a new understanding of today, time and space.

Hmm, lets see, so you were one of those hyperreactionary guys who was easily manipulated by sensationalist news. That’s reassuring. Anyway, enough with the adhoms.

You say “happiness doesnt make you feel in love”? I think that’s false.
You fall in love with someone because of your feelings. Its circular. Cause and effect, is Effect and cause.

You list the purpose of life as reproduction. So the purpose is to reproduce endlessly? Why? You might as well say the purpose is to color your house purple. I mean, there’s no real value attached to either purpose.

It would make more sense, if the purpose would be, to make constructions, ie. say, the purpose is not merely to reproduce, but to make constructions, make the species last long enough to comprehend what needs to be comprehended about the universe, and evolve past the chimps that they currently are.

You are thinking of Thomas Aquinas, but that argument was flawed anyway.

You have things a bit scrambled in all of that, but most of it has nothing to do with the happiness issue.

Happiness is a particular state of mind and heart that let’s your conscious know that things seem to be going okay from the more subconscious perspective. It is like the House letting the Senate know that they have no serious complaints. To say that happiness is not necessary is to say that the House should always complain and never show any sign of being satisfied. From that, the Senate would lose any perspective as to which kinds of things would make anything better, because everything would get the same response.

Happiness and the other states of mind and heart are just other complex parts of creation. No big deal. But when you leave them out, you literally lose your mind and heart.

Aristotle talks about the unmoved mover and gives arguments for the unmoved mover,
in both, Metaphysics and his book, Physics.

Kropotkin

The unmoved mover is not gravity.

Okay, but I still don’t see what any of this has to do with happiness.

Aristotle spoke of a First Principle as the “unmoved mover whose necessary existence underpins the ceaseless activity of the world of motion” (as do I). Aquinas spoke of a First Mover as the Unmoved Mover who began the universe. Aquinas is talking about regression through time. Aristotle is talking about regression through the hierarchy of logical reasoning.

… yeah, and gravity doesn’t qualify.

My version of what you are talking about is this - God, The Creator.

God is Love. Love, is gravity. God…is Gravity.

As we know, life in our neck of the woods, has been around for 3 billion years and
animals as we know it, for over 500 million years. Has evolution been a drive for perfection?
No, it is about survival of the species. With each step of evolution, we have become slightly
better in some aspect of survival. Life developed improving techniques for survival.
Motion is one such aspect, the animal that can move slightly faster than another, can
increase its chances of survival and if species can move slightly faster, the species can
increase it changes of survival. Or if enough creatures/animals in one species can adapt
quickly enough to changing environmental changes, it can better survive those changing conditions.
But this is all evolution 101, but what of non physical adaption methods. I would class
two aspects of this type, one is thinking, the brain and its ability to think out an solution
and the other is emotions. Recall we have over 500 million years of life improving its chances
of survival, (not perfection) So emotions must play an evolutionary role in our survival that
has allowed us to survive to this point. We can see the evolutionary point of such instincts
as fight or flight, but what about such emotions such as love, anger, hate, pity, sadness, among
others. These emotions have clearly helped us adapt better to changing conditions or they (emotions)
would not still be in humans. As a thought experiment, try to imagine dinosaurs with our emotions.
A t-rex with sadness or anger or hate or pity. …

I cannot imagine such animals having a need for such emotions as pity. imagine a t-rex with pity
and feeling pity while chasing down a deer like creature like bambi. That emotion might prevent
the t-rex from catching and killing bambi and thus may lead to starvation. Emotions for such hunting
animals such as a t-rex or shark or lion might end their chances of survival. a hunting animal such as
a shark cannot have such an emotion as pity, but humans, we are a hunting animal and yet do have
pity and love and sadness. We must have those emotions because it did aid in or help our survival
as a species. We see emotions in animals such as dogs and cats, we can see anger in dogs and cats,
(don’t feed a cat at its dinner time and you will find out what anger really is)
It is quite possible it is BECAUSE of emotions, human beings are the so called top of the food chain.
But we are also rational creatures. Aristotle called humans, a rational animal. so we can think and
rationalize moments and events and people. this has helped our survival as a species. So the ongoing
struggle between the two, the rational and the emotional, which has gone on for thousands of years is
just a struggle between two sides of the same coin, a means of survival as a species.
Without one or the other, human beings die out, millions of years ago. Perhaps that is why
such hominids as the neanderthal and homo erectus did not survive. They did not have either enough
rational thought or enough emotions or perhaps both. We shall never know but evolution has made
it clear, we need both to survive.

Kropotkin

Interestingly enough, generation after generation complains how the younger generation simply doesn’t get it.

Interestingly enough, generation after generation complains how the younger generation simply doesn’t get it.

OK, after a couple days of work ( a four letter word to be sure)
I return.

We have many disciplines that humans use to understand human activity,
(in no particular order) we have biology, economics, history, philosophy,
psychology, sociology, politics, to name a few. If we were actually animals,
primates, I don’t think we would need such an array of tools to identify who we
are and what we need. I don’t believe I have seen a chimp with a book which it
needs to identify the various activities of a chimp.
What would a chimp do with a book on economics or politics?
Or cats? I don’t believe I have ever seen my cat have a need to look through
books to find out what is necessary to a cat to learn.

Let us take one branch of our studies and look into it, economics.
We have courses and plenty of books which explain human economic activity.
The role of the money and the role of government in the creation of money.
Let us look into this even further, humans have had 8 economic systems
since the beginning, pop quiz, name the 8. Anyway the most successful
was the first, hunter/ gatherer. that system lasted for most of human history
which dates back over a million years and lasted roughly to 10,000 years ago (give or take)
Those who proclaim capitalism as the best system ever probably don’t even understand
that humans have had 8 economic systems. We have had 8 systems which suggest we can have
more than 8. As technologies change and as resources change, we can very easily change into
one or more economic systems. Would the hominids that existed under the hunter/gatherer
system even begin to understand our current economic system? I seriously doubt it and I doubt
current hominids would understand the economic system that will exist a couple of thousands of
years from now. As we have had plenty of economic systems, we have had plenty of political
systems. Would anyone care to guess the political system of America, one hundred years from now?
I suggest it won’t look anything like todays system. I would suggest that the political and economic
system of one hundred years from now will look vastly different and that is because of actions we
are taking today. This evolution of a country, economic and political and social, is occurring right now,
right here. I have already stated publicly that a civil war is coming to America and the winner
of that civil war will change the course of America. The next civil war will simply be a replay of the
original civil war without the slaves. Expand your vision of the past, present and future.
what is today may not be tomorrow.

Kropotkin

One of the human aspects we study is something called ethics.
What is ethics? It is the study of human behavior and we how we treat
each other. The rules of human behavior can be reduced to such
idea’s such as the golden rule “treat someone as you would be treated by them”.
We have such idea’s as the ten commandments, thou shall not…kill for example
and… thou shall not steal. these rules of ethics have played a considerable role in
the study of ethics and the laws of each country.

Now we have a second idea which is the meaning/purpose of life is the pursuit of happiness.
I believe these two idea in conflict have created a great many issues we face right now.

What if you pursuit of happiness clashes with the rules of behavior as given by “thou
shall not steal”. What if your happiness depends on your stealing someone else’s wife?
You have a conflict between your happiness and thou shall not steal or covet another man’s wife.
How do you resolve this conflict? What is more important, your happiness or the rules?

How would we handle this conflict? We could do one of two things, One: remove rules.
even in an anarchist paradise, we need rules, we just need rules as defined by ourselves
and not an impersonal and far away government. So we cannot remove rules from society,
so we are left with removing the idea that life is the pursuit of happiness.
What else is there, one may ask?

We can remove the idea that life is the pursuit of happiness by understanding what
humans are actually doing. We are part and parcel of life, we are one with the earth
and all its creatures for we are another creature of earth, like lions and tigers and bears, oh my.
That leaves us with evolutionary reasons for our existence and that is simply the perpetuation
and continuation of the species. Like all the other species on earth, we simple exist to
continue the human species. We abide by the evolutionary reason for species existence which
is the continuation of species. It is nothing more complicated than that. We remove any mystical
and false belief in a metaphysical existence. We are of this earth, for this earth and by this earth.
It doesn’t need our happiness for the species to continue on and it doesn’t require some
fanciful metaphysical explanation for our existence. We are simply following evolution. if we
accept this idea, then the rules that we have must change to accommodate this idea that the
reason for existence is simply the perpetuation and continuation of the species. If it is no longer
about our happiness, we no longer need to chase such silly notions such as our pursuit of goods,
I.E the person who dies with the most toys, wins. this notion of gaining materials goods is no longer
true if we understand the purpose of life is not our happiness, but the continuation of the species is
the purpose of life, then the pursuit of materials goods is a damaging and harmful to the real
purpose of life. Ethics as we know it, changes dramatically if we change the purpose of life.

Kropotkin

Everything is connected in space, and across time, every moment is but another moment that is transitory, our atoms are near eternal…

At some point you realize that none of this gets you anywhere, because all you’re doing is trying to excuse yourself for having values and for having the need to assert and act on them singularly, “out of (some) context”. You want go be forgiven for being alive-- sorry, no such luck, that “forgiveness” does not exist (except were it is already lacking).

Realize that much of what passes for philosophy or politics or war is simply a desire to be forgiven a “sin” of existing at all.

Filling your head with many perspectives isn’t philosophy. Philosophy is what you do with the perspectives you’ve got. And this “moral” space exists in an entirely “amoral” context, just like the “unmoved mover”. There is a deep disconnect which cannot be reconciled to those which it divorces from each other and structurally keeps apart; out of that situation arises everything.

If you put down all your conceptual tools and baggage and clutter, for a few moments, and take a quiet free breath, you may begin to see what I’m talking about.

Thinking (as it is being practiced here) is merely an excuse to go to war, and even peace or pacifism or humanism or whatever such view is only a war against war, which inevitably becomes among the most vicious.

I don’t believe in sin and shall be commenting on that, at some point.

Kropotkin

I don’t mean the “belief”.

I have multiple times requested some sort of evidence that god exists.
I have never received anything that would suggest that god exists. I have asked where does god resides
and haven’t gotten anything even remotely close to a coherent answer. He resides in our hearts and
he resides everywhere, are two common answers that mean nothing. but a more important question
is this, why does this feeling we have, of some connection to something beyond us exists?
I would suggest we have mistaken the fact that we are star stuff and connected with the universe
because we are made of the same stuff as the universe and mistaken that connection with some
sort of god. We are connected to the universe but it doesn’t need a god for some explanation, it is
simply we are star stuff and that is our connection with the universe, because everything is made of
star stuff and we are connected to everything. We mistake this connection to the universe with some
sort of silly idea of god. We don’t need an explanation of god to understand our connection to the universe.
In fact, I would suggest that this tie to god has damaged us in a multitude of ways. Damaged us in ways
we don’t even understand. We have come to believe that we are separate from the universe but we are
not because we are the exact same thing as the universe. We get confused by the different forms
but those forms are made of the exact same things, atoms. The atoms connect like Lego blocks and
create different forms like cars, tree’s, bikes, humans, cats, stars and stoves. everything looks different
but is actually created by the same stuff that created us. Lego’s is the best way to describe the universe.
Atoms are the Legos of the universe and everything is made of atoms. What we have Interpreted as a spiritual
meaning to the universe is simply our physical, scientific connection to all the other matter in the universe.
Now some misguided soul will claim this is god incarnate, this connection, but they are wrong. There is no god and no proof of god. The universe and the connections of the universe has no need for god. No need to muddle up
the water with some false claim that there is a god and heaven and hell and angels and demons and guilt and sin.
None of that exists and there is simply no proof of any of it. We have simple mistaken one thing for another.
We are material in a material universe. there is no need to posit anything else.

Kropotkin

It is late and I am waiting for the pills to kick in, so if I start drifting,
you know why.

Ethics. How does my thoughts that we are one with star stuff affect ethics?

Ethics, morality, how do I treat my fellow man?
We are the same, you and I. We are just one more form of material that is atoms.
Treating you badly is the same as treating me badly because we came from the same place,
created by the same forces, atoms doing the same things as Lego’s and rebuilding over and over
again. I cannot treat you badly simply because we are the same. the ocean and the sky and the land,
the same building blocks that made you and me. Atoms being busy with different designs but using
the same matter with the same rules of physics and chemistry and biology that runs through everything
else in our solar system. We have a commonality because we exist from the same matter, the same rules,
the same biology, just slightly different form. To damage you is to damage me is to damage every single
other biological entity in our solar system for we are the same and you can add all the inorganic matter
in our universe which arises from the exact processes that created you and me. the question of ethics
just became a whole lot easier because we are one and the same and only a very silly human, would on
purpose, damage themselves. And the pills are doing their magic, so off to bed I go.

Kropotkin

If you properly understand this idea of how the universe is connected,
then certain matters become clearer. for example, asking what is the meaning
of life? What is the meaning of life is one of the cornerstones of human existence.
We all ask it? I have been asking for over 40 years and still haven’t found the answer/
a answer that works. But why? why is finding an answer to the meaning of life so
hard, indeed impossible. We have roughly 7 billion people on planet earth, ask
all 7 billion people, what is the meaning of life and you are likely to get 7 billion answers
AND ALL 7 BILLION ANSWERS COULD BE WRONG! Why? because how would you decide
you have a right answer? By what means and what criteria would use to decide what is
the correct answer to the question of “what is the meaning of life?” The meaning of life is…
how do you know your answer is right? The meaning of life for me is… you have now narrowed
down the question to one person with no way to check on the answer. By answering with
"the meaning of life for me is… you have taken away any universality of the question thus rending
it irrelevant. I could say the meaning of life is watching reruns of the tv show “bones” and by what
standard would I be right or wrong? There is no way to show the correctness or wrongness for any answer
given to the question, what is the meaning of life?

Kropotkin

Why do you keep posting?

Why do you keep telling us things?
You give us your answers about God, the universe, ethics, etc.
Why?

Typical invalid logic. Not knowing that you are right does not make you wrong.

…no way to show it to YOU. The blind cannot see (I hear that is what makes them blind).

So how does this connectedness of the universe influence other aspects
of our lives. If we are connected with the ocean and the sky (and we are)
then how can we in good conscience pollute the earth, sea and sky? We cannot.
it would be like polluting our living room or our bedroom. Science has confirmed
that we are now in the midst of another extinction event. We are risking our very
existence with this extinction event. the earth is a balancing act with each part
needed the other part to stay balance. If one piece fails, it will cause the other
pieces to fail. This morning we celebrate the United States Supreme court actually
doing the right thing, two days in a row, however let us not forget the basic foundation
of our existence. We are looking at events from a purely human perspective and we
are forgetting that we have to also pay attention to the basics which are survival of
the race events. We are tied up in so much crap, we are forgetting to look around.
We are focused too small and need to widen our focus. Which is why understanding
that we are connected to everything helps. We must learn the wisdom to understand
what is really important. anything Kardashian is not important, understanding who we are,
important. Seeing how we are connected to the universe, important and more importantly,
understanding our connection means we must become active participants in our world.
We must balance our lives. We must become environmentalist and conservers of our world
and we must become forward looking and act upon the past, present and future.
It sounds like a difficult task but what is needed is wisdom. the lesson we need to learn
is when do we act and what action is needed. We must become observant of the universe.
To use Nietzsche’s words, we must learn to dance. Dancing requires a soft touch and
a balance and must have a stretching of both intellect and emotional sides of us.
To dance is to become both aware of our environment and our dancing partner.
We can do this. We can learn when to lead and when to follow, when to adjust our
movement. Our dancing partner…the environment, the universe.
You need to learn how to flow and dance with the universe.

those who don’t or won’t understand me, that is ok. I don’t mind.
I can only deal with what I can deal with. The rest is out of my hands.

Kropotkin