Is the ongoing punishment of Adam and Eve justifiable?

Jews know this but somehow the Christians missed it.

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Deuteronomy 24:16 (ESV) "Fathers shall not be put to death because of their children, nor shall children be put to death because of their fathers. Each one shall be put to death for his own sin.

The declaration which says that God visits the sins of the fathers upon the children is contrary to every principle of moral justice. [Thomas Paine, The Age of Reason]

Christians are so keen to ride their scapegoat Jesus into heaven that they forget that Jesus, a Jewish Rabbi, would tell them that they are choosing Satan’s ways and not his.

Regards
DL

I show where I stand and position and leave it to dissenters to show theirs.

Like here, if asked, I show the good I see as well as the evil, and show my verdict.

You are quite slow to show your verdict and thus promote the immorality of the religions you do not condemn.

As Jesus said, be hot or cold. Get off the fence.

Regards
DL

They may not have the concept formally, but they, like nearly everyone else confuse guilt with love and self-hatred with some positive form of humility. And let’s not forget shame.
There are a lot of ways to undermine someone and Judaism competes quite well the Christianity.

I do not see Jews competing with Christianity. They mostly ignore Christians from what I can see. That or try to show Christians where they went wrong but most Christians ignore this as if they have forgotten where Christianity plagiarized it’s religion from.

The Abrahamic cults, Christianity, Islam and Judaism, do not respect each others contradicting views.

Gnostic Christians like me dislike their ideologies and say that the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian and we do not mind arguing our case. Those who can discern a good ideology from a poor one will agree. That is why they use Inquisitions and Jihad to grow while Gnostic Christians just use sound and moral arguments. They could not best us and resorted to murdering us.

Regards
DL

Greatest I Am,

I am going to whittle this down quite a bit here.

Let us leave God out of this …or not.

Is there any way in which you can look at the above and learn from it, derive any truth or wisdom at all from it?

Yes.

If I did not already, I would not use the quote.

There is some cases where the children will suffer from their parents actions, but to legislate or demand that suffering is immoral.

Regards
DL

Greatest I Am,

I show where I stand and position and leave it to dissenters to show theirs.

Can you please remind me of the good which you see. Point it out because I am missing it.

Yes perhaps I am. How can there even be a verdict when the waters are so muddied by misunderstandings, biases, so much tunnel vision. For crying out loud, we blame a God for things which we ourselves have done and are doing. The Bible is, erroneously, to many more or less the exact inspiration and voice of God. We believe this instead of coming to realize that it is no more nor less the voices of those who lived back then and interpreted their world according to their beliefs and cultures. If you are going to condemn and hand down a verdict, hand it down on individuals who deserve it ~~ those who have not learned anything from the past and who insist on following the same patterns antiquated patterns because it suits their desires and purpose.

You talk about cherry picking. It seems to me that this is what you are doing.
Things are not so black and white and I really do not like to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

So you agree with Christ about that? Is hot or cold like black and white? Are there never any gray areas albeit there are times when one cannot be on the fence.

Do you actually believe that a God is responsible for all of the wrongs in this world?

Karpel Tunnel wrote:

In Genesis 5 it tells you Adam and Eve not only had Cain and Abel and Seth, it says they had other sons and daughters. Adam married his sister, basically, they both had the same Creator. They married their sisters. You have to keep reading to find out where they came from. He took one of his sisters with him. Abraham married his half sister, Sara.

It is never stated that these were the wives or if the timing is right. But let’s say it is…
then it is incest.
One can then say that only later was incest labelled bad by God.
But then this means that morals are arbritrary.
Incest is OK for a while, then not OK.
Cause I said so.

And the Bible never says they married their sisters.
Process of elimination indicates this.
But then, if we are going to decide certain things must be the case but are left out,
perhaps other things are left out.
Like others were made.

Mostly, yes. Imaginary Gods.

youtube.com/watch?v=ZxoxPapPxXk

If you get off the fence, you will agree.

Regards
DL:

Mostly, yes. Imaginary Gods.
[/quote]
What about what atheist communist regimes and neo-con corporate processes, like those, say, in Latin America carried out by corportions. That easily outdoes in the 20th century deaths related to religion.

I see no reason to assume that the end of the organized religions will get rid of most of the wrongs in the world?

which does not mean i am a fan of them.

Karpel Tunnel wrote:

Genesis 20:2
2 Now Abraham said of Sarah his wife, “She is my sister.”

Intermarriage among close family members was a necessity in the generations immediately following Adam and Noah.

Since God made no one else. And yes, it says that about Abraham, but ‘sister’ often meant any female relative. His nephew Lot is called brother. Furtherh there were whole other groups, like the Cananites, whose land Abraham was given. He could have married one of them. In his lifetime there were also Egyptians. With Adam’s children it is a deiduction that it is sisters. And again the relativeness of the issue with incest is odd. Abraham could have found a wife in another group. God could have made other people for A and E’s sons. Incest isn’t bad in itself, it simply becomes a rule, later. IOW it is not inherently a bad thing. God makes it a rule. Like it’s breaking the rules to touch a football with your hands. We don’t think there is anything inherently wrong with that act, it’s just one of the restrictions in the game. It’s odd that God would make it so heinous after it is not. It is also odd he did not prevent it.

What about what atheist communist regimes and neo-con corporate processes, like those, say, in Latin America carried out by corportions. That easily outdoes in the 20th century deaths related to religion.

I see no reason to assume that the end of the organized religions will get rid of most of the wrongs in the world?

which does not mean i am a fan of them.
[/quote]
We have nearly 5,000 of history that is mostly of war and the vast majority have claimed to be religiously affiliated.

Sure the secular have cause wars but not nearly as much as the religious majority.

We may never rid ourselves of the immoral mainstream religions but need to try.

Regards
DL

Greatest I Am,

I was speaking of the Judaic/Christian God. Only one supposedly there.
It is we ourselves who have drawn this God into the matrix with us.

So do you agree or not with me that humans alone are responsible for the wrongs in this world or do you hold the J/C god accountable? You do call yourself a Christian.

As a Gnostic Christian, what is your concept of God?

The way that I look at it, we have a great tendency to make God into our OWN image and likeness, and since many of us actually do punish one another without a real purpose or cause, sometimes simply because we can and because we cannot figure our lives out, have no real control of them ~~ voila ~~ we have created the concept of an eternal punishment ~~ HELL!

Do you see an emotional and physical hell after death?

Such blasphemy.

Oh, what a Sinner we have here.jpg

“Regain your senses, call yourself back, and once again wake up. Now that you realize that only dreams were troubling you, view this ‘reality’ as you view your dreams.”
― Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

Greatest I Am,

There is another way of looking at it. It all depends how you interpret that saying or how you choose to interpret it especially when one comes from a biased perspective.

It was not necessarily God legislating or demanding that the children of the parents suffer from their parents’ actions. It was not some kind of an edict.

You can look at it in the same way that you or me might tell someone who is really drunk: "If you get into that car and drive, you may just kill yourself or someone else.

It is like psychology l0l or like cause and effect. The very negative actions and unconscionable behavior of parents can affect the lives of their children in the future. A God does not need to pass down an edict making the children deliberately suffer for the parent’s action ~~ it is cause and effect.

Anyone looking to blame God is simply unable to live with the question: Why do bad things happen to good people or something like that.

It is all said in our name for God.

Modern Gnostic Christians name our God “I am”, and yes, we do mean ourselves.

You are your controller. I am mine. You represent and present whatever mind picture you have of your God or ideal human, and so do I.

The name “I Am” you might see as meaning something like, — I think I have grown up thanks to having forced my apotheosis through Gnosis and meditation.

In Gnostic Christianity, we follow the Christian tradition that lazy Christians have forgotten that they are to do. That is, become brethren to Jesus.

That is why some say that the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

Here is the real way Jesus taught.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail.

youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbes … r_embedded

Joseph Campbell shows the same esoteric ecumenist idea in this link.

youtube.com/watch?v=aGx4IlppSgU

The bible just plainly says to put away the things of children. The supernatural.


As to J C. It is all myth.

youtube.com/watch?v=oR02cia … =PLCBF574D

Regards
DL

No. I, as a Gnostic Christians, hold no supernatural beliefs.

Regards
DL