Patriotism

It is a common tactic to call those who you disagree with as unpatriotic. We saw plenty of that in the Bush wars. It’s just a ploy to distract from dissent. The kneeling or not standing had a message, but that message was lost in the furor over the symbol. But unfortunately, too many Americans look at the symbols and never consider whether the message adds or detracts from that symbol.

The original “kneeling” was a protest against “systemic racism”. As if that is all the anthem represents or what America is.

Now the “kneeling” is a protest against Trump’s tweets.

:-k Seems pretty superficial.

The football players’ message had to do with white on black police brutality supported by uninformed liberals and black lives matter people who refuse to accept that many USA black people disrespect the authority of the police by not doing as they are told to by the police and the black people get hurt or killed justly for disobeying police orders by cops who happen to be white (and sometimes black as well, but that part of police brutality reality is ignored).

Kaepernick used the tactic to get attention for his cause that he could not get in any other way.

He got attention and he got a disproportionate punishment. That should have ended it.

Now that Trump has reopened that can of worms, you’re going to waste endless amounts of time bickering about it. Does Trump have any common sense at all?

He, the player, is a celebrity, he has access to reporters who care what he thinks, he should have used his voice to speak rather than act unpatriotic slapping the faces of those who protect him. It was a dumb move on his part to disrespect the military who have nothing to do with his cause.

Blacks have been taught in the American education system that they are the eternally oppressed and exploited by the American system. Of course they are not patriotic towards America.

Contrast this with those people who are told that they are supposed to be patriotic towards America while paying the financial and in particular social costs for the unwanted inflicted diversification of America.
Their patriotism better become conditional, for having their America.

He’s a minor player, which is why he did it that way he did.

One has to ask why athletes, actors and singers get the attention that they do?

Joker told me that much of the US Army is black and hispanic, I wonder how those military people feel about these stunts of disrespect towards them.

There is a difference between patriotism and militarism, Wendy. One can be a patriot of a nation without a military.

If you as the patriot are willing to take up arms to protect your home, otherwise no, you cannot without some army protecting your hindends and countries who pay other countries to save them but have no skin in the game are no kind of patriots that I recognize. They are cowards that hide behind the bloodshed of other countries who save their asses, the same countries they blame for the plights of the world.

Those military blacks and hispanics have brothers and sisters who have faced racial discrimination in this country. They know the score and whether you like the message or not doesn’t change the reality of it.

If you want the flag and the anthem to mean anything, then those ideals have to be reflected in how we act. Otherwise, those symbols simply become stained with hypocracy. There was no disrespect shown the military. Pointing out the discrepancy between our ideals and how we act is just as patriotic as those who risk their lives for us.

But it is much easier to scapegoat people of color than to face up to our own failures. Pffft.

This isn’t about veterans or service men, or military, or those that died in wars, its much more than them, regardless of the that sounding cold, because it is more than them.

I would not jump ship to Canada if I like “Canada’s rules” better. So no not really, my interests are the United States interests. I am patriotic towards the values of liberty, equality, justice, democracy, diversity etc, but I see the United States as more than those values as it does consist of the people we live with, our friends our family and those we pass on the roads, those who compete against jobs with us and so on. As such, I am not confining patriotism to representing even the constitution, what matters is the people and the welfare of the people, not the constitution, not isms, not anything else that is abstract. While the constitution and certain isms do promote the welfare of the people, the bottom line is that the welfare of the people are the true value found within supporting the nation and those isms and freedoms and liberty that have helped build the welfare of the people to it are not bigger than the people itself. Dynamic fluidity is often required in certain instances, as are an ethical concern for liberty, freedom etc. Hopefully that clears it up? The values are not abstract ideas, they are the people who I live with, as such, I am a patriot nonetheless.

You’re jumping to a bizarre conclusion - you have no idea how I honor the military. The flag, the national anthem, is not the military. It is a symbol of something much greater, see previous response.

Sounds racist. If you think Colin isn’t a patriot, you’re wrong, he wouldn’t have done what he did if he wasn’t. Yeah, he’s kind of black.

Then don’t disrespect the police and the military, it’s simple. People who do as the police require have no problems, people who behave don’t get tackled and shot. But that goes for all people to obey the police, but poor and/or uneducated black, whites, and hispanic folks who reach into their pockets or behind their backs when they are told to put their hands up need to face their decision to disobey, unfortunately it costs them their lives. Are hispanics favored over blacks, so blacks are the only ones besides muslims in garb who get ill treatment? The muslims don’t even make a ruckus like the blacks, they do as the police say, and one case after another the police officers were found innocent after the investigations. It’s simple, follow the laws, follow police directions, no major problems. I’m glad that there are police body cameras, that’s exposing more truth than lying words.

Sorry, You read like a collection of right wing bullet points. A half truth isn’t the truth. Body cameras help but the courts have the final say - and it isn’t always justice.

The flag and anthem doesn’t mean the same thing to everyone else, nor will it ever, nor should you pretend or assume that what they are doing is “disrespect towards the flag or anthem” it is a protest towards a certain situation.
You’re misinterpreting intent with your meaning of their act.

No, the flag was a military symbol of our victory and always has been, so was the national anthem which describes our military victory. Patriotism starts with the military and if you have flowery sentiments in your head than you can call it whatever you want, but the flag and anthem have to do with war fought by our military yesterday and today.

The flag is a symbol of more than our victory, it is a symbol of everything the nation is. The national anthem is a symbol too of that. It is more than what you want it to be confined to, for many people. Symbols for you are not the same for everyone else and vice versa, they are all interpreted and conceptualized differently by each individual.