Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

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Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby Amorphos » Mon Feb 06, 2017 11:09 pm

Lets say this world is the world where stuff gets made ~ as it appears. it just makes stuff then throws it away? irrespective of that we could assume that there is another world where all the made stuff goes, a world of completeness. Thing is, in Elysium or heaven, would an apple tree grow apples without the need to, and would birds eat worms.

…so without evolution, death and all the things which forge our existent world, how can there be a world where all the made stuff goes? What would an apple tree be without apples? Would it still grow apples and for no reason, and would birds fly around in ‘disneyworld’ not doing anything like finding food and mates.
Worse still, would all of our suffering in this world no longer mean anything, or exist to us et al? So heaven would be a place with no evolutionary needs, and we would have no memory of our former existence [of being made]. therefore all that goes into making the final product ~ the dwellers of Elysium, means nothing and they would know nothing about the world they formerly lived in and no lessons or anything?

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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby WendyDarling » Mon Feb 06, 2017 11:20 pm

From my experiences, your soul body rises or falls to various planes of pure emotions. While you are able to think and remember your entire physical life, there is a detachment from the emotional significances of those memories and an alignment with the emotion of the plane on which you are residing.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby Amorphos » Tue Feb 07, 2017 12:11 am

It makes sense that you would think and therefore feel [not the primary nature imho], with respect to the world one exists in. Not so sure if you can have memories without any meaning to them, or that they would mean anything anyway in an entirely different world. Our experience of this world is that we don’t know anything of a former world if there were one, so I am tempted to think that everything ends at death and is then born anew. Which leaves me with the question of purpose, unless being made into something by a world is it? I suppose one doesn’t need the information which goes into that, especially as no amount of info describes what it means to be us and info is specific I.e. to a given world.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby WendyDarling » Tue Feb 07, 2017 1:18 am

Have you ever watched old videos of yourself? I've seen some VHS doozies. As I watch myself, I am detached from the original memory. There on the soul planes of emotion, if you ask yourself, "Did I really live a life?" a B&W montage of your life in chronological order will flash before your soul's mind's eye. I am not sure of what happens after death for I soul traveled OBE style while I still had my body to return to.
I AM OFFICIALLY IN HELL!

I live my philosophy, it's personal to me and people who engage where I live establish an unspoken dynamic, a relationship of sorts, with me and my philosophy.

Cutting folks for sport is a reality for the poor in spirit. I myself only cut the poor in spirit on Tues., Thurs., and every other Sat.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby Mackerni » Tue Feb 07, 2017 12:47 pm

WendyDarling wrote:From my experiences, your soul body rises or falls to various planes of pure emotions. While you are able to think and remember your entire physical life, there is a detachment from the emotional significances of those memories and an alignment with the emotion of the plane on which you are residing.


This also happens before death if you have a severe enough case of bi-polar disorder. Which I have.

To answer the original question... If there is a "Heaven" out there I don't think the same rules apply to that reality as it does this reality. My idea of Heaven is somewhere in the distant future where retro-reality can be recorded itself and brought back to life. In that reality the same rules of reality don't apply to this current reality.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby Amorphos » Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:11 am

I think obe may have something to do with our brains computing power, it generates this world after all. I think all of that ends at death but the thing experiencing info from the brain still exists, this because reality ultimately has one nature and it is that which sees and experiences info in the brain. …so a whole new start then?

My idea of Heaven is somewhere in the distant future where retro-reality can be recorded itself and brought back to life.


Interesting, and I do think that’s possible if info is recorded somehow by the universe - if. Trouble is that an immortal life in this world would still have suffering and whathaveyou.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby Mackerni » Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:19 am

Amorphos wrote:I think obe may have something to do with our brains computing power, it generates this world after all.


That is the definition of philosophical idealism.

Amorphos wrote:I think all of that ends at death but the thing experiencing info from the brain still exists, this because reality ultimately has one nature and it is that which sees and experiences info in the brain. …so a whole new start then?


Preconception: You were cells that were designated as the mitosis sex-cells of your mother and father.
Life: From conception to death, this is the time I consider someone alive.
Meta-conscious: Your cells decompose to give other lifeforms the ability to enact their own mitosis. Therefore your cells effectively become the cells the other bacteria and organisms.

Image

Amorphos wrote:Interesting, and I do think that’s possible if info is recorded somehow by the universe - if. Trouble is that an immortal life in this world would still have suffering and whathaveyou.


I see a point in the distant future where there is no suffering. This will take a long time to happen, but by the time they develop the ability to retroact mitosis we'll be much closer to preventing suffering.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby WendyDarling » Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:21 am

Mackerni,

You have OBE'd from an awakened state without psychedelics?
I AM OFFICIALLY IN HELL!

I live my philosophy, it's personal to me and people who engage where I live establish an unspoken dynamic, a relationship of sorts, with me and my philosophy.

Cutting folks for sport is a reality for the poor in spirit. I myself only cut the poor in spirit on Tues., Thurs., and every other Sat.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby Mackerni » Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:28 am

WendyDarling wrote:Mackerni,

You have OBE'd from an awakened state without psychedelics?


Nah, just science and deductive reasoning.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby WendyDarling » Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:36 am

Well, voluntary OBE's from an awakened state are possible without hypnogogics, drugs, bizarre sounds, and most of the stuff the New Ager's try to sell. A bout of hypomania would help elevate your psychic energy level and enhance your overall willpower towards the focus and determination needed for such an endeavor, however full-blown mania or medicated symptoms will not allow the transition to occur.
I AM OFFICIALLY IN HELL!

I live my philosophy, it's personal to me and people who engage where I live establish an unspoken dynamic, a relationship of sorts, with me and my philosophy.

Cutting folks for sport is a reality for the poor in spirit. I myself only cut the poor in spirit on Tues., Thurs., and every other Sat.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby Mackerni » Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:40 am

I don't even want an out-of-body experience. An idea like that kind of scares me.

Plus, I do have full-blown mania when I'm not medicated.

Are you simply referring to OBEs based on the picture I created? It's nothing special, in fact it should kind of be viewed as common sense at this point. Why more people don't realize this as reality is beyond me.
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Re: Is an apple tree without apples an apple tree?

Postby WendyDarling » Wed Feb 08, 2017 9:02 am

No, not related to any picture of yours.
I AM OFFICIALLY IN HELL!

I live my philosophy, it's personal to me and people who engage where I live establish an unspoken dynamic, a relationship of sorts, with me and my philosophy.

Cutting folks for sport is a reality for the poor in spirit. I myself only cut the poor in spirit on Tues., Thurs., and every other Sat.
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