Page 1 of 1

Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2017 2:13 am
by Otto_West
Did the Flavian Roman emporers invent christianity and Jesus?

Image

The theory is that with the collapse of the Roman empire economically, militarily, and by invasions of the northern Germanic tribes Rome was in a dire situation to hold onto power concerning the whole of western Europe where the only way it could hold onto its power was through religious cultural dominance thus Christianity was invented by the Flavian emporers later put into law by that of Constantine. The other reason was to subdue the Roman conquered province of Judea which the Romans were having a problem with the religious Jews failing to accustom themselves with and resisting Roman imperial law. A new religion had to be created to counteract and compete against Judaism but also aligning itself submissively to Roman rule where christianity worked perfectly to that regard. Christianity worked so perfectly in pacifying the province of Judea that it was later decided to be adopted throughout the ancient Roman world itself at much cost of the indigenous pagan beliefs that became destroyed in the process.


Image

Of course this wasn't the first time a religion was created for purely socio economic and political reasons as in another thread we discuss how the origins of Judaism is that of ancient Egyptian Atenism.

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=193062

Now how hilarious is that? Christianity plagiarized Judaism which itself was a plagiarization of an Egyptian pharoah cult. All in all I would say that is pretty funny pondering the whole ridiculousness of it.

Who helped the Flavian emporers fabicrate the creation of christianity? Why none other than Titus Josephus Flavius.

Image

Whom better to fabricate the creation of christianity itself than a descendant of an Atenist themselves, right? A bonified Adonai worshipper! Now why would a Jew help the Romans create christianity? I mean that sounds absurd, ridiculous, and absurd, right? That sounds counterproductive to Judaism, right? Well, consider all the in roads have been made into christian Europe as Jewish merchants. You have a new testament connected to the old testament of ours! We're brothers and sisters of the same god goyim! We do so well living amongst you!

Christianity has essentially pacified all Europeans (formerly pagans) so much under christian civic humanism that perhaps Titus Josephus Flavius forseen all of that deciding to himself that it could only aid future Jewry in the end. (He of course was unfortunately right.) In the end the creation of christianity under the Romans was just too good of an opportunity to be missed by Jewry itself and so a Jewish blessing was given in its aided creation.

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2017 1:27 pm
by Destiny
Keep drinking Satans koolaid, faggot.

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2017 2:36 pm
by Otto_West
Destiny wrote:Keep drinking Satans koolaid, faggot.

no more of that (Dan~)

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:02 am
by Greatest I am
I do not think so but do think they took advantage of an existing myth and applied it to what they wanted to see.

I guess if I stretch the language I could say that Rome did invent one of the Jesus' that ended up in the bible.

I see at least two that are easily distinguished.

This following link is my Gnostic Christian view on this and the second is from a more archeological source. That being the book by Gary Wilson and the Naked archeologist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02cia ... =PLCBF574D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-MBDQqeZik

Regards
DL

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:03 am
by Greatest I am
Destiny wrote:Keep drinking Satans koolaid, faggot.


Why do you fear new knowledge so much?

Regards
DL

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:00 am
by Otto_West
Greatest I am wrote:I do not think so but do think they took advantage of an existing myth and applied it to what they wanted to see.

I guess if I stretch the language I could say that Rome did invent one of the Jesus' that ended up in the bible.

I see at least two that are easily distinguished.

This following link is my Gnostic Christian view on this and the second is from a more archeological source. That being the book by Gary Wilson and the Naked archeologist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02cia ... =PLCBF574D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-MBDQqeZik

Regards
DL



I'll post some more conclusive evidence for the thesis presented here at a later time. I'm working almost 60 hours a week now where I haven't had the free time to aquire it yet.

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:02 am
by Otto_West
Greatest I am wrote:
Destiny wrote:Keep drinking Satans koolaid, faggot.


Why do you fear new knowledge so much?

Regards
DL

That's easy to explain, because the west revolves around christian slave morality and psychology. Our christian sheep would feel lost without their Jewish shepherd or messiah.

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 7:03 am
by Mr Reasonable
Destiny wrote:Keep drinking Satans koolaid, faggot.


Does this post fall into the category of "what would jesus do"?

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:44 pm
by Greatest I am
Otto_West wrote:
Greatest I am wrote:I do not think so but do think they took advantage of an existing myth and applied it to what they wanted to see.

I guess if I stretch the language I could say that Rome did invent one of the Jesus' that ended up in the bible.

I see at least two that are easily distinguished.

This following link is my Gnostic Christian view on this and the second is from a more archeological source. That being the book by Gary Wilson and the Naked archeologist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02cia ... =PLCBF574D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-MBDQqeZik

Regards
DL



I'll post some more conclusive evidence for the thesis presented here at a later time. I'm working almost 60 hours a week now where I haven't had the free time to aquire it yet.


This will lead you to authors and scholars that might help you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJgvws0ZYUE

Regards
DL

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:46 pm
by Greatest I am
Otto_West wrote:
Greatest I am wrote:
Destiny wrote:Keep drinking Satans koolaid, faggot.


Why do you fear new knowledge so much?

Regards
DL

That's easy to explain, because the west revolves around christian slave morality and psychology. Our christian sheep would feel lost without their Jewish shepherd or messiah.


Slave mentality is what I say of both Christianity and Islam but many do not see it.

To me it is obvious.

Regards
DL

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:47 pm
by Greatest I am
Mr Reasonable wrote:
Destiny wrote:Keep drinking Satans koolaid, faggot.


Does this post fall into the category of "what would jesus do"?


I like your thinking.

Regards
DL

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:48 pm
by Maia
The Romans certainly invented the Jesus we know today, whether or not a man of that or similar name actually lived. By Romans I don't mean the Flavian emperors though. Romans in general, who formed the Roman Catholic church.

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 1:04 pm
by Greatest I am
Maia wrote:The Romans certainly invented the Jesus we know today, whether or not a man of that or similar name actually lived. By Romans I don't mean the Flavian emperors though. Romans in general, who formed the Roman Catholic church.


Constantine certainly had a major impact when he basically forced the Trinity concept down Christianity's throat.

Regards
DL

Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 1:19 pm
by encode_decode
    Destiny

    Destiny wrote:Keep drinking Satans koolaid, faggot.

    What is Satans koolaid? How do you define Satans koolaid? If you're talking about what you can feel, what you can smell, what you can taste and see, then Satans koolaid is simply electrical signals interpreted by your brain.

    :lol:

    Regards,

    Enderpheus

      Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

      PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 5:05 am
      by felix dakat
      Otto_West wrote:Did the Flavian Roman emporers invent christianity and Jesus?

      Image

      The theory is that with the collapse of the Roman empire economically, militarily, and by invasions of the northern Germanic tribes Rome was in a dire situation to hold onto power concerning the whole of western Europe where the only way it could hold onto its power was through religious cultural dominance thus Christianity was invented by the Flavian emporers later put into law by that of Constantine. The other reason was to subdue the Roman conquered province of Judea which the Romans were having a problem with the religious Jews failing to accustom themselves with and resisting Roman imperial law. A new religion had to be created to counteract and compete against Judaism but also aligning itself submissively to Roman rule where christianity worked perfectly to that regard. Christianity worked so perfectly in pacifying the province of Judea that it was later decided to be adopted throughout the ancient Roman world itself at much cost of the indigenous pagan beliefs that became destroyed in the process.


      Image

      Of course this wasn't the first time a religion was created for purely socio economic and political reasons as in another thread we discuss how the origins of Judaism is that of ancient Egyptian Atenism.

      viewtopic.php?f=5&t=193062

      Now how hilarious is that? Christianity plagiarized Judaism which itself was a plagiarization of an Egyptian pharoah cult. All in all I would say that is pretty funny pondering the whole ridiculousness of it.

      Who helped the Flavian emporers fabicrate the creation of christianity? Why none other than Titus Josephus Flavius.

      Image

      Whom better to fabricate the creation of christianity itself than a descendant of an Atenist themselves, right? A bonified Adonai worshipper! Now why would a Jew help the Romans create christianity? I mean that sounds absurd, ridiculous, and absurd, right? That sounds counterproductive to Judaism, right? Well, consider all the in roads have been made into christian Europe as Jewish merchants. You have a new testament connected to the old testament of ours! We're brothers and sisters of the same god goyim! We do so well living amongst you!

      Christianity has essentially pacified all Europeans (formerly pagans) so much under christian civic humanism that perhaps Titus Josephus Flavius forseen all of that deciding to himself that it could only aid future Jewry in the end. (He of course was unfortunately right.) In the end the creation of christianity under the Romans was just too good of an opportunity to be missed by Jewry itself and so a Jewish blessing was given in its aided creation.


      It's an interesting theory. I hadn't read of it before tonight . But, I checked it out plus some of the online arguments against it. Even the Jesus myth theorists have debunked it.

      The first problem I encountered is that there is historical evidence that Christianity existed before Josephus allegedly invented it. Tacitus says that Nero was persecuted Christians in Rome in 64 AD. He says that "immense multitudes" of Christians were living in Rome at the time. That's ten years before Christianity was supposed to have been invented by Josephus. Also, Paul, who was killed by Nero around 67 AD, wrote at least seven of the letters in the New Testament establishing the Christian church before Josephus mentioned the Christians in his histories in 73 AD.

      Another argument that makes sense is that the Romans had no need to invent Christianity as alleged since they had already totally crushed the Jews in 70 AD, destroying Jerusalem and the temple before Josephus wrote his account and supposedly invented Christianity.

      As far as Christianity plagiarizing Judaism, how can that be the case when initially the followers of Jesus were a Jewish sect? If the New Testament writers were Jews themselves, how is that plagiarism of Judaism?

      Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

      PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 7:04 pm
      by The Eternal Warrior
      Otto_West wrote:Did the Flavian Roman emporers invent christianity and Jesus?

      Image

      The theory is that with the collapse of the Roman empire economically, militarily, and by invasions of the northern Germanic tribes Rome was in a dire situation to hold onto power concerning the whole of western Europe where the only way it could hold onto its power was through religious cultural dominance thus Christianity was invented by the Flavian emporers later put into law by that of Constantine. The other reason was to subdue the Roman conquered province of Judea which the Romans were having a problem with the religious Jews failing to accustom themselves with and resisting Roman imperial law. A new religion had to be created to counteract and compete against Judaism but also aligning itself submissively to Roman rule where christianity worked perfectly to that regard. Christianity worked so perfectly in pacifying the province of Judea that it was later decided to be adopted throughout the ancient Roman world itself at much cost of the indigenous pagan beliefs that became destroyed in the process.


      Image

      Of course this wasn't the first time a religion was created for purely socio economic and political reasons as in another thread we discuss how the origins of Judaism is that of ancient Egyptian Atenism.

      http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopi ... 5&t=193062

      Now how hilarious is that? Christianity plagiarized Judaism which itself was a plagiarization of an Egyptian pharoah cult. All in all I would say that is pretty funny pondering the whole ridiculousness of it.

      Who helped the Flavian emporers fabicrate the creation of christianity? Why none other than Titus Josephus Flavius.

      Image

      Whom better to fabricate the creation of christianity itself than a descendant of an Atenist themselves, right? A bonified Adonai worshipper! Now why would a Jew help the Romans create christianity? I mean that sounds absurd, ridiculous, and absurd, right? That sounds counterproductive to Judaism, right? Well, consider all the in roads have been made into christian Europe as Jewish merchants. You have a new testament connected to the old testament of ours! We're brothers and sisters of the same god goyim! We do so well living amongst you!

      Christianity has essentially pacified all Europeans (formerly pagans) so much under christian civic humanism that perhaps Titus Josephus Flavius forseen all of that deciding to himself that it could only aid future Jewry in the end. (He of course was unfortunately right.) In the end the creation of christianity under the Romans was just too good of an opportunity to be missed by Jewry itself and so a Jewish blessing was given in its aided creation.


      No, Mary's womb and her cousin's husbands seed created Jesus.

      Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

      PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2017 12:11 am
      by Otto_West
      Yes, I am already acquainted with the fairy tale.

      Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

      PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2017 4:04 am
      by felix dakat
      The first surviving reference to Jesus by a non-Christian, non-Jewish source of any kind appears in the writings of Pliny the Younger, the governor of the Roman province of Bithynia-Pontus in Asia Minor. His correspondence with Emperor Trajan advocating harsh treatment of Christians @ 112AD seems to fly in the face of the theory that the Romans invented Christianity.

      Pliny's Letter to Trajan:

      It is my practice, my lord, to refer to you all matters concerning which I am in doubt. For who can better give guidance to my hesitation or inform my ignorance? I have never participated in trials of Christians. I therefore do not know what offenses it is the practice to punish or investigate, and to what extent. And I have been not a little hesitant as to whether there should be any distinction on account of age or no difference between the very young and the more mature; whether pardon is to be granted for repentance, or, if a man has once been a Christian, it does him no good to have ceased to be one; whether the name itself, even without offenses, or only the offenses associated with the name are to be punished.

      Meanwhile, in the case of those who were denounced to me as Christians, I have observed the following procedure: I interrogated these as to whether they were Christians; those who confessed I interrogated a second and a third time, threatening them with punishment; those who persisted I ordered executed. For I had no doubt that, whatever the nature of their creed, stubbornness and inflexible obstinacy surely deserve to be punished. There were others possessed of the same folly; but because they were Roman citizens, I signed an order for them to be transferred to Rome.

      Soon accusations spread, as usually happens, because of the proceedings going on, and several incidents occurred. An anonymous document was published containing the names of many persons. Those who denied that they were or had been Christians, when they invoked the gods in words dictated by me, offered prayer with incense and wine to your image, which I had ordered to be brought for this purpose together with statues of the gods, and moreover cursed Christ--none of which those who are really Christians, it is said, can be forced to do--these I thought should be discharged. Others named by the informer declared that they were Christians, but then denied it, asserting that they had been but had ceased to be, some three years before, others many years, some as much as twenty-five years. They all worshipped your image and the statues of the gods, and cursed Christ.

      They asserted, however, that the sum and substance of their fault or error had been that they were accustomed to meet on a fixed day before dawn and sing responsively a hymn to Christ as to a god, and to bind themselves by oath, not to some crime, but not to commit fraud, theft, or adultery, not falsify their trust, nor to refuse to return a trust when called upon to do so. When this was over, it was their custom to depart and to assemble again to partake of food--but ordinary and innocent food. Even this, they affirmed, they had ceased to do after my edict by which, in accordance with your instructions, I had forbidden political associations. Accordingly, I judged it all the more necessary to find out what the truth was by torturing two female slaves who were called deaconesses. But I discovered nothing else but depraved, excessive superstition.

      I therefore postponed the investigation and hastened to consult you. For the matter seemed to me to warrant consulting you, especially because of the number involved. For many persons of every age, every rank, and also of both sexes are and will be endangered. For the contagion of this superstition has spread not only to the cities but also to the villages and farms. But it seems possible to check and cure it. It is certainly quite clear that the temples, which had been almost deserted, have begun to be frequented, that the established religious rites, long neglected, are being resumed, and that from everywhere sacrificial animals are coming, for which until now very few purchasers could be found. Hence it is easy to imagine what a multitude of people can be reformed if an opportunity for repentance is afforded.



      Trajan's Response to Pliny:

      You observed proper procedure, my dear Pliny, in sifting the cases of those who had been denounced to you as Christians. For it is not possible to lay down any general rule to serve as a kind of fixed standard. They are not to be sought out; if they are denounced and proved guilty, they are to be punished, with this reservation, that whoever denies that he is a Christian and really proves it--that is, by worshiping our gods--even though he was under suspicion in the past, shall obtain pardon through repentance. But anonymously posted accusations ought to have no place in any prosecution. For this is both a dangerous kind of precedent and out of keeping with the spirit of our age.

      Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

      PostPosted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 3:52 am
      by Artimas
      Yes it is an invention.. all they did was used preexisting culture ideals/aspects, put a twist/different name on them and then sold it as something new.

      Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

      PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:57 am
      by mmhgloba
      Hmmm. ironically all the disciples were Jews and the seeds of Christianity were planted when the Roman empire was at the heights of power, in first century ACE. It was not until several centuries later that Christianity was adopted by Constantine and the Roman Empire collapsed shortly thereafter. I am not so sure that this was the strategy of the Romans used to subdue Judea, if so it definitely backfired.

      Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

      PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:04 am
      by Arminius
      Otto_West wrote:Did the Flavian Roman emporers invent christianity and Jesus?

      Image

      The theory is that with the collapse of the Roman empire economically, militarily, and by invasions of the northern Germanic tribes Rome was in a dire situation to hold onto power concerning the whole of western Europe where the only way it could hold onto its power was through religious cultural dominance thus Christianity was invented by the Flavian emporers later put into law by that of Constantine. The other reason was to subdue the Roman conquered province of Judea which the Romans were having a problem with the religious Jews failing to accustom themselves with and resisting Roman imperial law. A new religion had to be created to counteract and compete against Judaism but also aligning itself submissively to Roman rule where christianity worked perfectly to that regard. Christianity worked so perfectly in pacifying the province of Judea that it was later decided to be adopted throughout the ancient Roman world itself at much cost of the indigenous pagan beliefs that became destroyed in the process.


      Image

      Of course this wasn't the first time a religion was created for purely socio economic and political reasons as in another thread we discuss how the origins of Judaism is that of ancient Egyptian Atenism.

      viewtopic.php?f=5&t=193062

      Now how hilarious is that? Christianity plagiarized Judaism which itself was a plagiarization of an Egyptian pharoah cult. All in all I would say that is pretty funny pondering the whole ridiculousness of it.

      Who helped the Flavian emporers fabicrate the creation of christianity? Why none other than Titus Josephus Flavius.

      Image

      Whom better to fabricate the creation of christianity itself than a descendant of an Atenist themselves, right? A bonified Adonai worshipper! Now why would a Jew help the Romans create christianity? I mean that sounds absurd, ridiculous, and absurd, right? That sounds counterproductive to Judaism, right? Well, consider all the in roads have been made into christian Europe as Jewish merchants. You have a new testament connected to the old testament of ours! We're brothers and sisters of the same god goyim! We do so well living amongst you!

      Christianity has essentially pacified all Europeans (formerly pagans) so much under christian civic humanism that perhaps Titus Josephus Flavius forseen all of that deciding to himself that it could only aid future Jewry in the end. (He of course was unfortunately right.) In the end the creation of christianity under the Romans was just too good of an opportunity to be missed by Jewry itself and so a Jewish blessing was given in its aided creation.

      Interesting.

      Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

      PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:52 am
      by Meno_
      Philosophically, the view that the Twilight of the Gods preceded that modern revisitation, accelerating by leaps and bounds, [Protestantism, Industrial Revolutoon, the political revolutions of the 18 th century all the product of the Enlightenment]- was due to the imminent collapse of the greatest Empire known until then, where the Gods had tremendous significance and social utility. That the collapse could not be held up by idols any longer, as supporting an imperium, socialism dressed up as an another evolved out of social consciousness.

      That any political elite could have done this, is questionable, but what is not at all uncertain is, that the Christians supported an anti hero, one who transvalued society into a precursor of social values. This transformation only needed a mystical type of man, and it could have been anyone, feeling the pressures of social, political and economic change increasingly creating disturbance and hopelessness.

      The dying gods had to resurrect in some other form, so a son was given to fit the role of redemption.

      Sure , it seems cataclysmic, however hundreds of years of decay was plenty of time to develop it

      Sounds familiar? This is not an opposite view of invention, only it reflects more of a.mold, into which some idea was borne into. It was thought up, but only through a very long and Extended time, where by authorship must have been more allusive socially, and molded around a single figure.

      It could have been the primordial effort by a werary empire/emperor to disseminate and deconstruct responsibility and public discontent for a diminishing empire.

      I the death of the Gods was never proclaimed textually, people connecting the glory of Rome with the agency of god, caused a social diminution of belief, in a society where religion and national grandeur were not mutually excluded.

      Re: Did The Romans Invent Jesus?

      PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 4:05 am
      by Jakob
      Otto_West wrote:Did the Flavian Roman emporers invent christianity and Jesus?

      Image

      The theory is that with the collapse of the Roman empire economically, militarily, and by invasions of the northern Germanic tribes Rome was in a dire situation to hold onto power concerning the whole of western Europe where the only way it could hold onto its power was through religious cultural dominance thus Christianity was invented by the Flavian emporers later put into law by that of Constantine. The other reason was to subdue the Roman conquered province of Judea which the Romans were having a problem with the religious Jews failing to accustom themselves with and resisting Roman imperial law. A new religion had to be created to counteract and compete against Judaism but also aligning itself submissively to Roman rule where christianity worked perfectly to that regard. Christianity worked so perfectly in pacifying the province of Judea that it was later decided to be adopted throughout the ancient Roman world itself at much cost of the indigenous pagan beliefs that became destroyed in the process.


      Image

      Of course this wasn't the first time a religion was created for purely socio economic and political reasons as in another thread we discuss how the origins of Judaism is that of ancient Egyptian Atenism.

      viewtopic.php?f=5&t=193062

      Now how hilarious is that? Christianity plagiarized Judaism which itself was a plagiarization of an Egyptian pharoah cult. All in all I would say that is pretty funny pondering the whole ridiculousness of it.

      Who helped the Flavian emporers fabicrate the creation of christianity? Why none other than Titus Josephus Flavius.

      Image

      Whom better to fabricate the creation of christianity itself than a descendant of an Atenist themselves, right? A bonified Adonai worshipper! Now why would a Jew help the Romans create christianity? I mean that sounds absurd, ridiculous, and absurd, right? That sounds counterproductive to Judaism, right? Well, consider all the in roads have been made into christian Europe as Jewish merchants. You have a new testament connected to the old testament of ours! We're brothers and sisters of the same god goyim! We do so well living amongst you!

      Christianity has essentially pacified all Europeans (formerly pagans) so much under christian civic humanism that perhaps Titus Josephus Flavius forseen all of that deciding to himself that it could only aid future Jewry in the end. (He of course was unfortunately right.) In the end the creation of christianity under the Romans was just too good of an opportunity to be missed by Jewry itself and so a Jewish blessing was given in its aided creation.


      Cool aesthetics.