a peaceful life nor a stable world. Disparagement, insults, or threats will not advance trust and good-will.

What say you?
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:05 pm

Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:57 pm

With regard to the topic of this thread, the following excerpt from pp. 39-40 of Katz - ETHICAL EXPLORATIONS (quoted with permission) may be of relevance. So let’s here consider what makes an ethical theory “a better theory”:

WHAT CRITERIA SHOULD A THEORY FULFILL?
Some contend that this current paradigm we are constructing here is a better theory– and specifically a better ethical theory- than some of the alternatives because:

1) it contains variables in its axioms and may thus cover a wider range of applications than any of the rival theories when these variables are interpreted in terms of specific situations and events

2) it provides a frame-of-reference to which more sub-models cancohere;

3) this paradigm is a synthesis of the prevailing conventional schools of thought that the academy teaches, with its stress on character, happiness; human dignity, universality, obligations, sanctions, conscience, varied phenomenological perspectives, etc., etc.

4) it has a logical thread of reasoning which binds the systemtogether. Recall that discussion in Ethical Adventures;

5) it has already been applied to a wide range of concrete issues andhas provided some sensible, tentative answers;

6) it is compatible with the many and varied forms of The GoldenRule; See http://www.religioustolerance.org/reciproc3.htm and http://www / jcu.edu/philosophy gensler/goldrule htm

7) it incorporates principles such asthe avoidance of causing suffering; natural rights based upon human nature; cultural evolution; avoidance of double standards, etc.,etc.

8 ) it has a calculus of values which enables deductions of new principles;

9) Its definition of the term "Intrinsic Value” overlaps with and confirms Phenomenology's conception of Intentionality.

10) It manages to define "good" in a manner that avoids committing The Naturalistic Fallacy propounded by G. E. Moore since the Axiom of Value– which defines “good”--employs set theory and class membership: thus good is not defined in terms of pleasure, preference; feelings, evolution, satisfaction, realization, nor any other naturalistic quality; thus it passes The Open Question Test;

11) it derives a series of 'ethical fallacies' and shows why they are errors in reasoning

12) it is expandable and has what philosopher-of-science C. G. Hempel speaks of as 'theoretical and empirical import';

13) it can embrace multi-cultural schools of ethical thought such as Shinto ethics, Confucianism, Buddhist ethics, Taoist ethics, etc., which the major academic theories cannot comfortably do;

14) it has a theory of justice, of authenticity, of ethical evolution, of moral corruption, and is able to explain things that the other schools cannot;
15) it is able to define exactly what "Ethics" is as a study in its own right; it also defines with some precision "morality" and "hypocrisy"and shows how they vary inversely;

16) it applies to business and management and shares a common premise with the prevailing principle that drives enterprises, namely: to add value.

17) The meta-ethics for this theory is able to offer a precise definition for key terms such as 'better,' 'appreciation,' 'bad,' 'fair,' 'ought', 'approval' etc, No other theory so far accomplishes this.For example the definition of better in the meta-ethics is this:
X is better than Y” if and only if– all else being equal– X has more features than Y. Hence X is richer in meaning than Y is. (If, say, X refers to an appliance, one of the features may be ‘simplicity of use.’)If the concept is shifted to make it more specific, then the issue of weighting comes into play: the more specific and concrete the concept, the more valuable it is, the more it‘weighs.’ We must be careful not to unintentionally shift the concept to a lower level of abstraction: A‘ball’ is, say, Y; but a ‘beach ball’ is Y1. A better theory will have more predicates in its meaning since it applies to a wider range of data.

.Based upon reason, a reader or participant at this Forum on Philosophy - whether a student or a professional - will be able to decide which theory she/he wants to embrace. Each person may choose for himself. He/she may decide he wants the one that has more features relevant to the field,and thus complies with the definition of "a better theory"


Comments?
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:31 pm

Here, vor your consideration, is an excerpt from the booklet, THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS. I would like to hear of your impressions of these concepts, so please respond. Here is the quotation from the writing:

Once one knows his ethics he is okay with caring, sharing, and cooperating.

Note that there is a definition of "ethics" and a basic assumption of "ethics. Let’s speak of the latter as an “axiom.” All the rest of the theory and all the applications follow from these: the definition and the axiom! The definition of ethics is a perspective we have, a way of regarding an individual, or a group of individuals. It is this: when you view an individual as of uncountably-high value, you are in the field of Ethics, you are being ethical.

The 'Axiom of Ethics' is this: Make things morally better! It also can be stated: An ethical individual tends to support, and approve of, making things morally better. In this first principle (the Axiom) the word “morally” indicates that we are to make things better for people.

Being ethical often results in creating value in your encounters with another individual -- creating a win/win outcome.
One would likely do this if one cares; and one will care, once one regards that other person as highly-valuable. People will tend to value other individuals this way by becoming aware of, and comprehending, the very definition of "Ethics" itself.
This very-basic concept may be understood as follows:Ethics arises when one Intrinsically values an individual or a group of them.


{For more details, and further explanations, click the first link below.}


Your views??
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:05 pm

Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby promethean75 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:29 pm

duddint look like any of these folks are interested, doc. you gotta understand, studies in ethics aren't a high priority unless one finds themselves in a peculiar moral situation in which their regular understanding of 'what to do' is suddenly challenged. well, this is usually not the case for most folks. sometimes something as simple as the ten commandments suffices to navigate them through their daily lives. i mean when was the last time you knew someone who was actually faced with something like the trolly problem? if you find yourself faced with some shit like that, then it's time to break out the philosophy books. but these folks... these folks wouldn't live a lick differently if they hadn't even ever heard of the philosophy of ethics. threads like this are for 'theorizing', but none of it is ever applicable in real life... simply because most folks don't need to examine their morality any closer than they did when they were fifteen years old. simple moralities for simple people with simple lives. i mean seriously, does it ever get more complicated than this for most people: don't kill, don't steal, don't trespass, and don't assault. you don't need kant of mill to find your way around here, ya know?
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:38 am

promethean75 wrote: i mean seriously, does it ever get more complicated than this for most people: don't kill, don't steal, don't trespass, and don't assault. you don't need kant of mill to find your way around here, ya know?


All these "don't"s you mention are ways of doing harm. They add up to a principle: don't hurt anyone! A more-positive way of stating this is: "Treat others as though they are highly-valuable; an individual, having individuality, has value! I appreciate that; and I want to create more value - so that I may maximize the value in my life."

"Therefore, I'll be ready to cooperate with those I encounter on ethical goals, and I'll be fussy about the means I use to reach those goals. They must be ethical; and non-harming.

Also, I'll be ready to serve, to share, to boost someone up, to help others have more opportunities, ready to build a better world."

"I want to make things better."

Those are all ways of being ethical. ...which is the same as having good human-relations.

So I think folks do care! They will enjoy harmony when they can attain it. So let's all work for it. Let's find what we can agree on, and build on that. Increase that area of agreement and consensus. Let's work for a better world.

What say you?
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby promethean75 » Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:08 am

they already tried this. it didn't work.
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:17 am

promethean75 wrote:they already tried this. it didn't work.


When and where did they try this, promethean, and what is the "this" to which you refer?

Can you provide us more details?


Also I would add this vision to the discussion:

Once knowledge of Ethics spreads around, boosting up one another will replace put-downs. Optimism will replace pessimism. The spirit of "Yes we can" will replace views such as: "It's impossible; it can't be done; forget it, there is no way."

What Lincoln referred to as "the angels of our better nature" are emerging as we evolve as human beings. Each generation is becoming smarter and has better values, on the whole, than the previous one. There is more volunteering, more altruism, more acts of kindness - as reported in Yes Magazine http://www.yesmagazine.org
Ethics is catching on! This is happening now

With regard to the goal of becoming a more-ideal person, note that we have to first want that goal with firm determination. But if we know keenly before our minds the benefits that ensue, we will be glad to set a specific goal of self-improvement for ourselves, we will go after it, we will pursue the goal.

The ultimate goal for most people once they have attained sufficient understanding will be to provide a Quality Life for one and all.
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:05 pm

Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:28 am

promethean75 wrote: threads like this are for 'theorizing', but none of it is ever applicable in real life... simply because most folks don't need to examine their morality any closer than they did when they were fifteen years old. simple moralities for simple people with simple lives?


Respectfully, promethean, I hold that people do need to "examine their morality" more-closely "than they did when they were fifteen years old."
As I look around, I see that people do need to be educated in Ethics, do need to be keenly aware of how easily they may slip into corruption, and rationalize it to themselves. They don't need to be only a financial officer, or an accountant, to chase after money, and maybe "cut a few corners" in doing so.

It would benefit us all if some rich dude set up a series of Ethics Teaching & Research Institutes across the nation. The findings of this research ought to be broadcast to a wide audience, until it is the conventional wisdom. The system presented as the Hartman/Katz Unified Theory of Ethics certainly is applicable in real life! {However, it is not about me. I'll be glad to stay out of it, and have you, or anyone else, do it.}

When you say: "It has been tried and failed." are you saying that the Coca-Cola Co. has gone out of business? What you offered as evidence was a commercial for Coke, the drink.
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Tue Jun 18, 2019 5:52 am

:idea: Those who have a good character tend to do 'the right thing.' That is, they create value when encountering another individual.

Thus, having a good character often results in good actions.

Does anyone disagree with that proposition?

Intuitionists will claim that those people who produce good actions do it because of their moral intuition.

Consequentialists may argue that what was produced are good consequences and so these people - the ones with a good character - are ethical since they backed policies which enhanced the general welfare, the common good.

Deontologists examining these actions would explain that the person was doing something that could be generalized, such that if everyone did that sort of thing (no harm would result, and it would even tend toward a better world.) The good actions would not result in a contradiction or impasse. So it's okay to do them.

To me, it all goes back to having a good character. That means: one would have a high degree of morality; and that involves living up more-and-more approximately to (practicing in action) moral principles, AND continuously, throughout life, adding more of these moral principles with which one abides.

Hence, by the standards of the Unified Theory of Ethics, it is not enough to show kindness; one also has to be growing morally.

Details are to be found in the references linked to in the signature below.

Which chapter in this little booklet entitled Ethical Explorations was most interesting, or meaningful to you? See http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICA ... ONS%20.pdf


Comments? Questions? Discussion? :)
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:34 am

promethean75 wrote:duddint look like any of these folks are interested, doc. you gotta understand, studies in ethics aren't a high priority unless one finds themselves in a peculiar moral situation in which their regular understanding of 'what to do' is suddenly challenged. well, this is usually not the case for most folks. sometimes something as simple as the ten commandments suffices to navigate them through their daily lives.


Yes. How well is that working as you look around at the state of affairs? Are people really on guard, highly aware, not to become corrupt? Are they concerned about some urgent and vitally-important issues such as the climate crisis; such as how to live healthily by learning of the ingredients that make for excellent health; or civics (how to support and sustain our fragile democracy)?

"To become corrupt" is to pursue money at the expense of caring about higher values than money -- it is to make 'a god' out of money. Ethics teaches us that we are to give positive regard to individuals who have individuality, and to make sure that we ]are enhancing their lives; and going out of our way to not harm anyone.

You refer to "something as simple as the ten commandments..." I take that as symbolic of all ethics taught by religions through the ages, and I ask: How well is that working? How effective is that religious teaching?

Are people able to recognize a thoroughly-unethical candidate for public office -- let alone for the highest office in the land? Did they detect the phoniness, the cunning, the hollowness, the bluster, the authoritarian personality of Benedict Donald?
Or did some in rural areas of Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Michigan fall for the pitch of the carnival barker, the con-artist, the constant liar? Did the ordinary people you speak of detect how self-defeating it would be to endow that party with power - the power to initiate World War III - a planetary-wide holocaust. {Do they know how easily World War I started?} {Do they believe it is okay to send an armed drone to hover over someone else's nation, and that shooting it down is an "act of aggression" against us?! DJT would have you believe this.]

Do they know today that we are today in the USA herding 30 people into cages meant to hold 8, so that they can't even sit down - just as occurred at Dachau ...another concentration camp. The man in charge is dangerous. He violates every ethical and civic norm !! Are people aware of this??

To all participants at this Forum: What are your views?

Do we need a new secular Ethics, or are the traditional ones working just fine?
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
Thinker
 
Posts: 617
Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:05 pm

Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Sat Jun 22, 2019 1:04 am

,

You may want to watch this galactically-important video entitled ICE ON FIRE. It is free on HBO.com/free movies. It is on the topic of the Climate Crisis.:

https://www.hbo.com/documentaries/ice-on-fire

The video suggests many solutions to the problem. Become more aware about it. That video is so profound, yet it explains things very clearly, things that most people are not aware of. The above link is to the trailer rather than to the movie itself. In previous posts I have referred to the Crisis, the human attack on our planet often spoken of merely as "Climate Change." Solving this problem should be our top priority :!:

What do you think?
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby promethean75 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 4:02 pm

Are people able to recognize a thoroughly-unethical candidate for public office -- let alone for the highest office in the land? Did they detect the phoniness, the cunning, the hollowness, the bluster, the authoritarian personality of Benedict Donald?
Or did some in rural areas of Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Michigan fall for the pitch of the carnival barker, the con-artist, the constant liar? Did the ordinary people you speak of detect how self-defeating it would be to endow that party with power - the power to initiate World War III - a planetary-wide holocaust. {Do they know how easily World War I started?} {Do they believe it is okay to send an armed drone to hover over someone else's nation, and that shooting it down is an "act of aggression" against us?! DJT would have you believe this.]


but see that's the thing. even this can be justified and defended as somehow morally necessary through some political narrative precisely because there is no rational foundation to morality such that principles and acts can be explicitly called 'right' or 'wrong'. in fact, moral statements themselves are entirely devoid of propositional content and express nothing more than personal preference. so nothing more can be said about donald chump's actions and/or disposition other than 'yay trump' or 'boo trump' or 'meh trump'.

when you say 'what trump did was wrong', what do you mean? what does 'wrong' mean, here? is it some quality of a thing in the world, like the shape of an object or the nature of a mathematical fact? show me 'wrongness'. or do you simply mean 'i'd rather trump not do that'? if so, that's fine, but to say what he did was 'wrong' does not yield a contradiction like saying a square object is circular or five plus five equals eleven. it therefore cannot be a 'fact' that what trump did was wrong in the same way other truths in the world are facts. sure, it's a fact that you disapprove of trump, but this disapproval is just an attitude, a value judgement, and values fly like doves from our feet (paraphrasing sartre).

if you want me to join the battle you have to change the objective, because i refuse to fight an imaginary war of good and evil. i would help you dispose of donald chump because he's a liar, a weakling, a slob, a parasite, a dolt, but not because he is 'bad' or 'wrong'. ya can't over-analyze shit like this. you gotta go with your gut, bro. shoot first and ask philosophical questions later.

you're trying to fight fire with water, see; you want to produce a complicated argument from indignation that there is 'right' and 'wrong' and that trump is on the side of the 'wrong'. that'll never work. you gotta overpower him. you gotta become more evil than him. forget this stuff about the 'righteous vs. the unrighteous'. the mother of all conflicts throughout the history of man has always been material and economic... certainly not ethical. the ethical is a derivative of the material. fix the material relations, the ethical will follow. and the battle hitherto that has been the source of the ethical conflicts throughout is the battle over wealth... more precisely, 'rights' concerning the ownership of labor force and its product.

you fix that, and watch how fast all these conflicts you want to solve with philosophy start dropping off like flies. these frickin' philosophers want to over-complicate the matter and shoot too wide of the target. i mean it's complicated, but not in the way most of them think it is.
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Sun Jun 23, 2019 7:03 am

promethean75 wrote:
Are people able to recognize a thoroughly-unethical candidate for public office -- let alone for the highest office in the land? Did they detect the phoniness, the cunning, the hollowness, the bluster, the authoritarian personality of Benedict Donald?
Or did some .... fall for the pitch of the carnival barker, the con-artist, the constant liar? Did the ordinary people you speak of detect how self-defeating it would be to endow that party with power - the power to initiate World War III - a planetary-wide disaster. {Do they know how easily World War I started?} {Do they believe it is okay to send a drone to hover over, or rather near, someone else's nation, and that shooting it down is an "act of aggression" against us?! DJT would have you believe this.]


when you say 'what trump did was wrong', what do you mean? what does 'wrong' mean, here? is it some quality of a thing in the world, like the shape of an object or the nature of a mathematical fact?

Man, if you really wanted to know, as the serious philosopher I believe you are, you would have read the early pages of Katz, Ethics: A college Course, and/or read up on the early pages of Katz, Basic Ethics, and studied Formal Axiology. as is presented so well in R. S. Hartman, THE STRUCTURE OF VALUE. Here are links to those references:

http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/ ... Course.pdf

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

https://books.google.com/books/about/Th ... 1WuAAACAAJ

promethean75 wrote:...i would help you dispose of donald chump because he's a liar, a weakling, a slob, a parasite, a dolt, but not because he is 'bad'
.

As you know from reading my works, I would never speak of a person as being "evill," but are you saying to the readers of this Forum that it is not bad for one to have these characteristics or to be like this: a liar, a weakling, a slob, a parasite, a dolt, or are you saying those traits are not bad? They're okay. ...or even better than okay. :?:
:shock:
As to the rigorous definitions of "good" and "bad," Mark explained these way back in 2010, on pp. 19-20; and as Ida elucidated on pp. 24-25, in this essay:
M. C. Katz - A UNIFIED THEORY OF ETHICS
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/A%20UNI ... ETHICS.pdf
A booklet written in dialogue form, which is the first of four parts.

He learned it, of course, from R.S. Hartman. This is also discussed in "The Science of Value" entry in Wikipedia (which I composed.)

As preliminary contextual definitions,here are a couple:
It is right to be good and to do good. It is wrong to be bad and to do bad.
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:05 pm

Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby thinkdr » Sun Jun 23, 2019 10:44 pm

promethean75 wrote:
...there is no rational foundation to morality such that principles and acts can be explicitly called 'right' or 'wrong'. in fact, moral statements themselves are entirely devoid of propositional content


Greetings promethean75:

You seem to be claiming that Chapter Three of The Structure of Ethics is non-rational or irrational, or that maybe the whole treatise is.

Do the other readers of this agree? Speak up if you have read over the booklet offered in first link below - which I shall repeat here, in case no one got as far as the Signature as they read these posts:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf

Please let us know if, in your view, the manuscript - once you ignore the few typos that always sneak in - is rational or not.

.
:idea: For further reading and insight into the topics of Ethics check out these links, and thereby add to your reading enjoyment

THE STRUCTURE OF ETHICS
[NEW] :!:
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/TH ... ETHICS.pdf


THE BREAKTHROUGH - We Can Get Along After All (2018)
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BREAKT ... %20all.pdf

LIVING WELL: how ethics helps us flourish
http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/LI ... ourish.pdf


BASIC ETHICS: a systematic approach

http://tinyurl.com/mfcgzfz

ETHICAL ADVENTURES http://wadeharvey.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICAL%20ADVENTURES.pdf

When you Google the following pdf selection you may wish to start with page 20 in order to skip the technicalities:
Marvin C. Katz - ETHICS: A College Course
thinkdr
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Posts: 617
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby Meno_ » Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:59 am

You seem to be claiming that Chapter Three of The Structure of Ethics is non-rational or irrational, or that maybe the whole treatise is.

Do the other readers of this agree? Speak up if you have read over the booklet offered in first link below - which I shall repeat here, in case no one got as far as the Signature as they read these posts:
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Re: How construct a sound Ethical Theory?

Postby Meno_ » Mon Jun 24, 2019 1:02 am

My view is much more reduced conceptually, and normative ethics from tribalism on, is interpreted alongntue lines, summed by the hypothetical , that technology has so far been very progressive on such ethics.

Previously transcendent, having lost visible bearings with objectivity, due to appearent gains that modern production -did not evenly distribute;
lost the object which connected various economic objects. These objects, or models crafted and modeled as transparently equivocal, have politically lost that transparency, so as to dampen the rosy objectives that improvements have cast about them.

The short film typifies this, and can not by sheer numbers qualify a steady slope future objective, since preception and production have left a huge grey, undetermined area, of opinion on the relationship between quantification of mass production and qualifocation of individual reception.

This grey area has expanded faster then Madison avenue can gage the long term effects.

Structurally grey, the ethics of economic and political variances, are not as accurately synced, as when the control of quality started with less general prototypes , and more accurate approximations of durability of lasting power.

The built in obsolescence of 10 cars was reported by an agency , where those cars could not go over 100,000 miles. When the average American drives over 20-25000 miles a year. , replacing that vehicle after 4 to 5 years condemns workers to view transportation as an ongoing expense ,.

Viewed metaphorically, production machines may include other elements of life, such as qualitative use of recreational time, where individual styles can be safely said to have eroded, with technological progress.

People spend vastly lesser time interacting at home, because of the diversionary escape routes through television . Mealtimes are rushed and continually degrade by women working to pay for that car. Children rather get a job at McDonalds then to to school and postpone their tendency to instantly gratify their short term obkextivrd2.

Even betting on the idea of preventing mutually assured destruction becoming an absolute deterrent , has differing odds, politically versus technologically speaking.

As consequence, normative ethics has a very long way to go to recast it's objectives within a binary form of perception, and understanding.
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