Despite rumors to the contrary, actually everyone doesn’t know how to love.
JSS,
I agree. Please elaborate on how to love proper.
“Proper” isn’t quite the right word. “Real” is more precise.
The real way to actually accomplish love is to at least instinctively, if not cognitively as well, learn of:
1) the true/real/actual need compendium of the one to be loved.
2) the actual truth of how such needs can be best met in the real world.
3) what means you might have to participate in such a direction and endeavor.
A simple minded example:
Someone has apparently committed a social crime that authority figures choose to punish by death. The real truth of the situation of Man is that simple punishment (“retribution”/“vindication”/“pay-back”), certainly punishment by death, doesn’t serve the individual nor the society as a whole. Thus if you are in a jury situation wherein you get a vote (or other non-destructive means), you vote toward preventing the crime of capital punishment (assuming that you love either society or any individuals within.
So in this case:
- The “Need Compendium” (for either the individual or the society) = to live
- The “Real Situation” of the moment that allows for (1) = jury trial situation in a society
- The “Real Means to Participate” toward the love = vote in favor of avoiding capital punishment.
In a more directly personal situation wherein a man loves a woman who doesn’t feel the same:
- = to feel joy in harmonizing with her surroundings.
- = her limited perspective in a chaotic, somewhat harsh social, psychological, and medical environment.
- = his ability to inspire her in a direction toward that greater harmony which might include:
_a) feeling a love for him (who understands how to help her achieve her need compendium)
_b) feeling a freedom to sense out a more probable resolve to her need compendium (perhaps a different suitor)
_c) sensing a desire to change her situation in society (relocation, different job, whatever) toward something more favorable to her need compendium.
_d) teach her of the cognitive understanding involved in achieving one’s need compendium
_e) cause her to emotionally understand her need compendium and how to achieve it
_f) just leave her to the situation in which she was found until more capable to fulfill her need compendium
_g) take it upon oneself to learn how to be loving before attempting to screw around with the lives and need compendium of others.
.
.
Oh, and did I mention the “Need Compendium”? It’s as easy as “1, 2, 3”. 
I suspect the OPer can understand this.
JSS,
This new version of yours with the catch phrase and all is deserving of =D> . That compendium is tricky though; it’s not a 1, 2, 3 walk in the park. However, I still agree with your albeit masculinized vision in both it’s simple and complex forms.
thats because loving one self first is the most important.
life stories comes into many flavors but there only is one and sole dilemma: a generational fear of being
psychoanalysis is a left brain trap
Why?
Doesn’t it work the other way around: Loving another person first an then loving oneself for being able to love, or for being a lover of that other person?
The “easy as 1, 2, 3” bit was facetious. 
And for those unfamiliar with the terms, he who accomplishes such a course of action for even one other being, is in fact a “lord” of and for that being. And thus he who wishes to truly love a true lady, must learn to be a true lord.
And for the Femnazies in the crowd, the same fundamentals also apply to being a true lady, although the outcome is strongly different. This is so because despite propaganda and lustful power aspirations, the male and the female do NOT have the same Need Compendium.
Exactly. The meme “to love others one must first love oneself” was an intentional ploy to entrap people (most specifically women) and socialist governors into loving only themselves, fore once selfishness and power is accomplished, it is very difficult to unlearn or give up via anything but death (just look at Hillary).
To love oneself first, is to love oneself Only and Lonely.
Warlock wrote:
This doesn’t make sense, one sentence belies the other.
How did you hurt or not treat her well.
Given the fact the girl was only 17 (? the age of consent) when you both launched into this romance and she stayed with you for eight years. Those eight years were part of her developmental process, in fact, her father should have discouraged her from a long term relationship at such a young age.
Then, how many years later, you are still at her for the reason WHY she left or it broke down.
She gives you her reasons, which you will not accept and you continue to badger her until she presents you with something more like the fact (only to you) of why she left.
You cheated her out of her girlhood, you should have left years ago.
She is now probably afraid you will expose the intimacy of those eight years on Facebook or in a book and her fears, I suspect are not ungrounded and she senses this.
I hope there is no element of revenge here, Warlock. Shudder
Btw, for the analytical males, perhaps with lordship in mind and heart…
If you want to learn how to love in real terms, do the following intellectual exercises, with a little bit of real practical effort, just to ensure that your theorizing is on track:
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determine exactly what would be required BY YOU to ensure, with near zero doubt, that your car would continue high performance for at least 100 years.
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determine exactly what would be required BY YOU to ensure, with near zero doubt, that your single tomato plant will keep producing tomatoes for at least 100 years.
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determine exactly what would be required BY YOU to ensure, with near zero doubt, that your dog would live happily for at least 100 years.
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determine exactly what would be required BY YOU to ensure, with near zero doubt, that your wife would live happily for at least 100 years.
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determine exactly what would be required BY YOU to ensure, with near zero doubt, that your life would be happily for at least 200 years.
And if you can’t figure any of that out, you might want to examine just how deserving of love you really are yourself.
But I’ll give a hint to those 5 exercises:
They all have the same, fairly complex answer.
There was a qualifier you missed… Treat her as well as I feel that I should have. I was depressed for a noticeable amount of the relationship and therefore I didn’t treat her as well as I believe I should have.
She was also 18, it was the summer before she started college, when we first got romantic. I didn’t approach her this time around, her father encouraged her to call me… I hadn’t asked about her or thought about her for quite a while.
We broke up a little under 9 years ago and yes I still had questions, because she wasn’t decent enough to be honest with me. I’m currently reflecting on life, dealing with my experiences. This means that I’m trying to understand those experiences, so I can better understand myself.
She gave me a reason, just like she did before. I believe it to be false, just like before. She validated my prior belief by admitting that the original reasons were indeed “bullshit” according to her own words.
It’s not the intimate details that she is afraid of, it’s the fear of having to face her previous actions. She believes that her actions were wrong and therefore doesn’t wish to be judged. She has been trying to hide from her conscience since before we broke up. She has learned to cope by denying and escaping.
If my intention was revenge or to be vindictive… I would already have what I want. She is a miserable person and has been for many years… This doesn’t give me enjoyment, it makes me sad, I don’t like seeing people suffer.
Ultimately, I’m going to do what my conscience tells me to do. At this point, it’s telling me to be open and honest, to share my experiences, no matter how embarrassing, painful, hurtful, etc…
I’m tired of being manipulated and controlled by other people and their own personal issues that get projected onto me. It’s time for me to be true to my nature and follow my conscience.
what you say makes sense but, if one does not love one self, one will keep buming into lovers/partners that will teach us that, to love one self because reality is holographic.
what you say can only work out if all people involved in the relationship grasp this, so it works both ways equally. It is all about awareness. But loving the other first, if neglecting what I convey here, is just unworkable, will lead to emotional co-dependency.
Love of self is most important since it requires to know thyself so to speak. Sovereignty is key. It is impossible to have somebody doing the job for one A lack of self love impedes love’s expression however.
look at the world, on a larger scale, helping nations has gone nowhere.
I get what you’re attempting to say… especially point 3(g).
My intention isn’t to screw with her, I was conscious enough to avoid doing so in our conversations. I’m simply processing things… just because I ask philosophical questions doesn’t automatically translate into me acting on my thoughts.
Where I currently see things is… I must love myself first, which means being true to myself. Even if this may cause others discomfort, pain, damage, etc… By not being true to myself, I will only be inflicting these negatives onto my own psyche.
Actions have consequences and we must accept responsibilities for the things we do and/or have done, even if our intentions doesn’t correspond to the results. She must deal with the consequences of her actions, just as I must deal with the consequences of being true to my nature (I.e. being open and honest about my experiences). If I attempt to protect her, I will not be completely open and honest.
I cannot control anyone but myself. Which is exactly what I plan to do, follow my personal code and let other people figure shit out for themselves. It’s about time I be more selfish and love myself before worrying about others.
I would advise otherwise. Who wants a guy who is in love with himself (a narcissist)?
What you (and damn near every male on the planet) needs is a higher goal or purpose to which you are seriously devoted. That purpose is what you “love first”. When and if a she comes along who can love you for being that man so devoted to that purpose, then she will love herself for being someone so devoted (aka “in love”) to him and his purpose. That is what having a “wife” means, aka “helpmate”.
In a philosophical sense, she who is devoted to he who is devoted is a wife, married in spirit.
If you are not true to yourself, what can you offer to anyone besides lies. Loving yourself isn’t necessarily narcissism and narcissism isn’t necessarily loving yourself.
I want to love myself, because love means unconditional acceptance, respect, care, etc… If I can’t do this for myself, how can I truly do it for others?
I have purpose in this world. I help people be the best they can be. I’ve impacted hundreds of people in the past 6 years, I have dozens of these people tell me as much, without solicitation. I didn’t love myself during this period either, I just did what came natural to me… I know I can do more though, unfortunately it’s very difficult when you’re too busy hating yourself… Doing so because of all the conditioning, acculturation, indoctrination and unrealized expectations placed upon you.
Maybe I haven’t been clear either, but I do not seek to get back with this woman. I’ve come to realize that I never actually loved her… I was in love with the concept of being in love and being loved back. I mean yes, I do love every human being, but I’m not in love with them, if that makes sense to you. My true nature is to want to help her, but it’s no more than I want to help anyone else.
To illustrate what I’m speaking of, tomorrow I will be making a video in which I’m cutting my hair and beard (2 + years worth of growth) to help raise funds for a student that lost her father unexpectedly. Then I will be donating the hair to locks of love. That is my true nature and I do it because I love myself enough to follow my conscience. When I didn’t love myself, I was depressed and apathetic to those around me, that’s what I mean when I talk about loving myself… Not being a narcissist that only cares about themself.
That isn’t the kind of goal to which I was referring. And being “true to oneself” can mean several things (depending on who is saying it). Don’t deceive yourself, but then again, don’t make yourself your highest goal either.
But if that is what you have been convinced to do…
Warlock,
As long as you do not mean with reference to everything. Life IS change you know.
I don’t personally think that that spells out selfish ~~ it might be part of a particularly right way in which to love one’s self ~~unless another is thoughtlessly and callously harmed as a result of it. Sometimes selfish gains can backfire and the consequences are also harmful to ourselves.
Your true nature being…?
I’m not so sure that I agree with you there. It seems to be a "dog-eat-dog world often to me. … though we can say that particular individuals have evolved that way.
As for the first part, I completely understand that experience.
…and insofar as those who feel they don’t NEED it nor WANT it? Like your old girlfriend?
I understand this. Writing gives us clarity. Sharing stories helps us to realize that we are not alone, not the only ones who have had our personal experiences and they muddled through and transcended, or plowed through, however you wish to think of it. Good luck with your book.
Just remember with a little MORE money you can reach MORE people. Don’t sell yourself short.
I’m a firm believer, or at least i try to be lol, of seeing as many different perspective as possible.
You left out “emotional” growth, which is important.
I have found that the above is true. We only "know’ or “intuit” based on who we are in the moment, how we flow.
We’re a stubborn bunch. No one liked to have their “apple cart” so to speak, overturned. We’re sometimes uncomfortable with new information or we don’t like what we ‘see’ of ourselves.
…and yet I recall in one of your posts to someone you mentioning that when your book was written you would send her a copy.
You might simply let her know that you wrote it and ask if she might want to read it. What’s the worse which can happen if she says "No, don’t bother?
No, we’re not all malleable. Why, because we don’t realize that we can be. But isn’t it interesting and fun the work which we have to do on ourselves, the great explorations and discoveries about ourselves? We’re all works in progress ~~ mini universes.
I don’t know if I agree with that. Maybe we’re meant to miss “something”. It makes us strive more. Maybe I’m wrong.
I also don’t think that as human beings we’re “supposed lol to be” completely happy and content. For the same above reason.
Why do you prefer at these times to be alone?
I agree more or less with the second part. At the same time, some of us rather enjoy our aloneness and our own presence more than being with many others.
As for the first question, how about a harmony of both?
Yes, we’re like the icebergs. More, much more, is hidden “beneath”. We need to dive down and explore ourselves. It is ourselves who are the final frontier or again, like mini universes which need to be explored, peered into with the telescopic lenses of our intellects and emotions - along with great honesty and courage to confront ourselves, to know ourselves.
Sometimes we can become aware of things through reflection but you know this.
I think that we can, in a sense, look on our actions and words as accidents because we were not at the time paying close attention. This is why accidents occur. We leap before we look, we don’t question things before we move. We need to try to “make sense” of our actions, to go back in time to our origins, our roots, to find many answers. This is also what you’re doing I think.
I can’t recall his exact words, but Rumi said something to the effect of learning to live with our questions, our unanswered question. And at some moment, we will come to know the truth of them. This, I know, is a very difficult thing to do but I intuit that there is great wisdom in that. I don’t mean not wanting to have answers but there are some which we can’t know the answers to NOW.
Is it possible we kind of slide into these answers as a result of eventually learning more about ourselves and just relaxing with the questions. I think more comes to us in moments of relaxation than in moments of “holding on” and trying to squeeze out answers. After all, our psyches are not lemons, are they?
Are you sure that on some unconscious level, you did not say something to her which might make her believe you might want to hurt her? I’m not saying it’s true but think about it. We can all do things like that to manipulate and to get our own way.
True about the puppy. All situations are different. We live in the moment.
And yes, our so-called guilty consciences sometimes make us see something which isn’t there.
I think that the phrase “being true to myself” is a lot like the phrase loving myself. Would you agree with me if I say that acting on that - being true to myself - can cause unnecessary pain to others?
A guy might think that 'being true to himself" means beating his wife and kids because they don’t conform to what he thinks they “should” based on who he thinks and feels he is.
A rapist might be true to himself because he feels he has a right to rape based on his lust for power for feelings of insecurity.
I know Shakespeare wrote those words (I think) but do we ever stop to really consider the consequences to that "belief"system?
THIS is the Rumi quote. Boy, was I way off.
“Be patient toward all that is unsolved in your heart and try to love the questions themselves, like locked rooms and like books that are now written in a very foreign tongue. Do not now seek the answers, which cannot be given you because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answer.”
There is such beautiful wisdom in that …for me. Profound.
I really don’t think that we have much choice in the matter since the more we fight and struggle over certain issues, the more that Gordian Knot tightens around us.
That’s not to say that we can’t take a step back observe certain things for a little while, then release, relax, let go.
Then in some distant day…voila…an epiphany, a realization unfolds.
I’ll get back to you in a couple days on all of this… that’s a lot of effort to reply and I’m trying to focus on something else currently. I’m trying to process a bunch of things and while a distraction might be nice, I have to deal with my sister trying to manipulate me into not writing my story, because she hasn’t dealt with her own demons.
I actually don’t know you that well, so I can’t comment…
I will say shortly though, that the type of energy you give off by going to the parents first, might have interfered with her rebellion tendencies …
I’m pretty subdued in my psychoanalysis, but actually, I’m usually spot on… It’s not something you can recover from, so don’t bother!!
That’s also spot on … Leave her alone and move on…
As Gibran says in “the prophet”, it’s the people who grew up with you “home” that are unimpressed with your changes!
Bring some new energy in your life
warlock, if you associate self-love with narcissism, ll you will get (or seek) is co-dependency.
The love of Self also implies a motion of self-forgiveness and objective Self Image . Most people in a romantic relationship do not achieve Self-Love but rather seek a confirmation of their own subjective reality. Love requires emotional self-sufficiency first. All the greatest spiritualists agree on that.
Humanitarian aid is a failure because of this. The judeo-chritian ethics, altruism, is not entirely correct.