Slaves don't dream

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Slaves don't dream

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:16 pm

I have empirically observed, that slaves do not dream.

All the workaholics I've spoke with, have trouble recollecting their dreams.
I myself, notice that whenever I am fired or layed off from a job, my ability to dream is increased twelvefold.

Discuss the psychological, metaphysical, and scientific reasons behind this.

I do not believe the equation is that the causality is that "Workaholics are attracted to work, thus these type of people often don't dream."
I firmly believe that slavery itself inhibits dreams.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby surreptitious57 » Thu Dec 22, 2016 1:06 am

Do you dream of hot sexy lesbians with voices like honey and legs like Olympians
Is this the type of dream that you have when your ability is increased twelvefold
A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Mithus » Thu Dec 22, 2016 1:51 am

I think people dream much more often than they can recall their dreams. When somebody says that he doesn't dream, it usually means that he can't remember them. If the working people you were talking to are representative, my question would be whether their repeating daily rhythm (e.g.interruption of their sleep, because they have to get up) has an influence on their ability to recall their dreams.
Would be interesting to know if there is a special technique how to remember dreams. I've been told that it helps to keep the eyes closed for 30 seconds after waking up, but it doesn't work for me.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Ecmandu » Thu Dec 22, 2016 1:58 am

Dreams are lots of things ...

Council with the spirits

Past life regression

Future life progression

Warnings

Just hanging out with people and them hanging out with you

They can be tests for future relationships

They can be allegories for circumstance

Done.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Pandora » Thu Dec 22, 2016 12:56 pm

I'd like that actually. It sure beats dreaming that you're at work, working. :-?
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Meno_ » Thu Dec 22, 2016 6:50 pm

Slaves dream big and more, spectacularly , as the more blindfolded their eyes, the more their ears expand their consciousness, away from the why's and butts of it, into the very essence of the sweet soul music.

Remember Joe Tex, Eddie Kendricks, and of course Marvin Gay. They went down burning as falling stars.

The music of slavery eclipses the slavery of music.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:19 pm

surreptitious57 wrote:Do you dream of hot sexy lesbians with voices like honey and legs like Olympians
Is this the type of dream that you have when your ability is increased twelvefold


Used to, not anymore. These are grim times. We are on the verge of having Justin Bieber music put in Star Wars movies, and all that we struggled for is lost.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:21 pm

Mithus wrote:I think people dream much more often than they can recall their dreams. When somebody says that he doesn't dream, it usually means that he can't remember them. If the working people you were talking to are representative, my question would be whether their repeating daily rhythm (e.g.interruption of their sleep, because they have to get up) has an influence on their ability to recall their dreams.
Would be interesting to know if there is a special technique how to remember dreams. I've been told that it helps to keep the eyes closed for 30 seconds after waking up, but it doesn't work for me.


I do not believe that waking up early is the equation. I can wake up early from dreams, but if I'm not working, I can remember them. Similarly, if I am working and wake up late in the morning, it is still hard to remember my dreams.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby James S Saint » Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:40 am

Usually to remember dreams, the conscious mind has to be slowly introduced to the subject of the dream as though watching it independently occurring. That naturally happens when someone casually awakens rather than being awakened by alarms, disturbances, or urgent inspiration.

Those are the times when keeping one's eyes closed for short while after awakening helps the images bleed into the rising conscious. The important thing is to not think of or do anything else until you are conscious of what the dream was about and can "discuss it with yourself". And that isn't easy for many people. People who work regularly seldom have the luxury to gradually awaken with a clear conscious free of distractive concerns.

Dream memories are like faint morning fog images on the window. As the Sun arises, they get burned away very quickly and if they haven't been photographed into the conscious waking memory ("documented"), there is far too little trace left of them to recall later.
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby surreptitious57 » Fri Dec 23, 2016 8:40 am

Dreams occur during the REM state of sleep which is the deepest
And so this would be why they very often cannot be remembered
A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby James S Saint » Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:33 pm

Moments ago, I awoke from a dream. I was dreaming of a group of men conferring on the variety of issues involved in ethics. A client of the company had consigned a colleague to qualify some material to be included in the clients book on ethics. Among other things being discussed, I mentioned that it was interesting that "in another room" I was on the Internet discussing these same kinds of things with "Dr McKay from ..." (referring to Danial McKay's thread on his "new normative theory and PhD thesis"). I was trying to remember what State Dr McKay was in when I awoke.

In this case, I awoke freely, without need to immediately get up. I began to think about other things. But then it humorously dawned on me that I had just dreamt about the thread upon which I had just been posting and that I had promoted McKay to doctor status. As I was rethinking about that dream, it then dawned on me that just prior to McKay's thread, I had posted on a thread concerning remembering one's dreams. QED. 8)
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Arcturus Descending » Tue Feb 21, 2017 6:08 pm

UP,

I firmly believe that slavery itself inhibits dreams.


I find it difficult to believe that a slave or anyone who feels enslaved in a sense would not need such a catharsis that dreaming is capable of giving, such as acting out aggression or giving rise to his/her voice or dreaming of hungering after such things that another kind of life might give and achieving and receiving these things within the dreams.
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby gib » Wed Feb 22, 2017 3:39 pm

Ultimate Philosophy 1001 wrote:I myself, notice that whenever I am fired or layed off from a job, my ability to dream is increased twelvefold.


Well, that's it; you're stressed about being fired or laid off. Your dreams are cathartic, as Arc said.
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It is impossible for a human being to go through life not thinking irrationally even if they think of themselves as rational
Also just as irrational decisions are not always bad then rational ones are not always good no matter what the intention
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The rating of rationality can be higher and always is higher than the person trying to be rational. Rationality is less emotional than the person delivering it.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby demoralized » Thu Feb 23, 2017 6:50 am

i dream, and i THINK i might be a slave. feel free to prove otherwise to me :-) hoping I am wrong
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Thu Feb 23, 2017 5:36 pm

gib wrote:
Ultimate Philosophy 1001 wrote:I myself, notice that whenever I am fired or layed off from a job, my ability to dream is increased twelvefold.


Well, that's it; you're stressed about being fired or laid off. Your dreams are cathartic, as Arc said.


but I'm stressed 100% of the time, so that theory doesn't hold water.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Thu Feb 23, 2017 5:37 pm

incorrect wrote:i dream, and i THINK i might be a slave. feel free to prove otherwise to me :-) hoping I am wrong


How am I supposed to prove anything without clarity or data.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Arcturus Descending » Tue Feb 28, 2017 3:41 pm

incorrect wrote:i dream, and i THINK i might be a slave. feel free to prove otherwise to me :-) hoping I am wrong


We're all slaves at times. It's a process when it comes to emancipating ourselves... piecemeal.

I think that I may have been a scullery maid in a king's court in another time. :lol: O/K

THINKING itself at times causes us to enslave ourselves. Let it go, let it go, let it go.....

What causes you to be a slave at times? First we have to see it, acknowledge it, before we can emancipate ourselves.
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby gib » Tue Feb 28, 2017 3:48 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:Let it go, let it go, let it go.....


Thanks Elsa...

Image

Arcturus Descending wrote:What causes you to be a slave at times? First we have to see it, acknowledge it, before we can emancipate ourselves.


...being careful, of course, to distinguish servitude from a slave mentality.
My thoughts | My art | My music | My poetry

It is impossible for a human being to go through life not thinking irrationally even if they think of themselves as rational
Also just as irrational decisions are not always bad then rational ones are not always good no matter what the intention
- surreptitious75

The rating of rationality can be higher and always is higher than the person trying to be rational. Rationality is less emotional than the person delivering it.
- encode_decode

Is that a demon slug in your stomach or are you just happy to see me?
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Arcturus Descending » Tue Feb 28, 2017 4:09 pm

gib wrote:
Arcturus Descending wrote:Let it go, let it go, let it go.....


Thanks Elsa...

Image

Arcturus Descending wrote:What causes you to be a slave at times? First we have to see it, acknowledge it, before we can emancipate ourselves.


...being careful, of course, to distinguish servitude from a slave mentality.


You are quite welcome, gib. :mrgreen: What is that avatar of yours?

I don't find there to be much of a distinguishing factor between servitude and slave mentality unless you are using the former term differently.
Only that with the former, we are enslaved by others and with the latter, we have enslaved ourselves.
I suppose that "other' can be a part of our self which we are not familiar with.
Last edited by Arcturus Descending on Wed Mar 01, 2017 3:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


I learn as I write!
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby gib » Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:06 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:You are quite welcome, gib. :mrgreen: What is that avatar of yours?


That's Claire Boucher from The Grimes:

Image

I just removed the text.

Arcturus Descending wrote:I don't find there to be much of a distinguishing factor between servitude and slave mentality unless your using the former term differently.
Only that with the former, we are enslaved by others and with the latter, we have enslaved ourselves.


^ Exactly! That makes all the difference in the world. When you realize you're only enslaving yourself, you realize you're completely free.

A slave mentality (aka. victim mentality) is more than just seeing one's self as a victim--it's being addicted to complaining. Those suffering from victim mentality will reject real solutions to their problems so that they can continue to complain. They need their problems in order to have something to gripe about. Or if their problems disappear, they'll convince themselves that they're still victims in order to feel justified in still complaining. It's like any other addiction where we can grown accustom to that which is not good for us, and we don't give ourselves the option of switching over to what is good for us because that requires temporary self-deprivation.
My thoughts | My art | My music | My poetry

It is impossible for a human being to go through life not thinking irrationally even if they think of themselves as rational
Also just as irrational decisions are not always bad then rational ones are not always good no matter what the intention
- surreptitious75

The rating of rationality can be higher and always is higher than the person trying to be rational. Rationality is less emotional than the person delivering it.
- encode_decode

Is that a demon slug in your stomach or are you just happy to see me?
- Rick Sanchez
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Tue Feb 28, 2017 9:02 pm

Slave mentality is different from victim mentality.
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby gib » Wed Mar 01, 2017 2:39 am

Ultimate Philosophy 1001 wrote:Slave mentality is different from victim mentality.


Trixie, you are the epitome of the slave and the victim mentality.
My thoughts | My art | My music | My poetry

It is impossible for a human being to go through life not thinking irrationally even if they think of themselves as rational
Also just as irrational decisions are not always bad then rational ones are not always good no matter what the intention
- surreptitious75

The rating of rationality can be higher and always is higher than the person trying to be rational. Rationality is less emotional than the person delivering it.
- encode_decode

Is that a demon slug in your stomach or are you just happy to see me?
- Rick Sanchez
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Re: Slaves don't dream

Postby Arcturus Descending » Wed Mar 01, 2017 3:29 pm

Ultimate Philosophy 1001 wrote:Slave mentality is different from victim mentality.



...not by much.
Explain.
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


I learn as I write!
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