What is Civility on ILP

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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby James S Saint » Sat Jan 28, 2017 11:41 am

Wow .. We've been blessed by FJ. :o
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Kriswest » Sat Jan 28, 2017 12:32 pm

You can tell family, closest or old friends to F**k off belligerently and most do not stop being in your life, they still care. We can be very rude to those we know and not have Ilwill. People on these sites begin to know each other and relax etiquette. We know the sock puppets. A society is formed. Having proper civility only could be harmful. A balance can be made if all agree.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:20 pm

Sorry James I am just messing with you.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Uccisore » Sat Jan 28, 2017 4:11 pm

Mowk wrote:The mistake you made is you did not respect my intelligence, as arrogant an accusation as that may be, I simply set a trap guessing you would trip on your own words.


Yeah, it was all part of your ingenious plan to get everybody to laugh at you while I change absolutely nothing. Well played, Moriarity.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Sat Jan 28, 2017 4:45 pm

Wow, a slightly more civil response, don't sell yourself short.

For all your posts in this thread you haven't contributed anything to the topic.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:50 am

Sorry, I don't hear laughing. I'm not. And that's a rather sobering thought.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mictlantecuhtli » Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:53 pm

Given the extremes of censorship by other philosophy and political based forums I would like to thank Carleas for creating a free-thought or free-expression environment here. It's a message to other philosophy forums that there is at least one place on the internet where censorship doesn't prevail.

I hope Carleas continues this same policy going forward.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:34 am

Merlin? Are we talking about the same thing?

Is it your thinking that a request to control bullying is censorship? Like Carleas has said, and I paraphrase. Civility is not so much about what is said but how it is said. Does the mention that people are just laughing at you support an argument in good failth? It may very well be the case but it has nothing to do with the argument If X then not Y. If I am confused a little about what Y is, you're not making a case for it by claiming people are laughing at your opponent. It also says a lot about the rigor of the argument.

I am interested in that thinking. Draw me a picture with your words.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mictlantecuhtli » Mon Jan 30, 2017 2:03 am

Mowk wrote:Merlin? Are we talking about the same thing?

Is it your thinking that a request to control bullying is censorship? Like Carleas has said, and I paraphrase. Civility is not so much about what is said but how it is said. Does the mention that people are just laughing at you support an argument in good failth? It may very well be the case but it has nothing to do with the argument If X then not Y. If I am confused a little about what Y is, you're not making a case for it by claiming people are laughing at your opponent. It also says a lot about the rigor of the argument.

I am interested in that thinking. Draw me a picture with your words.



Censorship is a form of bullying or intimidation on an intellectual scale.

Some irrational people need to be laughed off stage and have their foolishness pointed out.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:11 am

Merlin, I am not laughing. Can you tell me please specifically why you feel I should be laughed off the stage? What foolishness am being accused of suffering? Make your case without having to laugh at me. If you were being true and earnest, laugh is an inappropriate response. Laugh at a funeral cause you and only you were in on the joke. That is laughing with. You aren't doing that. You are showing a condescending attitude, that is what I would question as, not in good faith.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mictlantecuhtli » Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:32 am

Mowk wrote:Merlin, I am not laughing. Can you tell me please specifically why you feel I should be laughed off the stage? What foolishness am being accused of suffering? Make your case without having to laugh at me. If you were being true and earnest, laugh is an inappropriate response. Laugh at a funeral cause you and only you were in on the joke. That is laughing with. You aren't doing that. You are showing a condescending attitude, that is not in good faith.

You like a few others here are international communists and Marxists under the banner of state democracy as disguise. That for me is enough to warrant a ghastly laugh.

(That disguise by the way no longer works as everybody is starting to figure our your collective aim and endgame for what it is. The jig is up.)

Are you satisfied with my answer? (Probably not)

I don't really concern myself with propriety. For me nothing is taboo.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Mon Jan 30, 2017 4:03 am

You like a few others here are international communists and Marxists under the banner of state democracy as disguise. That for me is enough to warrant a ghastly laugh.

(That disguise by the way no longer works as everybody is starting to figure our your collective aim and endgame for what it is. The jig is up.)

Are you satisfied with my answer? (Probably not)

I don't really concern myself with propriety. For me nothing is taboo.


Joker; a mystic hermit.

Take this apart for me, Your words haven't drawn a picture yet, in what ever deconstruction diagram you are comfortable with. Take some time, Carleas wasn't wrong, it does take some effort to get your ass beyond jargon. However pretty and such it may sound.

"I am and there are a few others that are"; " international communists and Marxists under the banner of state democracy as disguise." Somehow I don't think even Ucci thinks you are helping him at the moment. But "you" are on your own bandwagon.

That is a serious accusation. In my defense, I have voted in every election since I could. I nether voted for or against Hillary or Trump. Remember I garden and have a sort of relationship with earth, but I digress. It could be a disguise. If there is question, it wasn't a good one. And you, you crafty dog spotted iI.Makes an American proud. I would be impressed by anyone who could pull that off. And quite possibly more so by the person who could accurately assess it if it were the case.f While I have traveled to three other countries in my lifetime, I would consider me a few short of international, "tourist" need more be said. I realize community is at play sometimes pro and sometimes con but there is still an upward motion to it always in play.

Let's see Marxism, could you be a little more specific then throwing a rather outdated dogma around. And all this is disguised under a banner of state democracy. While I don't believe Ucci gives me enough credit I am inclined to believe you give me way too much. It would take a flipping genius to balance all the ills (some of which the milady is of question) you seem to believe I have in play. I really don't deserve the credit you bestow. I don't know how smart but not that smart. Get real.

Chew me up, spit me out.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mictlantecuhtli » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:08 am

Mowk wrote:
You like a few others here are international communists and Marxists under the banner of state democracy as disguise. That for me is enough to warrant a ghastly laugh.

(That disguise by the way no longer works as everybody is starting to figure our your collective aim and endgame for what it is. The jig is up.)

Are you satisfied with my answer? (Probably not)

I don't really concern myself with propriety. For me nothing is taboo.


Joker; a mystic hermit.

Take this apart for me, Your words haven't drawn a picture yet, in what ever deconstruction diagram you are comfortable with. Take some time, Carleas wasn't wrong, it does take some effort to get your ass beyond jargon. However pretty and such it may sound.

"I am and there are a few others that are"; " international communists and Marxists under the banner of state democracy as disguise." Somehow I don't think even Ucci thinks you are helping him at the moment. But "you" are on your own bandwagon.

That is a serious accusation. In my defense, I have voted in every election since I could. I nether voted for or against Hillary or Trump. Remember I garden and have a sort of relationship with earth, but I digress. It could be a disguise. If there is question it wasn't a good one. Given said implied purpose of said disguise. I would be impressed by anyone who could pull that off. And quite possibly more so by the person who could accurately assess in that quality, if that were the case While I have traveled to three other countries in my lifetime, I would consider me a few short of international, "tourist" need more be said. I realize community is at play sometimes pro and sometimes con but there is still an upward motion to it always in play. Let's see Marxism, could you be a little more specific then throwing a rather outdated dogma around. And all this is disguised under a banner of state democracy. While I don't believe Ucci gives me enough credit I am inclined to believe you give me way too much. It would take a flipping genius to balance all the ills (some of which the milady is of question) you seem to believe I have in play. I really don't deserve the credit you bestow. I don't know how smart but not that smart. Get real.

Chew me up, spit me out.


Well, for me since the 1960's liberal democracy in the west has been hijacked by Marxist communists. I say international because the goal by them is eventually a global socialist state.

It seems everywhere in the west we can see liberal democrats supporting globalist projects like the E.U. in Europe and NAFTA of the United States. (Then there is the TPP of the south pacific.)

Some radical Marxists assert things on identity like there is no such thing as race or the assimilation of all racial and cultural identity under the state's directive. They'll also say there is no sexual identity between men and women making it where there is only one unisex identity.

So yes, I believe liberal democracy in the west has been hijacked by radical globalist communists or Marxists. Every time I talk to a liberal democrat more and more they purely sound identical to communists or Marxists.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:19 am

Sorry, I did not mean to be dismissive,

I was born in 1959 so the 60's rely on memory. My memory of early childhood is peppered only by vague recollections personally,. Duck and cover. DDT is perfectly safe, and our nuclear testing shouldn't cause any problems. Cigarettes? Enjoy. no problems there. So I can sort of imagine empathy toward your concern.

I am dumb, remember, I just haven't been on this planet long enough, uni, it feels like again and again, explain it to me like I were your ten year old nephew, who you always thought was a sort of twit. Slow down, I'll give you the time. I'd guess it is quite probably more complicated then rocket science.

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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mictlantecuhtli » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:36 am

Mowk wrote:Sorry, I did not mean to be dismissive,

I was born in 1959 so the 60's rely on memory. My memory of early childhood is peppered only by vague recollections personally,. Duck and cover. DDT is perfectly safe, and our nuclear shouldn't cause any problems. Cigarettes? Enjoy. no problems there. So I can sort of imagine empathy toward your concern.

I am dumb, remember, explain it to me like I were your ten year old nephew, who you always thought was a sort of twit. Slow down, I'll give you the time. I'd guess it is quite probably more complicated then rocket science.

Anarchist have huge hearts, They are courageous beyond knowing.


I really don't know of any way I can slow things down even more for you in explaining things but I of course understand you just want to obstruct and obfuscate any attempt at conversation here. DDT?

If I have to slow things down for you even further then perhaps I could just say philosophy isn't for you.

Now you're being condescending towards anarchists? Interesting, it's of course not surprising given how communists and Marxists have treated us in the past. ;)
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:44 am

See, that is where you misunderstand. Philosophy is not some exulted quest. It is for All.

If I ask you to slow down and explain your reasoning it is not because I don't understand, It is because you haven't made a case, and I feel you can use the time productively.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mictlantecuhtli » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:50 am

Mowk wrote:See, that is where you misunderstand. Philosophy is not some exhausted state. It is for everyone.

If I ask you to slow down and explain your reasoning it is not because I don't understand, It is because you haven't made a case, and I feel you can use the time productively. James L. Walker?

I agree philosophy should be accessible to everybody but there are some out there that can't understand or grasp it. I don't think your mind is that slow where comments about me slowing things I figure is just your way of condescension or detracting. I could be incorrect of course and you could change my mind on all that.

I haven't made a case? Have you not looked at what I've said previously? Are you intentionally ignoring what I've said? Congratulations, you know of one of my old usernames. Everybody here knows including Carleas about the numerous old usernames I've had. No real new revelation there concerning ILP.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Mon Jan 30, 2017 6:02 am

Merlin, I am spent. There is no way I can give your query it's due respect. I will be back.

Even if it is not a capacity, to all, it remains an endeavor for all.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mictlantecuhtli » Mon Jan 30, 2017 6:07 am

Mowk wrote:Merlin, I am spent. There is no way I can give your query it's due respect. I will be back.

Even if it is not a capacity, to all, it remains an endeavor for all.

Looking forward to your reply and next encounter.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Mon Jan 30, 2017 6:19 am

May I slow down as well. I'm going to read you three times before I respond; 5' ll" is as short as it is. It is still short.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mictlantecuhtli » Mon Jan 30, 2017 6:45 am

Mowk wrote:May I slow down as well. I'm going to read you three times before I respond; 5' ll" is as short as it is. It is still short.


Whatever works for you.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Mon Jan 30, 2017 4:35 pm

Thanks Merlin, I have some time, probably not enough.

I agree philosophy should be accessible to everybody but there are some out there that can't understand or grasp it. I don't think your mind is that slow where comments about me slowing things I figure is just your way of condescension or detracting.


I may very well just 'be' that slow. It is prudent to ask that of myself every once in a while, I did not intend the condescension or distraction. I'll work on changing your mind on all that.

I haven't made a case? Have you not looked at what I've said previously? Are you intentionally ignoring what I've said? Congratulations, you know of one of my old usernames. Everybody here knows including Carleas about the numerous old usernames I've had. No real new revelation there concerning ILP.


Sorry you have made "a" case, and I didn't get it. So let me back up a to what you've stated as you request.

Given the extremes of censorship by other philosophy and political based forums I would like to thank Carleas for creating a free-thought or free-expression environment here. It's a message to other philosophy forums that there is at least one place on the internet where censorship doesn't prevail.


Working forward from here. I asked if we are talking about the same thing. The topic is civility and I'm confused my the mention of censorship. I don't believe I am asking Carleas to censor a subject or topic.

Censorship is a form of bullying or intimidation on an intellectual scale.


I suppose it is a form of. So if I feel tactics like derogatory and demeaning language and saying people are laughing at you are bullying and intimidation on an intellectual scale, and censorship is a form, I'm still not asking Carleas to act as a censor.

You like a few others here are international communists and Marxists under the banner of state democracy as disguise. That for me is enough to warrant a ghastly laugh.

(That disguise by the way no longer works as everybody is starting to figure our your collective aim and endgame for what it is. The jig is up.)


This is where I wanted to slow down. That sounds like name calling and the use of language that is intended as derogatory and demeaning. I guess I am not sure what you mean by Me and a few others are international communists and Marxists under a banner of state democracy as a disguise. I have read what you've said but I am not getting your meaning, it is occluded by the name calling, can you phrase the thinking without the string of labels? Can you specifically address how I evidence these characteristics?

Well, for me since the 1960's liberal democracy in the west has been hijacked by Marxist communists. I say international because the goal by them is eventually a global socialist state.

It seems everywhere in the west we can see liberal democrats supporting globalist projects like the E.U. in Europe and NAFTA of the United States. (Then there is the TPP of the south pacific.)

Some radical Marxists assert things on identity like there is no such thing as race or the assimilation of all racial and cultural identity under the state's directive. They'll also say there is no sexual identity between men and women making it where there is only one unisex identity.

So yes, I believe liberal democracy in the west has been hijacked by radical globalist communists or Marxists. Every time I talk to a liberal democrat more and more they purely sound identical to communists or Marxists.


Essentially you are calling me a hippy.

With regard to race and my question of it and your criticism; Physical Anthropologists and Archeologists have this theory that we began as a species "human" from a common ancestral pairing. Races developed from differentiation as we moved around the planet and were exposed to different conditions. So yeah, I think it is sort of an odd phenomenon, that today we make our cultural and environment differentiation a distinction. When early man was in struggle for territory and resources, it was a common practice to kill all the males and rape all the females. That process mixed the genetic make up of the resulting survivors into a more homogeneous collection. We have a single origin, have differentiated, remixed, for likely our entire history as mankind on this planet. And it is quite likely the process will naturally result in a single race eventually, if we don't become extinct before then. (why I lean towards Green, but even that party looses much of its appeal by the time politics gets involved.) I am not clear why you think it is a problem. We go have gone out and explored and come together again to shared what we've become in the process. I too would be concerned if I thought it was under a state directive like Arianism.

To your argument of globalism. We have developed technology that allows us to move much more freely about the planet. There is no longer the geological isolation that caused us to develop into different races in the first place. We have begun the natural and historical process of remixing as a result, a sort of home coming, if you will. It is time, I think, that we share what we have become in the process. We have only had this technology for a short time relatively speaking. As a natural cycle it seems inevitable. I am not going to get all intelligent design on you, but it is an awareness that has colored my view of the world at large. I do start to wonder myself. If it happened entirely by accident, It is even more impressive.

So I am liberal, if this sort of thinking is what makes a person liberal. I am not strictly speaking a democrat, while I have leaned in that direction it isn't a party thing for me. I simply have agreed in the past with some key ideas expressed by democrats in the democratic/republican war in play. This home coming is not an easy thing to do. From a political perspective, I do see the need, in this reintegration, for ideas gleaned from socialism and communism as potentially helpful, but by the time they get turned into a party platform, I find the party practice, so far, a failure. Not so much because of the ideology, but our performance at it.

The corruption of it, democracy, socialism or communism, is not a flavor that I find appealing, but if I were to have to eat one, democracy is my choice.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mictlantecuhtli » Mon Jan 30, 2017 6:57 pm

Will respond back at a later period when I have more free time.
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Arminius » Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:59 pm

What civility on ILP is?
In the Occidental civilization as the nihilistic form of the Occidental culture?
Well (and unfortunately), to most ILP members, it is the invitation to destroy ILP. :o
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Re: What is Civility on ILP

Postby Mowk » Tue Jan 31, 2017 5:02 am

Arminius wrote:What civility on ILP is?
In the Occidental civilization as the nihilistic form of the Occidental culture?
Well (and unfortunately), to most ILP members, it is the invitation to destroy ILP. :o


I am just going to grab on to the part I think I understand.

Well (and unfortunately), to most ILP members, it is the invitation to destroy ILP.


Isn't that a bit melodramatic? This ragtag collection of differently focused thinkers is going to be destroyed by such a "fill in the blank" question? Gee we are fucked. Not.

My wife's advice...."keep bailing", but she can say it in such a loving way, and really only sees the picture, looking south. I am facing her looking north and we bicker about which direction is right. Whimsy in play.
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