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Re: [email protected]

Postby Urwrongx1000 » Tue May 19, 2020 8:19 am

I think we need three Y-axes:

Y1 = Archy, value of a person within society, and placement within society, contribution to the system (hierarchy and class)
Y2 = Religion, belief of faith in Abrahamic-christian-jewish-muslim institutions, Eastern civilization has its own forms
Y3 = Economics, concentration of wealth, rich/middle/poor

X = left/right, types of freedom, freedom to versus freedom from, "social justice"


The Z-axis should be Progressive/Regressive, with science being "Progressive".

Maybe Religion should be re-classified as "Regressive" and moved to the Z-axis?
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Gloominary » Thu May 21, 2020 2:54 pm

I'm thinking like, there's three kinds of authoritarianism, discrimination (blue/right), antidiscrimination (green) and reverse discrimination (red/left).
Libertarianism (black) is the absence of all 3 and centrism (miscellaneous) is some presence of all 3.
You can apply the above to any domain or sphere.
It's difficult to reduce every form of discrimination to just three domains or spheres.

There's what can be called hard discrimination, based on things people can't change about themselves, like their age, ethnicity, race and sex (well unless you're a transitionist that is).
Sometimes nationality and religion are included here, even tho you can change them, because they're usually something you're brought up with from a very early age.
Then there's what can be called soft discrimination, based on things people can change about themselves, like their beliefs, behavior and belongings.
Regarding hard discrimination, there's ethnic, racial, religious or sexual preferentialism, realism (different (but (roughly) equal), specialism (can follow from realism (different but (roughly) equal roles), segregationism, separatism and supremacism.

We transfer social, political and monetary power from some groups to others (socioeconomic and political discrimination).
We also (re)educate, fine, imprison or execute some groups (re)habilitative and punitive discrimination).
Basically we transfer social, political and monetary power from some groups to others on the basis of their immutable or mutable qualities, and we (re)educate, fine, imprison or execute some groups on the basis of their immutable or mutable qualities in an effort to change or get rid of them.
We use common sense street smarts, and book smarts like philosophy, politics, religion and the social sciences to determine who should have what power, and who should be changed or gotten rid of.
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Gloominary » Thu May 21, 2020 5:41 pm

So how do we try to simplify this?
Discrimination has become a keyword to me.
3 forms of authoritarianism:

Discrimination (rightism)
Anti-discrimination (individualism)
Reverse Discrimination (leftism)

Non-discrimination (libertarianism)
Centrism (all of the above)

Side point: Of course individuals and groups can be (anti, reverse or non) discriminating on their own with or without government.

Hard/immutable (age, ethnicity (nationality), race (religion), sex) (anti, reverse or non) discrimination
Soft/mutable (behaviors, beliefs, belongings) (anti, reverse or non) discrimination

(Re)Distributive (anti, reverse or non) discrimination
(Re)Habilitative/Punitive (anti, reverse or non) discrimination

Secular (ideological, philosophical, socioscientific) (anti, reverse or non) discrimination
Religious (anti, reverse or non) discrimination

I know this is a bit more complicated than what you were looking for, but it's what makes sense to me.
I think this is more refined, how these things are usually organized is sort of crude.
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Urwrongx1000 » Sun May 24, 2020 1:24 pm

Y1-Axis (Hierarchy) Class, Social Value, Contribution, Loyalty/Disloyalty, Order/Chaos, Royalist/Rebel
Y2-Axis (Economics) Wealth, Elitism, Monopolization/Subsidization, Free Market/Socialism, Industry/Welfare

X1-Axis (Liberty) Freedom To/Freedom From, Oppression/Victimhood, Blame/Guilt/Innocence, Privilege, Rights, Humanity and Humanism
X2-Axis (Justice) Male/Female, Competition/Cooperation, Discrimination/Anti-Discrimination, Exclusivity/Inclusivity, Race, Racialism or Race Realism versus Denialism

Z-Axis (Modernity) Progressive/Regressive, Forward/Backward, Future/Past, Art/Science/Religion, Amorality/Morality


My hypothesis is: race/ethnic group is distinctly tied to specific clusters of political affiliation.

Therefore, if you are East Asian, then you will be more 'Socialist-Communist-Egalitarian' due to the severe Homogeneity of the East Asiatic Race.

Race/Ethnic group is primary (Nature). Political affiliation, identity, and location is secondary (Nurture). Humans cannot be "taught out of" or "convinced" of opposing political or racial factions, if innate differences are too large. This hypothesis automatically explains the differing political, commercial, industrial, social, and religious motivations of individuals directly corresponding to their racial and ethnic group clusters. Mixing races and ethnic groups does not remove the progeny from the clusters, it only pushes groups severely "left" or "right" in terms of "social justice". Mixed-race people, for example, feel alienated and "not belonging" to one group or the other, resulting in political fracturing, which is apparent in the US currently.
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Gloominary » Wed May 27, 2020 4:18 pm

Y1-Axis (Hierarchy) Class, Social Value, Contribution, Loyalty/Disloyalty, Order/Chaos, Royalist/Rebel
Y2-Axis (Economics) Wealth, Elitism, Monopolization/Subsidization, Free Market/Socialism, Industry/Welfare

X1-Axis (Liberty) Freedom To/Freedom From, Oppression/Victimhood, Blame/Guilt/Innocence, Privilege, Rights, Humanity and Humanism
X2-Axis (Justice) Male/Female, Competition/Cooperation, Discrimination/Anti-Discrimination, Exclusivity/Inclusivity, Race, Racialism or Race Realism versus Denialism

Z-Axis (Modernity) Progressive/Regressive, Forward/Backward, Future/Past, Art/Science/Religion, Amorality/Morality

If you're going to divvy things up into 3-5 dichotomies, that works.
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Gloominary » Wed May 27, 2020 4:42 pm

My hypothesis is: race/ethnic group is distinctly tied to specific clusters of political affiliation.

Therefore, if you are East Asian, then you will be more 'Socialist-Communist-Egalitarian' due to the severe Homogeneity of the East Asiatic Race.

Race/Ethnic group is primary (Nature). Political affiliation, identity, and location is secondary (Nurture). Humans cannot be "taught out of" or "convinced" of opposing political or racial factions, if innate differences are too large. This hypothesis automatically explains the differing political, commercial, industrial, social, and religious motivations of individuals directly corresponding to their racial and ethnic group clusters. Mixing races and ethnic groups does not remove the progeny from the clusters, it only pushes groups severely "left" or "right" in terms of "social justice". Mixed-race people, for example, feel alienated and "not belonging" to one group or the other, resulting in political fracturing, which is apparent in the US currently.

I don't think Asians are egalitarian, in general they're servile and slavish.
Anarchism, ergatocracy, democracy, timocracy, republicanism and nationalism are all white ideas, blind obedience Asiatic.
It was the fact that whites were freemen, among other facts, that enabled them to conquer nonwhites.

We ought to have a balance of democracy (more security (and liberty) for the majority) and republicanism (liberty (and security) for all), instead we have more security and liberty for minorities, the overclass and women, we may as well have more suffrage for minorities, the overclass and women too.

Which brings me to another way of thinking about these things.

This one is 4 dimensional (X, Y, Z and Temporal).

X/Object Axis: Security or Liberty

And of course there's different sorts of Security or Liberty, ecological, economic, medical, social and so on.
And Security or Liberty aren't always opposed, sometimes they're compatible or complimentary.

XA: Intellectual Security or Liberty
XB: Social Security or Liberty
XC: Economic Security or Liberty

Y/Subject Axis: Egalitarianism/(Reverse) Supremacism

Oftentimes one group can gain Security and Liberty at the loss of another group's Security and Liberty.
Security and Liberty for all or Security and Liberty for some and Insecurity and Subjugation for others?

YA/Class: (Security, Liberty and Suffrage for) The Poor and/or the Rich
YB/Ethnicity, Nationality and Race: Minorities and/or the Majority
YC/Sex: Women and/or Men

Z/Spatial Axis: Centralism, Globalism & Internationalism/Decentralism, Localism & Nationalism

Temporal Axis: Progressivism/Regressivism & Traditionalism
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Urwrongx1000 » Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:37 am

Alright, I think it's best to split a few more dimensions then.

A, B, C, and X, Y, Z

I think Liberty/Security can be "A". While "Left-Right" political ideology should be "X".



A: Liberty/Security

B: "unnamed"

C: "unnamed"



X: Left/Right

Y1: Class (privilege)
Y2: Wealth (economics)

Z: Progress/Regress, Science/Religion, "Forward/Backward"
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Urwrongx1000 » Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:38 am

I think "B" should be Humanism, Gender, Race, biological and pathological identities.
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Urwrongx1000 » Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:40 am

X: Left/Right = "social justice", liberalism vs conservativsm, the "best way" to talk, confront, or deal with social issues in general.

Social justice is somewhat parallel to "Liberty/Security".

So X and A deminsions are close to tangent.
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Gloominary » Tue Jun 09, 2020 5:38 pm

I think I'm satisfied with 4 dimensions.

X Liberty/Security
Y Egalitarianism/Elitism
Z Globalism/Localism
T Progressive/Regressive
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Gloominary » Tue Jun 09, 2020 6:39 pm

Elitism is discrimination, subjugation.
Egalitarianism is antidiscrimination and reverse-discrimination.
Elitists discriminate in different ways.
Caste, ethnic, national and racial: Serfdom, segregationism, separatism and slavery.
Sexual: Patriarchy.
Socioeconomic: (Re)Distribution, (re)habilitation, restitution and retribution.
Egalitarians block, counter, deflect, parry and reverse these forms of discrimination.
Discrimination or antidiscrimination and reverse discrimination can take place within libertarianism or it can be enforced by the state (security).
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Re: [email protected]

Postby Gloominary » Tue Jun 09, 2020 9:40 pm

If you want 6 dimensions, you could go:

A Society (health and safety, morals and values): Hedonism/Asceticism
B Government: Liberty/Security
C Economics: Capitalism/Socialism

X Identity (caste and race, ethnicity and nationality, gender and sex): Inclusivism/Exclusivism
Y Space: Globalism/Localism
Z Time: Progressivism/Regressivism

Note: You can be a globalist by conquest or consent and still be a racist and sexist, likewise you can be a localist and still be an antiracist and antisexist.
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