Is North Korea successful?

For Kim, a North Korean citizen who accepts the free housing, free education, free food and free healthcare but hate the very system that provides those welfare is not a citizen under the system.

Under feudalism, disloyal to your lord is not some trivial offenses.

By capture, you mean flatten Pyongyang and all the other large cities?

So if they don’t want to be part of the system, they can leave.

I keep asking you if they have a choice but you have not answered my question.

Succumb or die, right? An inconvenience. :laughing:

They will be shot at their border if they try to leave. It’s one, maybe the only, country who holds their citizens hostage.

It’s certainly not the only country to do it.

I 'm not saying that all whites like America, I 'm just use it as an example to demostrate that moral judgement is very very subjective.

Judgement like ‘trivial offenses’ is another very subjective Judgement, what you consider ‘trivial offenses’ under American system are not necessarily trivial in a feudalist society.

I have never said hunger is a daily inconvenience. And in my reply I use the word ’ accept’ meaning if a guy accepts what the system provides to him, he will not consider that system a ‘tyranny’.

Ok, let’s suppose if there is a massive hunger in North Korea and millions of North Koreans can freely flee their country and go to neighbor countries, will Japan, South Korea, Russia and China and America open its door to let millions of North Koreans in???

Have you ever heard of the Rohingya people?? :astonished: :astonished:

Watching a foreign television show and carrying a common book are not crimes worthy of death, except in your subjective mind, but objectively, not in my mind.

Why is it only those countries and not all countries who may take them in? For North Koreans who wish to assimilate as citizens of other countries, why would there be problems? The Rohingya’s refuse to assimilate into the nation in which they desire to be citizens, that’s the problem.

I think you missed a fundamental point - the choices that the people have are :
actively support the regime, passively function within the regime, or be jailed or executed.

You make it sound like they are willingly signing a contract without coercion.

Phyllo,

Where else are citizens held hostage?

First of all, let me get some very basic things right, in North Korea, if you watch a Russian or Chinese tv show and carrying a Russian or Chinese book, you will not be punished.

North Korea and South Korea, America and Japan are legally speaking still at war, because they have not signed any peace treaty yet, in North Korea, if you sing a song from those countries, there will be some serious punishment, because you are expressing loyalty to the enemy. and this is not special to North Korea,
If you are in the middle of the American civil war you live in the north but you sing the song of the south, you will be punished. If in the heat of McCarthyism you as an American was found reading a foreign book with a title like ‘the essential writing of Karl Marx’ or you were found singing a song named Moscow Nights, you will lose your job and be punished very, very seriously.

How does carrying a Bible in Chinese equate with a war crime deserving death?

The morality of the situation seems to mirror individual morality.

You’re a big strong guy and you come upon a guy beating a woman and a child.

He tells you that it’s his wife and his kid.

So you walk away because it’s not your business to interfere in their marriage. She “signed a contract”. The kid “signed a contract”. They’re getting free room and board.

Is that how it works or ought to work?

And one can up the ante : He buys a machine gun and he’s beating his wife and kid.

Then you definitely don’t interfere because someone might get hurt.

I did not say they are willingly signing a contract without coercion, I simply said that the majority of ordinary people in North Korea will not revolt against the Kim family as long as their basic needs for living were provided by the North Korean feudalist cradle to grave welfare state.

And I merely use the concept of ‘social contract’ i in their ideology to expain why North Korea and Cuba can maintain itself for decades despite American sanction.

Other countries black market goods into sanctioned countries and that’s why those sanctioned countries still exist. If the sanctions were strictly followed by all nations, the sanctioned countries would be decimated.

In North Korea, bible is not allowed. Because in the ideology of that highly- developed feudalist system, the Kim family provides a cradle to grave welfare state to you, in exchange, you give the Kim family your 100% loyalty, if you believe in God, you will no longer give the Kim family your 100% loyalty, because you can only give your 100% loyalty to God. Therefore, believing in God is a serious crime in North Korea.

Along the lines of that 100% devotion to the Kim craziness mentality, families should be outlawed as well for people’s loyalties are muttled with family devotions too. I’ve been reading some articles quoting NK defectors and the black market is huge in NK. Why is the black market huge?