On Poor White America Versus Liberal Misunderstandings.

jake - if we have an interest in breeding an animal, recognizing the difference between race and species is useful. Races may look different (depending on what you’re looking at) but not be materially different in economic value. Sex is the same way.

In humans, race has been useful in separating slave stock from freemen, for instance. And sometimes in diagnosing illnesses or genetic predispositions to certain medical conditions.

On a different note - it’s not as if this is difficult to understand. Who is more likely to rob you (you person)? A rich man or a poor man? Someone in your ingroup or in an outgroup? What do we fear more than otherness?

Manufacturing labor is paid (more or less) based on its productivity, after accounting for supply and demand. Educated people are more in demand than they were in the 1960’s. American manufacturing had much less competition in the years after WWII than from about 1965 onward. Only productivity gains have staved off a further decline in manufacturing wages since then.

What has happened is that workers who are in demand have made unprecedented gains in purchasing power since WWII in the U.S. In truth, all workers have. factory workers can now only afford what was once a perfectly acceptable middle class house in the 50’s but no longer is. Postwar subdivisions that were regarded as a magical land of palaces are now slums. But if you track wages and standard of living for manufacturing workers since, say 1865 until now, things look awesome for factory workers here. They don;t when compared to a postwar world that could hardly be duplicated now. You know, unless millions of people died in a war.

What has also happened is that we are not yet over the romance of the ability of someone who can barely read to buy a three bedroom house in the suburbs. Even though it still does happen.

I have been involved in an effort (my role has been small) to bring manufacturing jobs back to the community in which i grew up. Garment manufacturing. I am grateful for the opportunity. I think it’s cool. But nothing we do is going to bring back 1952.

It’s the price we pay for overall prosperity and for the huge increase in purchasing power all americans enjoy. No one really talks about it because no trade union benefits by talking about it. There’s nothing in it for any lobbying group. And besides, it’s good news, which is boring.

When i was young, a mentally disabled person was not poor - they were incarcerated in a state institution.

So you are helping to increase the lower class? Congratulations. Your mentality will keep those who can read, write, and do basic maths in up and coming ghettos which of course we need more of as everybody knows.

Yes, the price that 80% of Americans pay so that 20% have their huge increase in purchasing power. It truly is a shame that the 80% are doing an honest days work but not receiving an honest days pay while the 20% are scammers and morons who support scammers.

This is a lie.

You people just don’t have a counter-argument, which I can’t blame you for - your position is wrong and impossible to argue for rationally. All you have is these shaming words based on previous Pavlovian training, aka modern indoctrination, and if others don’t share your Pavlovian responses to these words, you’re helpless.

You’re too scared to show your face here and get into arguments cause you’d know you’d be destroyed.

EDIT: A song for you cucks:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ip6tpmyb4G4[/youtube]

I am helping to get people jobs. No one is going to quit their day job as neurosurgeon to sew buttons. I am also working on reducing ghettos, liberal that i am.

You got that last part wrong. Everyone gets the same increase in purchasing power. I think supercars and Bel Air mansions have gone up a lot, so maybe not everyone.

If you have no money, how do you have purchasing power?

Homeless drug addicts have money. Everyone has money in america, or can get it. You gotta leave your house once in a while, wendy.

How much does a job you cannot survive on help you? You are placing people into lower class jobs as if your ass is doing them some favor, very liberal I know.

I’ve only seen those sorts of subpar jobs cause more distress. The at work stress coupled with the at home stress of piling up unpayable bills, no savings, and no credit cards to subsidize their incomes. The people never get a break and never get ahead.

You need to live as a poor person for 6 months as a social experiment to wake you up cuz you are a terrible snob who is too good to sew buttons.

Yes, sleazy scumbags always get money, but I’d rather not have a country full of them.

Nope. Stat was dead on. Of course, he was assuming that we share the same reality. We don’t. Too many here have bought into an alternate reality while smugly assuming that they and they only have the TRUTH… So blather away as you choose.

Oh by the way, we can’t be destroyed because arguing with a fence post produces nothing useful. Posting here simply puts the spotlight on the fence posts for all to see.

Wendy, these are simple points. Verrrry simple.

Shall I work on a project to provide six figure jobs for whoever wants one?

I have lived in a single room with a weekly income of maybe $300 bucks. It’s called “Maine in the winter in the food service business”. Flood-salvaged toyota corolla, no health insurance, virtually zero possessions. In fact, i lived for several years with almost no possessions except clothing. Not even a TV!

I have also been in some of the worst rental units (not living in them) you could imagine. Units that we had to vacate and shut down. But there is also always a big (really big) screen TV.

I know it’s stressful to be poor and to have a lot of bills.

Now you will tell me that it was just a social experiment and so doesn’t count.

I have shoveled dirt and gravel for a living. I have washed dishes in a restaurant. You have no idea what you are talking about.

What you did 20+ years ago doesn’t count for what you earned then bought more than now. Why are you playing games? You think that the other folks on here don’t see the ridiculousness of what you are writing? Do you even read what BS your writing?

So they have a REALLY BIG TV. This is some kind of evidence for misspent money in your mind? :laughing: It’s a lot easier to buy a 40+ inch TV from a pawn shop or a garage sale when you’re poor, but that one time $60 doesn’t pay for monthly medical expenditures, a car and its expenses, enough food for a large family, etc. Ever heard of the term “nigger rich?” Well, poor people don’t always make the best consumer choices, they go hog wild when they finally have $60 bucks. Thanks for being entertaining.

Wendy, An extremely large percentage of the down and outers are where they are because of a cascade of bad choices made early in their lives. OK. All of us have made a few bad choices growing up, but perhaps we were lucky enough to leave enough open doors to chase that illusive “American Dream”. After all, chasing dollars IS the American dream.

But for the perennially poor, it is often that they realize that no matter what they do, they will never have any more than the bare minimums. In short, they know they are fucked. It pisses me off to see conservatives attack the poor by pointing out the people living in extreme poverty but driving a new car or spending the food budget on the big screen TV. It’s simple. They KNOW they won’t ever have the three bedroom two bath hunky house along with two cars and a pickup, but godammit they’re going to have something! Is it misspent money? Yes. Just another bad choice, but completely understandable.

The only plausible solution is education (re-education?). For some, it would mean taking them back to potty training and moving forward. But they are the minority. Most of the poor simply need enough education to see all of their options and the encouragement to make the best choices given their circumstances.

I’ll be the first to admit that our society does damn little to help the poor. The power people want to keep them (us) poor and watching reality shows on that big screen TV. On the other hand, no one owes a poor person anything but the opportunity to work their way out of poverty. Hard work? Absolutely. But it is up to the individual. We can’t give anyone success. They have to do it for themselves.

We’re already talking about the working poor full-timers who aren’t getting paid enough to survive. They are already doing their hard work, but they aren’t getting paid beans for it.

Perhaps its not the poor who need to be re-educated but rather its the greedy, thoughtless, sleaze bag fucks who own the banks and industries who take advantage of the simple folks. Why aren’t those fuckers being re-educated as human beings?

Chasing a dream was the American dream and it usually included family values and the basic values of being humane, being human during the chase, it wasn’t to be achieved at any and all costs to be painfully felt by the rest of the world.

Because they don’t have to honor empathy and compassion. Remember, our society - almost ALL societies are based on chasing wealth=power. But a new “globalist” meme is coming into view. Still in its infancy, but on its way.

That is a different thread. Maybe it’s time…

Globalist as in many of the sci-fi horror shows that have come out in the last ten years or 1984 with more tech for the top and less food for the bottom. Instead of the Hunger Games, we’ll have the Public Execution Games, all be like North Korea?

The problem is that it is no longer sci-fi. It’s here and it isn’t going to go away. Didn’t think about the Hunger Games, but yeah, it is possible. I started a new thread. Jump in at your pleasure.

It’s about tech, not defunct people and their schemes.

I think I’m done blowing up your assumptions. You are clearly not following my argument well enough to reply in any meaningful way. You’ve gone from being wrong about the economy of the U.S. to some sort of argumentative dissociation. I hope it’s no more than that, anyway.

More amusement. Prove your right then about the economy, or I can keep proving you wrong…your choice.

Tent - "Wendy, An extremely large percentage of the down and outers are where they are because of a cascade of bad choices made early in their lives. OK. All of us have made a few bad choices growing up, but perhaps we were lucky enough to leave enough open doors to chase that illusive “American Dream”. After all, chasing dollars IS the American dream.

But for the perennially poor, it is often that they realize that no matter what they do, they will never have any more than the bare minimums. In short, they know they are fucked. It pisses me off to see conservatives attack the poor by pointing out the people living in extreme poverty but driving a new car or spending the food budget on the big screen TV. It’s simple. They KNOW they won’t ever have the three bedroom two bath hunky house along with two cars and a pickup, but godammit they’re going to have something! Is it misspent money? Yes. Just another bad choice, but completely understandable.

The only plausible solution is education (re-education?). For some, it would mean taking them back to potty training and moving forward. But they are the minority. Most of the poor simply need enough education to see all of their options and the encouragement to make the best choices given their circumstances.

I’ll be the first to admit that our society does damn little to help the poor. The power people want to keep them (us) poor and watching reality shows on that big screen TV. On the other hand, no one owes a poor person anything but the opportunity to work their way out of poverty. Hard work? Absolutely. But it is up to the individual. We can’t give anyone success. They have to do it for themselves.

Spot on and well said. Pretty good for an old man.