question?

For intuitive and critical discussions, from spirituality to theological doctrines. Fair warning: because the subject matter is personal, moderation is strict.

Moderator: Dan~

question?

Postby bigmel » Mon Aug 11, 2003 8:57 pm

Hi!
I have this work assignement to do about what the people believe in general. I have to intervew people from different age, background, lifestyle and religious worldview. This is kind of a 9 question survey. The goal is to see the different opinions about different aspects that religion usually covers. There is no "bad answer" because the goal is not to find what is true but to ontline the differences.Is you don't have an answer for a question, it's ok, just right that down.

so here it is:

1) God :
- When you hear the word « God, »of what do you think?
- What would you say God is like?
- Where did you get your ideas about God?

2) Man :
- why does man die?
- What happens to man when he dies?
- Where did you get your ideas about man and his future?

3) Right and Wrong (sin) :
- In life, what is right, and what is wrong (sin)? Name a few of each.
- Is there any consequences for doing wrong (sin)? If so, what would it or they be?
- If someone says you are wrong about what is right and wrong- who decides who is right?

So I thank you all who will take the time to answer and look forward to know what your beliefs are!

memepuce
bigmel
 

Postby Marshall McDaniel » Tue Aug 12, 2003 10:17 am

1) God :
- When you hear the word « God, »of what do you think?
Nothing.
- What would you say God is like?
I don't know.
- Where did you get your ideas about God?
Everybody.

2) Man :
- why does man die?
To make room for something else.
- What happens to man when he dies?
He decays.
- Where did you get your ideas about man and his future?
Science.
3) Right and Wrong (sin) :
- In life, what is right, and what is wrong (sin)? Name a few of each.
Life, liberty, reason, and happiness are right.
Dogmatism, tyranny, unwarranted assumptions, original sin are wrong.
- Is there any consequences for doing wrong (sin)? If so, what would it or they be?
Yes! sin results in hell on EARTH.
- If someone says you are wrong about what is right and wrong- who decides who is right?
Reason and love.
"..All life is the struggle, the effort to be itself. The difficulties I meet with in order to realise my existence are precisely what awaken and mobilise my activities, my capacities.."GASSET"..For enjoyment and innocence are the most modest things: neither want to be looked for. One should have them-but one should look rather for guilt and pain!.."NIETZSCHE"..The struggle itself toward the heights is enough to fill a man's heart.." CAMUS
User avatar
Marshall McDaniel
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat Nov 16, 2002 11:11 pm
Location: Roanoke, Va, U.S.A.

Postby Magius » Wed Aug 13, 2003 1:14 am

1) God :
- When you hear the word « God, »of what do you think?
Depends on who is saying it. Different people mean different things by the word God. Personally, the word God means nothing to me, other than a system of brainwashing, weakness, ignorance, and control.

- What would you say God is like?
Irrelevant, this question assumes God exists. I would say God doesn't exist.

- Where did you get your ideas about God?
Again, irrelevant because it assumes that God exists. Or put another way, it is Begging the Question (a fallacy). The ideas of a variety of different Gods that I conceptually aware of to be believed, no by myself, but by others came to be via a variety of religious folk from all walks of life.

2) Man :
- why does man die?
Because our body ceases to function in such a way as to sustain life.

- What happens to man when he dies?
Depends on your definition of 'man'. Personally, I believe that we decompose only to have our atoms spread throughout the rest of the universe.

- Where did you get your ideas about man and his future?
Not sure what you mean. My ideas of humankind are solely based on my experiences. The future of man as an idea is nonexistent to me, cause I don't have a view of man having a purpose (teleology). But if you mean my ideas of the future in general, then there is enough for me to say about us socially, psychologically, economically, politically, militarilly, and otherwise to fill volumes. Again, these latter ideas will have come from a conglomeration of all my experiences in life.

3) Right and Wrong (sin) :
- In life, what is right, and what is wrong (sin)? Name a few of each.
What is right is beneficial for us and what is wrong is seen as non-beneficial for us. Though these concepts are almost irrelevant, cause there are situations in which something looks to be beneficial for us but it's not, and vice versa. Ultimately, there is no right and wrong and post-modernism rules. But I don't believe the majority of us can live under post-modernism, they need to actually believe that what they are doing
is right in the sense of God or some 'out there' right and wrong that stays right and wrong despite our inhabiting the solar system or not...usually viewed as similar to Plato's forms. Personally, I don't see myself as one of these people.

- Is there any consequences for doing wrong (sin)? If so, what would it or they be?
The first word of your question should be 'Are'. Yes many, whatever we make them to be. There isn't anything wrong inheritently in anything, there is only that which we make up to be wrong and that which doesn't serve our continued existence and procreation. For instance, living in a jungle and going around yelling at the top of my lungs may be viewed as wrong because the tigers will hear me, find me, and eat me. Another example, my committing adultery is wrong because our societal system would completely break down if all of us began to deceive and lie to each other. Hence, adultery being a kind of deception is made to be wrong according to societal standards. Ofcourse, we have to coat this with religion as well to instill fear in doing this otherwise we will not be granted a position in Heaven, or we will be punished, or what have you.

- If someone says you are wrong about what is right and wrong- who decides who is right?

Again, I don't believe there is some kind of ULTIMATE right and wrong. But we can decide upon right and wrong within the context of our society, language, etc. So to answer your question, we use science, logic, rationality, reason, and understanding in general.

What's your take?
User avatar
Magius
Magnanimous
 
Posts: 1489
Joined: Fri Jun 07, 2002 7:08 am
Location: Ontario, Canada

Postby Silhouette » Wed Aug 13, 2003 3:04 pm

1) God :
- When you hear the word « God, »of what do you think?

Thats a very broad question.
I generally think of the christian God. Although I am aware of loads of other greek/roman gods and other religion's Gods.
When I hear it in a curse like 'Oh god..' then I think the person who said it is having a bad time in their opinion.
And when someone compares someone's abilities to be comparable to a god's, like X is a god at Y, I make an opinion and wonder whether to comment.
I don't wonder whether one exists because you cannot possibly prove or disprove its existance using imperfect senses and imperfect logical thinking, and I don't have faith in any because I can't bring myself to believe in something I can't prove.

- What would you say God is like?

This christian God is supposed to look like man and be perfect even though he has sinful characteristics like pride, envy and avarice and he kills when he judges it is right and has a very totalitarian rule over men. Some of the very things he teaches are wrong.
Any other ones, I know too little about.

- Where did you get your ideas about God?

The bible, church, teachers, friends and family, and my own thoughts.

2) Man :
- why does man die?

Very broad again... Generally it is due to too much or too little of something that results in damage to the man that falls outside the body's ability to repair itself and sustain life or because of something that stops the bodies ability to repair itself.

- What happens to man when he dies?

The brain ceases to function, and without co-ordinatation, the body can't function in the required way for life, and it decomposes as normal without the regeneration or any other function of life until it becomes something indistinguishable as a man. The exchange of atoms or whatever will continue as normal, but not in a way that maintains the appearance of that particular man.

- Where did you get your ideas about man and his future?

There is no such thing as future (or past), just different combinations of the present. I imagine things will just be different in different ways just like things have always done. Man, as with all other life, will be different in ways he thinks is better for its life or for some made up motivational reason or other that will just change with no apparent ultimate significance.

3) Right and Wrong (sin) :
- In life, what is right, and what is wrong (sin)? Name a few of each.

There are different types of right/wrong for man: ones that do or don't satisfy the id, the ego and the super-ego. And they mostly conflict which causes unhappiness which is wrong.
The id's rights are getting what you want for basic survival and pleasure.
The ego's rights are deciding the best way for going about getting the id's desires.
The super-ego's rights are what the law and religion says is right due to some benefit of the imposed unnatural social lifestyle or for your afterlife, that more often than not, goes against what the id and ego wants.

- Is there any consequences for doing wrong (sin)? If so, what would it or they be?

Fear, guilt, reproach of urself or others towards yourself because of the super-ego. And of course punishment because of society. General unhappiness and dissatisfaction because of this and when wrong is done in terms of id and ego.

- If someone says you are wrong about what is right and wrong- who decides who is right?

Yourself with the id and ego. Society as well as yourself with the super-ego.
User avatar
Silhouette
Philosopher
 
Posts: 3376
Joined: Tue May 20, 2003 1:27 am
Location: Existence

Postby Slartibartfast » Wed Aug 13, 2003 10:06 pm

1) God :
- When you hear the word « God, »of what do you think?

Nothing in particular, it would depend on the context in which
it is used


- What would you say God is like?

nonextistant

- Where did you get your ideas about God?

my own opinions, books, forums such as this one, logic (or at least logical in my opinion)

2) Man :
- why does man die?

too broad of a question- if you mean what makes people die, i'd look at it from a scientific perspective (some vital part of his/her body ceases to function correctly)

- What happens to man when he dies?

his body decays, his conciousness is ended as soon as he ceases to 'live'

- Where did you get your ideas about man and his future?

my own opinions, books, forums such as this one, logic (or at least logical in my opinion)

3) Right and Wrong (sin) :
- In life, what is right, and what is wrong (sin)? Name a few of each.

right and wrong are just relative ideas based on the society you live in-


- Is there any consequences for doing wrong (sin)? If so, what would it or they be?

the only consequences are those from human hands, such as the law, the government, etc.

- If someone says you are wrong about what is right and wrong- who decides who is right?

nobody, right and wrong are both relative opinions.
Image
Slartibartfast
 
Posts: 88
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2002 4:09 pm

Postby jedi_pocky » Fri Aug 15, 2003 9:25 pm

1) God :
- When you hear the word « God, »of what do you think?
Nothing. I cannot think of or picture what i dont understand nor believe in. yet i respect that to others, he is a 'creator' and the 'idea of perfection'. and thus i think of it that way, though honestly i would like to say, 'illusions, comfort and opiate'

- What would you say God is like?
Nothing. since i think it doesnt exist. but lets say i am wrong... it would thus be selfish, arbitary, tyrannical... yet loving and forgiving

- Where did you get your ideas about God?
I dont.

2) Man :
- why does man die?
because his body fails on him, he loses his consciousness and the ability to think, thus loses his soul (since his soul is the product of his brain)- What happens to man when he dies?
he disappears, disintegrates.. poof.
- Where did you get your ideas about man and his future?
hmmm. i settled and accepted this conclusion upon countless inner dialogues with myself. a true blue narcissist, i love finding out what i think and how i think. also, by accessing various opinions from different people and seeing which i agree with.

3) Right and Wrong (sin) :
- In life, what is right, and what is wrong (sin)? Name a few of each.
i do not beleve in morality or 'wrongness'. but i do feel that it is not good to infringe on the rights of others.. thus you can that say i consider any action that does harm to another as wrong.


- Is there any consequences for doing wrong (sin)? If so, what would it or they be?
guilt on the wrong doer's part... if he can feel any.
the potential threat of the victim to take revenge.


- If someone says you are wrong about what is right and wrong- who decides who is right?
noone. ill respect his opinion. if he doesnt respect mine, well, i cant do anything bout it.
what say you to this?
always learning,

Image
User avatar
jedi_pocky
 
Posts: 245
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2003 8:05 pm
Location: a galaxy far away / singapore. ILP's resident nihilistic existentialist.

Postby Frighter » Sat Aug 16, 2003 6:08 am

1)
When you hear the word [b]God, of what do you think of God?[/b]

I think of God as the "being" (and i mean that in as vague a sence as possible) which created the universe, and since the very moment of its creation it has had no hand or power to do anything inside of it, it was just created and is a seperate entity.

What would you say God is like?

I just cant really answer that from my current belief on God.. it would be like asking me "What would you say a Rock is like"?.

Where did you get your ideas about God?

Being a total believer in causation in our reality type thing, i believe that the universe had to come from somewhere. Alota people ask me "hey dude, so where did this God of yours come from?" but i dont think that is such a problem. we have no way of knowing if causation even plays a role "outside" of our universe. you need to have time in order for causation to happen, there might not be time outside our universe.

2)
Why does man die?

Well.. as my theory in life in general goes, death does not really apply, because we are not really any more "alive" when we are alive, then when we are dead. The whole concept of life is something that we created. Like if you look at a beaker with some chemicals in it that are reacting, would you say that solution is alive? no? what about a pool of amino acids just sitting there kinda mixing about? no? what about a virus? what about an insects limb that has been hacked off and is still twitching? no? what about tiny weeny single celled organism. But even then, what really is a single celled organism other then a microscopic beaker with chemicals interacting. And thats all that we are, is just a bunch of chemicals interacting. So when you "die" all that happens is that a bunch of chemicals dont happen to react in some way as they did before. Nothing as overly dramatic as "death" has really occured. I 100% believe that some day (way WAY far future) science will be able to totally reanimate a corpse that is totally intact in every way. And if that is the case, how can one really say when one had "died"?

What happens when Man dies?

Uhh my above question sorta answers that.

Where did you get your ideas about man and his future??

From being a materialist down to the bone. If you look at the universe as being tiny bits of matter and energy and stuff, there no longer exists anything that is humanly recognizeable. A bottle is not a bottle, it is a collection of atoms doing not so interesting things. A human is not a human, it is a collection of atoms doing interesting things.

3)
In life, what is right, and what is rong? Name a few of each.

In a materalist world, there are no room for fancy things like right and wrong, unless you believe in "right" particles and "wrong" particles... which i dont. Right and Wrong are all beliefes for individuals, there is no objective right and wrong.

Is there any consequence for doing wrong? If so, what would it or they be?

No, there is no real consequence for doing anything wrong. the consequences have nothing to do with the actual action itself. The only consequences are the ones that will appear when other people dont like what you have done.

If somone says you are wrong about what is right and wrong, who decides who is right?

Whoever has the most "right" particles in their body. :D
Whatever i just said is irrelevent.
And i know i have bad spelling. Live with it.
Start with assumption, That a million people are smart...Smarter than one?
User avatar
Frighter
 
Posts: 406
Joined: Wed Jun 05, 2002 9:50 pm
Location: Ontario

Postby Meno » Mon Aug 18, 2003 4:01 am

1. God

- The Bible is the word of God
- God is almighty and gracious.
- Bible
2. Man
- Man dies because of the effect of sin.
- A person can either enjoy peace with God forever or suffer under His wrath forever, it's an individual choice.
- Bible
3. Right and Wrong
- If you obey God everything will follow suit.
- Love those who hate you. ( a real toughie)
- Be the man God wants you to be, not what TV tells you.
- The ultimate wrong is turning your back on God.
- My standard for right and wrong are based on the absolute standards of the Bible. (When you get a chance Read Romans chapters 1 and 5)
Have a nice day and a better eternity!! :D
Meno
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2003 4:44 am

Postby Silhouette » Mon Aug 18, 2003 10:14 pm

Frighter wrote:
2)
Why does man die?

Well.. as my theory in life in general goes, death does not really apply, because we are not really any more "alive" when we are alive, then when we are dead. The whole concept of life is something that we created. Like if you look at a beaker with some chemicals in it that are reacting, would you say that solution is alive? no? what about a pool of amino acids just sitting there kinda mixing about? no? what about a virus? what about an insects limb that has been hacked off and is still twitching? no? what about tiny weeny single celled organism. But even then, what really is a single celled organism other then a microscopic beaker with chemicals interacting. And thats all that we are, is just a bunch of chemicals interacting. So when you "die" all that happens is that a bunch of chemicals dont happen to react in some way as they did before. Nothing as overly dramatic as "death" has really occured. I 100% believe that some day (way WAY far future) science will be able to totally reanimate a corpse that is totally intact in every way. And if that is the case, how can one really say when one had "died"?

Where did you get your ideas about man and his future??

From being a materialist down to the bone. If you look at the universe as being tiny bits of matter and energy and stuff, there no longer exists anything that is humanly recognizeable. A bottle is not a bottle, it is a collection of atoms doing not so interesting things. A human is not a human, it is a collection of atoms doing interesting things.


I totally agree! :D
User avatar
Silhouette
Philosopher
 
Posts: 3376
Joined: Tue May 20, 2003 1:27 am
Location: Existence


Return to Religion and Spirituality



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users