Sometimes they’ll throw in a gratuitous “suicide is a valid option for white men”.
The underlying point being to genocidally exterminate the white race over time.
It’s straight out of Deuteronomy.
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03-11-2013, 11:35 PM Post: #3
ChainOfBeing Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Um…
Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.
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03-12-2013, 08:19 PM Post: #4
JSS Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
But the production quality is great.
Those guys have a whole lot of money.
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03-13-2013, 09:05 AM Post: #5
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
(03-11-2013 03:35 PM)JSS Wrote:
Seems like typical social engineering psycho-filmage to me.
The “raw objectivity” aspect is to open your will to the embedded suggestions.
They usually use violence, sex, anything heart wrenching or terrifying in order to open the door.
But anything that strongly gets your attention works.
It is an example of your values being set by others without your knowledge.
It has been going on under your nose for the last 35 years or so.
- Pathetic white male who can’t protect his women.
- Black male fucks his women
- Futile life of the white man
and if they run more… - Angry superwoman frees herself from oppression of the white men
- Gay white men.
Sometimes they’ll throw in a gratuitous “suicide is a valid option for white men”.
The underlying point being to genocidally exterminate the white race over time.
It’s straight out of Deuteronomy.
The Androgyny Project.
There are, though, sometimes those movies starring Liam Niason where it’s just a white dude being awesome against all odds. But yeah, it’s more than just exterminating the white race; it’s just that they are first. They want to extinguish the race itself, including the sexes. Wells knew this way back when.
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03-13-2013, 05:37 PM Post: #6
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Where is the rest? There is only the first part for each episode.
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03-13-2013, 05:38 PM Post: #7
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Oh, this is from Charlie Brooker. Interesting.
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03-13-2013, 08:34 PM Post: #8
BigTom Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Self-destructive pessimism masquerading as ‘a cold hard look at ourselves’ is Brooker’s speciality. He’s a miserable, horrible man. And I know someone who went out with him for a bit before he married that dippy Asian children’s TV presenter, so I know he’s actually like this.
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03-13-2013, 09:38 PM (This post was last modified: 03-13-2013 09:44 PM by Q.) Post: #9
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
I find these films powerful, though. I should have watched them first before commenting on the androgyny stuff cause I don’t see it here beyond just the ambient level it exist in society. Definitely some transhumanist imagery. As for Booker,
youtube.com/watch?v=RH96S4rBZbI
He kind of reminds me of this guy. Not so much in terms of character, but just being in that media position to be flirting with dangerous ideas. I forget what it was in V. In this case it is the PM fucking a pig.
Also, the only way I could watch these videos was by torrenting them.
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03-13-2013, 11:56 PM Post: #10
ChainOfBeing Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
I don’t know why the videos here cut out part way through. I couldn’t find them anywhere else online.
As for " pessimism" I see these videos as instead exposing latent or implicit aspects of our daily lives, and of society. The “fears” of the material presented reflect us and how we ourselves are reflected by this imagery. It isn’t dystopian so much as a dream-like evocation, largely isolated imagery that should appear alien in how differently things are in the dream compared to our ‘normal’ lives, but really does not. Basically features of each of these stories are already present in our lives today, the film maker merely reflects on this by drawing them out to “extremes”.
I don’t know anything about the film maker himself, but it seems at least unfair or perhaps irrelevant to form comments about his work from within a context of criticizing the man’s supposed personal life and affairs. Artists are often difficult people to get along with and can leave a sour impression on others, in person. This says little or nothing about their work, however.
RE: Black Mirror
You might not believe it, but my friend from a film school I dropped out of oh, a year or more ago had been discussing making a video of… Jean-Charest, the then Prime Minister of Quebec, fucking a sheep.
It was a trip to see how these guys did it, the idea is obviously fantastic for anyone with a sense of humor and healthy hate for politicians. Shitty soap-opery angles are unavoidable on fiction TV of that scale if you’re not a Stanley Kubrick, but the set up was great, somehow a slight bit disappointing until the coup-de-gras, when all is justified and the work proves itself as even evil, for having stolen that idea from a guy who might actually have done it.
Started watching part 2, but was too high for that level of bad trip. The guy is honest and meticulous, there is no doubt about that.
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03-14-2013, 04:07 AM Post: #12
BigTom Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
(03-13-2013 11:56 PM)ChainOfBeing Wrote:
I don’t know anything about the film maker himself, but it seems at least unfair or perhaps irrelevant to form comments about his work from within a context of criticizing the man’s supposed personal life and affairs. Artists are often difficult people to get along with and can leave a sour impression on others, in person. This says little or nothing about their work, however.
I mean he is a pessimist in his work, as well as in his personal life. I’ve followed this guy’s stuff for years, I used to quite enjoy his weekly TV previews in the Guardian and I admit there is a lot in the series he did with Chris Morris ‘Nathan Barley’ that I liked and thought was very clever and well observed. He also wrote some sketches for a show that ‘took a sideways look at relationships’ in which all the men are assholes and all the women were crazy. Funny, but it’s the subtext of pure misanthropy flowing from this man that makes it hard for me to watch or read his stuff anymore.
Beyond that I don’t really have anything to contribute to this thread so I’ll leave it at that.
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03-14-2013, 07:42 AM Post: #13
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
These films have me fairly impressed. The little artistic nuances are too many to even list. I think the one with the black guy is my favorite but the pig fucking one, not even being British, really got to me.
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03-15-2013, 09:18 AM Post: #14
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
So there is some sort of top level global ban on these videos. I made a small clip of one of them and clearly stated it was made in accordance with Fair Use, and it was banned almost instantly. I didn’t even link it to anywhere. It had like 1 view.
Someone - I would imagine the Queen, English government, etc - seriously does not want these videos being watched.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-15-2013, 09:18 AM Post: #15
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
(03-15-2013 09:18 AM)Q Wrote:
So there is some sort of top level global ban on these videos. I made a small clip of one of them and clearly stated it was made in accordance with Fair Use, and it was banned almost instantly. I didn’t even link it to anywhere. It had like 1 view.
Someone - I would imagine the Queen, English government, etc - seriously does not want these videos being watched.
The only way I could even watch them in the first place was to torrent them. They’re banned on every site, everywhere.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-15-2013, 09:21 AM Post: #16
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
They all get really, really good after the parts they cut off in the OP.
You guys should try and watch them.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-15-2013, 12:12 PM Post: #17
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
cut off where now?
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03-15-2013, 12:19 PM Post: #18
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
There are 4 parts to each video. The OP only shows the first 1-2 parts. They get really good. All of them.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-15-2013, 12:25 PM Post: #19
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Oh… So the pig fucking one goes on? Man… It’s gonna take me like 2 weeks to find the emotional space to watch these bad boys.
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03-15-2013, 12:53 PM Post: #20
ChainOfBeing Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Are you sure there is some kind of ban on these? Weren’t they aired on TV in the UK, and they must be available on DVD too…?
Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.
RE: Black Mirror
(03-15-2013 12:25 PM)pezer Wrote:
Oh… So the pig fucking one goes on? Man… It’s gonna take me like 2 weeks to find the emotional space to watch these bad boys.
I’m still reeling kind of.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-15-2013, 01:51 PM Post: #22
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
(03-15-2013 12:53 PM)ChainOfBeing Wrote:
Are you sure there is some kind of ban on these? Weren’t they aired on TV in the UK, and they must be available on DVD too…?
There is a ban outside of the UK I mean.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-15-2013, 08:48 PM Post: #23
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
The second one goes so far beyond the others for me. I have watched it a bunch of times now. It’s completely self-contained. Brilliant.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-15-2013, 08:49 PM Post: #24
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
You guys need to watch these things in their entirety. I can give you the torrent links if you cannot find them.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-15-2013, 11:22 PM Post: #25
ChainOfBeing Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Apparently with the links I posted in the OP you need to click on Download to see the entire clip, if you just watch it from the site it will cut off part way through.
I’ll post links to season 2 soon.
Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.
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03-21-2013, 09:25 AM Post: #26
Bill Wiltrack Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
.
BigTom Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
(03-15-2013 01:51 PM)Q Wrote:
(03-15-2013 12:53 PM)ChainOfBeing Wrote:
Are you sure there is some kind of ban on these? Weren’t they aired on TV in the UK, and they must be available on DVD too…?
There is a ban outside of the UK I mean.
It’s all in your head, the show is widely available for download:
filestube.com/query.html?q=bl…select=All
There’s no ban, this isn’t remotely controversial stuff. Chris Morris was doing this kind of thing with Jam about a decade ago…
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03-21-2013, 10:16 PM Post: #28
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Hmm. Well then.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-21-2013, 10:33 PM Post: #29
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
But the black vans outside watching me, maaaan. This thing goes all the way to the top!
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-22-2013, 12:27 AM Post: #30
BigTom Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Don’t get me wrong, the black vans outside may well be watching you, and may well be under orders from ‘the top’. I’m just saying there’s no attempt to ban this TV show. It being comparatively harder to find than many TV shows is probably due to it not having that big an audience.
RE: Black Mirror
Banning has become a strange word in the anglo world. I’m definitely quite ready to believe that the broadcasters simply censored some parts, for example. True censorship can’t be direct or else it would eventually be acknowledged by some dope, no?
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03-22-2013, 04:39 AM Post: #32
BigTom Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
In this country censorship is a very informal, if quite careful, process. There’s nothing in the broadcast version that will make anyone who is that powerful that unhappy. I appreciate that things work differently in other countries, but here it seems they give a relatively free license to media producers as long as they stay within certain boundaries, or perhaps more specifically as long as you adopt the right tone towards your material. If you say it in a cynical way that offers the public no options then you can say pretty much whatever you like.
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03-22-2013, 04:44 AM (This post was last modified: 03-22-2013 04:45 AM by pezer.) Post: #33
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
I mean more the word than the country. Y’all sometimes say banned when the government had nothing to do with it. Maybe It’s an American thing.
There are certain cynical tones you can take in public which try to pass off as but certainly don’t allow you to say whatever you want; there is an allocated space in ideology for permitted rule breaking.
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03-22-2013, 03:49 PM Post: #34
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Perhaps I haven’t been exposed to the crazy stuff, but the pig fucking one, for me, was crazy. I was thinking about it for a long time. It’s not so much ‘Oh, that was shocking, a guy fucking a pig.’
It was something else.
Likewise, the way the memory implant one makes you look at the future is fucking horrifying. That is precisely where we are going.
Where will you draw the line? And then what happens? It’s the subtle stuff that gets to me. I kinda look Booker. He knows what he is. It’s not some saint, but these videos are such that they are powerful. I think, at least.
Tell me some of the videos you have found truly shocking. Dramas, that is. I’m sure you’ve seen some crazy spy torture or the like. Or maybe not. I shouldn’t presume that.
(03-21-2013 07:42 PM)BigTom Wrote:
(03-15-2013 01:51 PM)Q Wrote:
(03-15-2013 12:53 PM)ChainOfBeing Wrote:
Are you sure there is some kind of ban on these? Weren’t they aired on TV in the UK, and they must be available on DVD too…?
There is a ban outside of the UK I mean.
It’s all in your head, the show is widely available for download:
filestube.com/query.html?q=bl…select=All
There’s no ban, this isn’t remotely controversial stuff. Chris Morris was doing this kind of thing with Jam about a decade ago…
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-22-2013, 03:49 PM Post: #35
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Season 2 tonight.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-22-2013, 03:52 PM Post: #36
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Well, have you checked out Salo yet?
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03-22-2013, 03:58 PM Post: #37
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Or, if you want to know why Venezuela is scary in a really fun story, in a filming style which is very true to life, definitely watch Secuestro Express
Fuck your hard drive space, you can erase it after. You can tell it’s a quality movie because none of the actors are actually Venezuelan except the gangsters, who aren’t strictly speaking actors. Real professional piece. It’d make Riddley Scott smile.
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03-22-2013, 03:59 PM Post: #38
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
My god man, that question is huge.
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03-22-2013, 03:59 PM Post: #39
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
No. What are your impressions on it?
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-22-2013, 04:00 PM Post: #40
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
How deep have you delved into Japanese cinema?
RE: Black Mirror
Worth every traumatizing second, and a bit of a letdown in the way you might expect, though less than you might expect.
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03-22-2013, 04:01 PM Post: #42
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
It’s everything Saw never was.
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03-22-2013, 04:04 PM Post: #43
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Quote:
Because of its scenes depicting intensely graphic violence, sadism and sexual depravity, the film was extremely controversial upon its release, and remains banned in several countries. The film is currently banned outright in Malaysia due to “repulsive, outrageous and abhorrent content” (extremely high impact violence, offensive depictions of cruelty and other content that is repelling and abhorrent). The film was then banned in Singapore due to its “extreme content that may cause controversy in Singapore”. The film is banned outright in several other countries as well, including Sri Lanka, Iran, United Arab Emirates and Vietnam.
The film focuses on four wealthy, corrupted fascist libertines after the fall of Benito Mussolini’s Italy in July 1943. The libertines kidnap eighteen teenage boys and girls and subject them to four months of extreme violence, sadism, and sexual and mental torture. The film is noted for exploring the themes of political corruption, abuse of power, sadism, perversion, sexuality and fascism.
See this is kind of different. I mean, yes, if I watched this movie I’m sure it would stay with me, but there are movies that attempt to (and maybe this one doesn’t) be violent, and jarring, and usually there is a lot of it in the film. But it’s one of those things where… for instance, Hostile still stays with me. It was shitty, but it just showed me images that I will never forget. There has to be a payoff.
But then there are films that disturb you with how closely it resembles the world that you are used to. Not some bloodbath inferno that likely wouldn’t happen to you. But the world that you feel comfortable in.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-22-2013, 04:05 PM Post: #44
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Quote:
Worth every traumatizing second,
Quote:
What Saw never was.
I’ll consider it. I’m kind of sensitive when it comes to violence, though.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-22-2013, 04:28 PM Post: #45
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
You’re gonna hurt. There’s no doubt about it. As a faithful product of the Marquis de Sades, it is a masochistic venture. That’s why it actually is shocking. You may not notice, but those crappy, ineffective gore scenes are usually filmed and edited precisely to allow you that distance. Here, you can get exactly as close as you please. These men like guests.
The Secuestro Express one gets right into life. It shows you how you’re in your happy, white world and suddenly all the underbelly of the city… It stays with you somehow. But I’m gonna watch that movie you mentioned, once I know the variant of “stays with you” it elicits, I may be able to recommend better things.
I just watched Arbitrage today with Richard Gere. It’s the typical Richard Gere movie, but this one, as you say, kind of stuck with me.
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03-22-2013, 04:30 PM Post: #46
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
I’m gonna go calm down. Once I can do that I’ll be able to focus and pick movies. There’s just such a wide range…
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03-22-2013, 04:31 PM Post: #47
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
You watch Brazil yet?
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03-22-2013, 04:35 PM Post: #48
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
My God, I know what you need.
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03-22-2013, 04:37 PM Post: #49
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Michael Haeneke.
Pick any one.I’m out for now.
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03-22-2013, 04:47 PM Post: #50
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
The concept of not using a score at all is interesting with regards to Haneke.
You are reminding me of this one movie that I never saw but seemed interesting: It involves these people that kidnap some homeless people or something and they are torturing them because there is (apparently) some sort of powerful truth that can be learned when one stands on the precipice of pain and insanity. If you can make it back, you get this secret.
Anyways I won’t tell you how it ends if you haven’t seen it yet. If anyone else is reading and knows of this movie let me know because I want to learn the name of it again.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
RE: Black Mirror
I feel like films are banned because of one of two reasons:
- They are subversive to society. IE: They’re violent and crazy
- They’re subversive to the system. IE: They give you an insight into how the system really works.
Some can do both.
Film is so powerful. If clips of this show are allowed onto Youtube, it can do real damage. A lot of the time I picture myself on their side. "OK, if [this] thing took root, how much damage could it really do? All these laws are just fronts so that certain interests can do what they want.
People like Booker represent the faction of people that have realized that money trumps even their control sometimes. If you can put together a series that will make money, someone will air it somewhere. I don’t even watch any British TV to know that ‘4’ is probably not the most mainstream of the mainstream cable channels because Black Mirror is basically a series of films that tries to address the big power delusions:
1x1 - Democracy and The Crown’s co-existence
1x2 - The celebrity/success sellout paradox
1x3 - Blindly just doing transhumanism
2x1 - Transhumanism again
2x2 - The voyeuristic society/how public execution is planned
2x3 - More British (Democracy) Stuff
Basically, what I’m just saying that there is obviously a priority on controlling who watches Category B.
What do you guys think?
There is another conceivable level where so long as these ideas are introduced in a controlled way, then money is put into the shows that, when they are watched, they want to have an affect. So Watt would say that they are using Booker (or he knows) to push out stuff that has to filter up from the grassroots level. I would imagine that is one of the core components to The Revelation of the Method.
In effect, you use people like me to get into conversations talking about how the show with all the cool technology is bad. Ultimately to most people, over time, it’s just noise about transhumanism, acclimatising them to the idea.
Looking at the fact that Booker wrote all of these, and some of them play like he is writing while looking over some ‘this -is- coming’-type documents. So his interest in taking this show might have been to take on the media and fulfill some agenda, but at least one of the episodes per series is flooded - fucking flooded - with technology stuff, that he was told if he wanted the money, had to be there. The only way he would get the idea and the ability to display this on screen would be if he was approached by some of these interests. Or that is how it seems. Like in 2x1 they show future iphones. Considering Apple sues literally everyone, it seems that they wanted it to be there.
In fact, this episode is what Siri would be when taken to it’s extreme, and you know Apple wants data on stuff like this. As Booker shows in 2x2, being famous and being able to say what you want comes with a price.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-23-2013, 04:17 AM Post: #52
pezer Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Insightful.
Indeed, it’s not so much about not showing the truth as it is including the basic components that they need you to have, I agree with this premise.
My friend used to say that The Matrix is precisely made to be true so that you will think it’s a lie.
The best one can do is speculate, but some things we know for sure, and our speculations may be less off or pulled-out-of-ass than they seem.
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03-23-2013, 04:40 AM Post: #53
BigTom Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
(03-22-2013 03:49 PM)Q Wrote:
Perhaps I haven’t been exposed to the crazy stuff, but the pig fucking one, for me, was crazy. I was thinking about it for a long time. It’s not so much ‘Oh, that was shocking, a guy fucking a pig.’
It was something else.
Likewise, the way the memory implant one makes you look at the future is fucking horrifying. That is precisely where we are going.
Where will you draw the line? And then what happens? It’s the subtle stuff that gets to me. I kinda look Booker. He knows what he is. It’s not some saint, but these videos are such that they are powerful. I think, at least.
Tell me some of the videos you have found truly shocking. Dramas, that is. I’m sure you’ve seen some crazy spy torture or the like. Or maybe not. I shouldn’t presume that.
I’m not denying that this is powerful stuff, it is but as I keep saying I reckon they are basically doing the same thing Chris Morris did with Jam a decade ago.
[video=youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qpn7C6r-WEM[/video]
To be honest, nothing really shocks me in television drama. Perhaps it’s just the word ‘shock’ that I’m finding problematic but it’s usually only the real world that provokes a strong emotional reaction in me.
There is a scene in Spooks where one of the spooks is kidnapped by… whoever and for no obvious reason they clamp her in a chair with her head held in position with two big wooden blocks around her neck inside this big empty black room and they just leave her there for ages with water dripping on her head. That sort of thing bothers me more than, for example, the surprise murders in every HBO gangster show. Same with the scene in Das Experiment where the dude is locked in the small, lightproof, soundproof box. Fuckin’ horrible.
I would rationalise it like this: there’s nothing you can fundamentally do to stop people from being violent, except I suppose recreate them all digitally and then real physical fighting would be impossible. One cannot prevent violence, one can at best only ameliorate its consequences. So you could take away all the copycat-inducing glorification of violence in both the news and the entertainment media and we’d still have violence.
But when you explicitly portray for people how to torture people in the cruelest way, where you destroy their mind, destroy their connection with reality, that’s something that most people simply would never think of without being shown it on TV. They might think of slapping their girlfriend, they might even slap her, but they’d never think of using sensory deprivation or chinese water torture.
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03-23-2013, 06:07 AM Post: #54
BigTom Offline
Anarcho-beardist
Posts: 251
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RE: Black Mirror
(03-22-2013 05:32 PM)Q Wrote:
I feel like films are banned because of one of two reasons:
- They are subversive to society. IE: They’re violent and crazy
- They’re subversive to the system. IE: They give you an insight into how the system really works.
Some can do both.
I think it’s that it is if they give you too much of an insight, too well, too quickly, too early. A little bit of insight is the revelation of the method.
Quote:
Film is so powerful. If clips of this show are allowed onto Youtube, it can do real damage. A lot of the time I picture myself on their side. "OK, if [this] thing took root, how much damage could it really do? All these laws are just fronts so that certain interests can do what they want.
It is curious that channel 4 offer the show on their own website but not via any of their many many youtube channels. They put shitloads of their stuff on youtube, but not this.
Quote:
People like Booker represent the faction of people that have realized that money trumps even their control sometimes. If you can put together a series that will make money, someone will air it somewhere. I don’t even watch any British TV to know that ‘4’ is probably not the most mainstream of the mainstream cable channels because Black Mirror is basically a series of films that tries to address the big power delusions:
1x1 - Democracy and The Crown’s co-existence
1x2 - The celebrity/success sellout paradox
1x3 - Blindly just doing transhumanism
2x1 - Transhumanism again
2x2 - The voyeuristic society/how public execution is planned
2x3 - More British (Democracy) Stuff
Basically, what I’m just saying that there is obviously a priority on controlling who watches Category B.
What do you guys think?
- His name is Brooker, not Booker.
- You’re right, channel 4 is the dedicated ‘alternative end of the mainstream spectrum’ channel. That’s why it was set up - to feature odd stuff, racial/cultural minority stuff, whatever you wouldn’t get on BBC or ITV (the first commercial TV channel in the UK). I don’t disagree with your interpretation of the show.
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03-23-2013, 07:06 AM Post: #55
Q Offline
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RE: Black Mirror
Does anyone remember the show about the secret found in pain?
I wish I could remember that one.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
quote=“Fixed Cross”] ChainOfBeing Offline
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Your conspiracy
When deep answers unto deep, what the world lacks you’ve already made up for. What you don’t know can hurt you more than what you do know, the devil isn’t in the details but in the half-veils and truthful lies, so effective. The mind is capable only of a certain kind of belief about beliefs, information is apportioned and has its effect quite variously depending upon the host of factors regarding its physical characteristics and properties (in a brain, in a “society” brain of/for others).
Communication is always a manipulation of the intentions and expectations of the other, shaping a dynamic equilibrium of utilities tending toward ambivalences. And we are always communicating firstly and lastly with ourselves.
How many orders of effects have you considered, how much futurity, how much decontextualized truth formative of how many and what kinds of emotional orders? To what shallow waters does your intention aspire that its effect breed a reality from chaos and the unwilled? What is man but the supremely single-minded, single-hearted being? You are soaked in the blood of your other realities, so where is your justice? You know you might not even live through the day, we are all on borrowed time. Just stop and think about what really matters to you, for fuck’s sake.
Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.
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03-19-2013, 06:50 AM Post: #2
Q Offline
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RE: Your conspiracy
Hmm.
Can you say that again but differently?
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
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03-19-2013, 08:10 AM Post: #3
pezer Offline
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RE: Your conspiracy
Why? That was perfect.
Just stop and think about what really matters to you, for fuck’s sake.
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03-25-2013, 06:26 AM Post: #4
Dannerz Offline
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RE: Your conspiracy
Normally reality is incomprehensible because of how the factors are all churning and changing and flowing. But that is where the higher self comes into play. The higher self is so high level that it can, in some cases, even go so far as to manipulate the universe for the sake of its lower parts, which we are within, in our own way, mostly. In alchemy the goal is to improve matter. In spirituality the goal is to improve our state of mind and being. And in magic we utilize the soul and energy body.
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03-25-2013, 08:13 AM Post: #5
ChainOfBeing Offline
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RE: Your conspiracy
Um.
What?
Greatest Value (freedom)
…in the sense as underlies and potentiates other values: freedom.
Freedom is merely the ability to act with relative non-hinderance, to “be natural” or at least to be capable of following one’s own values and actions through to their logical and necessary consequences, with minimal disruption of these consequences/ends.
Freedom is not external, not in terms of money, power, jobs, ability to travel, lack of debt, not being in prison. These things do not matter. Why? because they are secondary values, or perhaps we might say, virtues. They are goods which are potentiated by truer valuations, such as for example the valuation of/as freedom.
Freedom is in “the mind”. That is all.
…Religious constructs serve to potentiate this acting-toward-and-within “freedom”, to cause to appear ladders down into the vast chains of being as erupt from beyond all knowing. The problem is that many of these religious constructs are relatively weak, what worked for man 2000 years ago may not have the same potentiating effect today. Also people use religion incorrectly, another huge problem.
Falsity is necessary to produce a structure whereby hidden “energies” are able to (feel themselves able to) manifest more openly, with less resistance and chaotic diffusion. Life is strange, and will shoot up, spread and grow everywhere if the ground is fertile enough.
(And who says that “the mind” is not as literally a physical ground of fertility and natural growth as any other natural ecosystem we observe in the world?) —>Tectonics dictates that indeed the mind is a physicality-strucutre of Literal Existence upon which are based quite literally Worlds and Universes of meaning and experience, whose interactions with what is otherwise thought of as “real life” still remain too “mysterious” for us to encounter other than through various manner of “voodoo ritual”.
Three cheers for freedom. Go get some of that shit, if you don’t already. Even if you regret it, you won’t regret it.
Define it
Politics, philosophy. Ah to see, just to see, and to know. What tiny pleasures man still enjoys so much, and what puny ambitions!
Politicilosophy. Philosopholitics.
Sigh. But man is just not insane enough yet. Fuck. But I’ve seen some sanity, rare moments, little bits but there, very nice to see it, to breathe it in. Witness the first sapling.
Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.
Why be happy when you could be interesting?
youtube.com/watch?v=U88jj6PSD7w
Why does Zizek think one cannot be both?
This is an honest query. I do not raise this question in ignorance or out of simple-mindedness, but because I understand his position. Is (his brand of) psychoanalysis the final “god”, the truly highest and most fruitful limit (for the philosopher)?
I think not. But let’s talk about it.
Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.
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04-07-2013, 12:20 PM Unread post Post: #2
pezer Offline
Pothead Saruman
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RE: Why be happy when you could be interesting?
I think not too. I think it was the greatest limit at one time, when the Sun was still quite far away. The result of a beautiful mind-revolution against the Eld.
Having been visiting a psychoanalyst myself, though of a more Winnicott-ian variety, the value I see in them is as Guattari once described it (and I paraphrase): You don’t really break through anything, or achieve anything, or honestly change in any deep way. What you gain is a power for calm consideration of your emotional being, something that works much like when the Great Patriarch of planet Namek unleashes Kuririn and Gohan’s hidden powers in Dragon Ball Z. Same guys, but calmer, scarier, more comfortable to be around and with a power to separate training from battle to a higher degree.
Science is found in the question “how do you know?”
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04-08-2013, 07:58 AM Unread post Post: #3
Heathen Offline
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RE: Why be happy when you could be interesting?
(04-07-2013 11:36 AM)ChainOfBeing Wrote:
youtube.com/watch?v=U88jj6PSD7w
Why does Zizek think one cannot be both?
This is an honest query. I do not raise this question in ignorance or out of simple-mindedness, but because I understand his position. Is (his brand of) psychoanalysis the final “god”, the truly highest and most fruitful limit (for the philosopher)?
I think not. But let’s talk about it.
To be interesting as a goal seems confused to me. Then the little mental cliches of what an interesting person are become a kind of ego ideal. I mean, I doubt this is quite what he is looking for, but it seems like both a false dilemma and a dangerous one.
But I don’t think he really has it as a false dilemma. I think he is just trying to attack the domination of the pursuit of happiness. Happiness often gets conflated with pleasure and then pleasure with rather emptied out physical acts. And purchasing happiness, these days.
I can’t hear his video where I am now, but if I remember right, Zizek thinks that some of our wonderful obsessions, that really define who we are and what we most want to do, cause pain, and we take the pain because that is who we are and what we want to do. Whatever it is, research, creative work, etc.
If you run after the word happy, you may end up not living our your very self, which in fact you would prefer if the ideas of happiness was not the carrot you chose.
To me there is a sublter type of happiness in doing what you love even if you suffer (also), but I support is attack on happiness as THE GOAL.
Trying to be interesting, well, that as THE GOAL, seems just as dangerous to me.
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04-08-2013, 08:03 AM Unread post Post: #4
Q Offline
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RE: Why be happy when you could be interesting?
Zizek sees television and media characters as, instead of the commonly accepted “less” real, actually more real than any given person. Because these characters represent the ideal or the abstract. Happiness is more heavenly; depression is cosmic. It’s the type of extremity that drives an artistic point home. It’s been a while, but I think he says that we can enter into this world off-screen. I would say that, exposed to the big screen, this unconsciously becomes a semi-conscious drive. When you catch a glimpse of how good fashion, hair, bodies, etc can look, well, you get the idea in your head that you can be both happy and interesting. That you can be everything, perfectly.
I always loved Zizek for that theory. It makes watching Twin Peaks a whole other level of fucked.
How bout getting off all these antibiotics?
How bout stopping eating when I’m full up?
quote=“pezer”
“If you run after the word happy, you may end up not living our your very self, which in fact you would prefer if the ideas of happiness was not the carrot you chose.”
[/quote]
You can’t be both because you can’t be happy. He associates being happy with getting what you want, and then says…
00:54
“We don’t really want to get what we think we want…the classical story that I like…the traditional male chauvinist scenario. I am married to a wife. Relations with her are cold, and I have a mistress. And all the time I dream…‘oh my god, if my wife were to disappear […] it would open up new life for me with the mistress.’ You know what every psychoanalyst would tell you quite often happens? That then, for some reason, wife goes away, you lose the mistress also. You thought this is all I want when you had it there, you turn out that it was a much more complex situation where what you want is not really to live with the mistress, but to keep her as a distance, as an object of desire about which you dream.”
I can’t think of places where Zizek discusses happiness, but I doubt he’s serious. Here’s something that can be construed as background for the above quoted text.
[/quote]
[/quote]