It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Discussion of the recent unfolding of history.

Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Meno_ » Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:38 pm

Meno_ wrote:"Can you be more specific?"



As soon as the Oracle is answered


Seriously
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Zero_Sum » Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:51 pm

Meno_ wrote:
Meno_ wrote:"Can you be more specific?"



As soon as the Oracle is answered


Seriously


Cryptic much? :lol:
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Zero_Sum » Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:56 pm

Peter Kropotkin wrote:
Zero_Sum wrote:
Peter Kropotkin wrote:zero: You Marxist-lite democrats or full blow communists are in store for such a huge rude awakening. :lol:

K: actually, I am not a communist.. given a choice, I would prefer anarchism...

Z: Also, every successful revolution is started by a minority of people.

K: if you actually have read history, you would know that the minority of people
you refer to are really either middle class or Aristocrats...every single major
rebellion or revolution has been lead by someone/somebodies from the middle
or wealthy class... see the French Revolution or the Russian Revolution or
even see the minor revolution in the U.S during the 1930's which was lead by an aristocrat
named.. Franklin D. Roosevelt....

that is why the current situation hasn't resolved itself... we don't have the leaders
from the upper or middle class who have stepped up and begun the revolution....

a bill gates or a Mark Cuban would actually give you some idea of what
the revolution is waiting for....

Z: Political moderates are going to be devoured in this current time period, this is the era of political extremism or radicalism and I love it. 8)

K: there is no historical backing for you statement.... the moderates may go underground, but
they will survive and be the leaders of the next generation....that is what history has shown us...

if you understand that for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction, then
you will have a far better understanding of both history and politics, then dozens
of history or political classes you might take in school.....

see this idea from the French revolution, the Thermidorian reaction... that is far more
likely then any moderate bloodbath...

Kropotkin


Z: So, there has never been a working class or peasant revolution ever in history? I think you're wrong on that but I will agree a majority is devised by middle and upper classes. [Usually when they want somebody else's power for themselves.]

K: feel free to name a working class or peasant revolution that wasn't led by
someone from the middle or upper class....

Z: An anarchist? You're in worse shape than the communists then.

K: as noted, I said prefer anarchism, but there are aspects of communism I like
and parts I dislike... as I noted in another thread this morning, I would like to
move communism to become more "secular" and not so much an religion...

Z: Better hope the moderates can go into hiding a few hundred years because that's what we're looking at concerning the new global dark ages. [It will only stop being the dark ages when one contender comes out of the chaos as the dominant ideology that fixes things. Could be an extremely long time before that happens.]


K: having studied history for over 40 years, it is rare that things ever turn so bleak
as to exist for a "few hundred years"....the historical period known as the "Enlightenment"
which still drives much of what is happening today, lasted less then 80 years and the
Renaissance lasted, depending on the country, lasted roughly 300 years.. in theory,
in practice, it really lasted maybe 200 years at most....

read history and see that history is driven by cycles... what is up today is down tomorrow
and what is down is up...liberalism is followed by conservatism and then liberalism comes
back... cycles of history is really the best way to understand history...

wait long enough and everything will return... this is true socially and this
is true politically....the true course of history is cycles within cycles...

one can see after a long time of conservativism in America, we can see
the rise of liberalism.. and after a long time of liberalism, we will see
the rise of conservatism once again...that is how it works...…cycles....

I suspect, don't know, but suspect, that the coming cycle of liberalism will
last a couple of decades, then conservatism will come back.....so with luck,
I will be dead when conservatism makes its return.....

Kropotkin


There was the Dark Ages of Europe. Sometimes past history isn't much of a guide as everything is unprecedented now. Neo-liberalism making a comeback? I doubt it.

It really doesn't matter who's elected next year or what mainstream political party ascends into power, the United States economy is still on the verge of collapse where it isn't going to care all that much who is in office.

I almost want the democrats to win next year to speed up the process of chaos, destruction, and economic collapse but being the man of principles that I am I just can't vote for anybody at all next year. I just can't participate in the joke of these national elections being that I'm strongly against it all.
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Meno_ » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:13 pm

Zero_Sum wrote:
Meno_ wrote:
Meno_ wrote:"Can you be more specific?"




Not at all, much. If the foundation be known. But it is not what the oracle can be after.
As soon as the Oracle is answered


Seriously


Cryptic much? :lol:



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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Meno_ » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:15 pm

To every BODY
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:20 pm

Z:
There was the Dark Ages of Europe. Sometimes past history isn't much of a guide as everything is unprecedented now. Neo-liberalism making a comeback? I doubt it.

K: yes, and how often can we say there were a dark ages? yep, once in over 3000 years....
and yes, liberalism will make a comeback and we can see the signs even today.. with the
rise of Bernie and Warrens.. the very faith in capitalism has fallen, we see attacks upon
capitalism every day, something we haven't seen since the 1960's and before that, 1930's...

and history is a great guide to what is to come.. that is why we study history....
to see what is to come... we can see IQ45 as nothing more then another tinpot
wanna be dictator.... and we have seen how we get rid of pretenders to the throne..
we remove them...legally or otherwise.....

Z: It really doesn't matter who's elected next year or what mainstream political party ascends into power, the United States economy is still on the verge of collapse where it isn't going to care all that much who is in office.

K: it really depends upon the coming next year....as for being on the "verge of collapse"
doubt it... we are weakened, no doubt, but the fall from grace will take some time,
and perhaps last for decades... we can see IQ45 hastening the end, but Rome
was heading for collapse for centuries before it finally came....it will take a while before
the "Barbarians" come over the ridge to take over Rome/America....

Z: I almost want the democrats to win next year to speed up the process of chaos, destruction, and economic collapse but being the man of principles that I am I just can't vote for anybody at all next year.[/quote]

K: ah, lying to oneself.. you have no principles, you have made that very clear....
wanting to destroy everything isn't about principles, but about being a 3 year old wanting
to knock down everything just to see the building fall....destruction for its own sake isn't
a principle, it is just wanton abdication of being an adult....any idiot over 3 can try to
destroy things, it is easy, ask IQ45.. no, the real trick is to build and be creative
and that takes time, a vision, values, honesty and integrity....

have you ever advocated for something instead of trying to destroy things?

I haven't seen it... no, your thing is negative, destructive, knock down civilization without
having some sort of plan or even a reason to destroy civilization....no, you are a child
who can only destroy.. you can't even consider the possibility of being creative and
positive and build something....for that takes work... and you are lazy.....

Kropotkin
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wind up with neither."
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Zero_Sum » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:26 pm

Peter Kropotkin wrote:Z:
There was the Dark Ages of Europe. Sometimes past history isn't much of a guide as everything is unprecedented now. Neo-liberalism making a comeback? I doubt it.

K: yes, and how often can we say there were a dark ages? yep, once in over 3000 years....
and yes, liberalism will make a comeback and we can see the signs even today.. with the
rise of Bernie and Warrens.. the very faith in capitalism has fallen, we see attacks upon
capitalism every day, something we haven't seen since the 1960's and before that, 1930's...

and history is a great guide to what is to come.. that is why we study history....
to see what is to come... we can see IQ45 as nothing more then another tinpot
wanna be dictator.... and we have seen how we get rid of pretenders to the throne..
we remove them...legally or otherwise.....

Z: It really doesn't matter who's elected next year or what mainstream political party ascends into power, the United States economy is still on the verge of collapse where it isn't going to care all that much who is in office.

K: it really depends upon the coming next year....as for being on the "verge of collapse"
doubt it... we are weakened, no doubt, but the fall from grace will take some time,
and perhaps last for decades... we can see IQ45 hastening the end, but Rome
was heading for collapse for centuries before it finally came....it will take a while before
the "Barbarians" come over the ridge to take over Rome/America....

Z: I almost want the democrats to win next year to speed up the process of chaos, destruction, and economic collapse but being the man of principles that I am I just can't vote for anybody at all next year.

K: ah, lying to oneself.. you have no principles, you have made that very clear....
wanting to destroy everything isn't about principles, but about being a 3 year old wanting
to knock down everything just to see the building fall....destruction for its own sake isn't
a principle, it is just wanton abdication of being an adult....any idiot over 3 can try to
destroy things, it is easy, ask IQ45.. no, the real trick is to build and be creative
and that takes time, a vision, values, honesty and integrity....

have you ever advocated for something instead of trying to destroy things?

I haven't seen it... no, your thing is negative, destructive, knock down civilization without
having some sort of plan or even a reason to destroy civilization....no, you are a child
who can only destroy.. you can't even consider the possibility of being creative and
positive and build something....for that takes work... and you are lazy.....

Kropotkin


I think human beings need a new clean slate and reset from zero hence why I view destruction as the method of getting that reset. Destruction is the method and means as a vehicle of change that I view is incapable of happening under this current environment without it. Has nothing to do with being lazy whatever that means.

I do have principles it's just different kind of principles that the average person wouldn't understand much.

There is no creation without destruction and I just want to see the current world destroyed in order to create or build a new one. I'm very creative just not in ways you're accustomed to.

So, why couldn't we enter the Dark Ages now? Is it I-pads?

If history is indicative of anything it is that us fascists and our dictators are just natural manifestations of what happens when democracies or republics collapse in on themselves, therefore we have our natural place in cyclical history also. 8)

Modern democracies and republics have shit the bed, it's our turn to put things back into order once again.
Last edited by Zero_Sum on Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:50 pm

Zero_Sum wrote:
Peter Kropotkin wrote:Z:
There was the Dark Ages of Europe. Sometimes past history isn't much of a guide as everything is unprecedented now. Neo-liberalism making a comeback? I doubt it.

K: yes, and how often can we say there were a dark ages? yep, once in over 3000 years....
and yes, liberalism will make a comeback and we can see the signs even today.. with the
rise of Bernie and Warrens.. the very faith in capitalism has fallen, we see attacks upon
capitalism every day, something we haven't seen since the 1960's and before that, 1930's...

and history is a great guide to what is to come.. that is why we study history....
to see what is to come... we can see IQ45 as nothing more then another tinpot
wanna be dictator.... and we have seen how we get rid of pretenders to the throne..
we remove them...legally or otherwise.....

Z: It really doesn't matter who's elected next year or what mainstream political party ascends into power, the United States economy is still on the verge of collapse where it isn't going to care all that much who is in office.

K: it really depends upon the coming next year....as for being on the "verge of collapse"
doubt it... we are weakened, no doubt, but the fall from grace will take some time,
and perhaps last for decades... we can see IQ45 hastening the end, but Rome
was heading for collapse for centuries before it finally came....it will take a while before
the "Barbarians" come over the ridge to take over Rome/America....

Z: I almost want the democrats to win next year to speed up the process of chaos, destruction, and economic collapse but being the man of principles that I am I just can't vote for anybody at all next year.

K: ah, lying to oneself.. you have no principles, you have made that very clear....
wanting to destroy everything isn't about principles, but about being a 3 year old wanting
to knock down everything just to see the building fall....destruction for its own sake isn't
a principle, it is just wanton abdication of being an adult....any idiot over 3 can try to
destroy things, it is easy, ask IQ45.. no, the real trick is to build and be creative
and that takes time, a vision, values, honesty and integrity....

have you ever advocated for something instead of trying to destroy things?

I haven't seen it... no, your thing is negative, destructive, knock down civilization without
having some sort of plan or even a reason to destroy civilization....no, you are a child
who can only destroy.. you can't even consider the possibility of being creative and
positive and build something....for that takes work... and you are lazy.....

Kropotkin


I think human beings need a new clean slate and reset from zero hence why I view destruction as the method of getting that reset. Destruction is the method and means as a vehicle of change that I view is incapable of happening under this current environment without it. Has nothing to do with being lazy whatever that means.

I do have principles it's just different kind of principles that the average person wouldn't understand much.

There is no creation without destruction and I just want to see the current world destroyed in order to create or build a new one. I'm very creative just not in ways you're accustomed to.

So, why couldn't we enter the Dark Ages now? Is it I-pads?


K: ah, your principles are so advance and beyond anybody else that no one
could possible understand them....I see.....

it is easy, all too easy to want to smash the whole thing down,
remember, I am a former anarchist...the real trick is this,
what happens after the revolution? what is next? you have never
said anything about what happens next after the revolution?

and that is my problem.... destruction is easy, but coming up with
what is next, that is hard.....so people need a new beginning, what is
that new beginning? what is the next step in our "evolution" of being human?

what new world are you trying to build? Or is that way to beyond anyone to grasp
besides yourself?

it must be tough to be the only person alive who can be so advance as to
have some mysterious plan that will build the new world....

it must suck dealing with people who aren't as advanced as you....

Kropotkin
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wind up with neither."
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Pedro I Rengel » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:52 pm

Meno_ wrote:The U.S. is vested too deep to allow any major moves on it's currency. The US is really the USNWO. After all skirmishes like the late great recession may have been like blasting minor fissures of earthquake prone terrain, so that the Big One can be averted.
The G7 is not all that transparent, and among all the hubbub of the international banking community, there is veritable hubs of international policy making, to which capital has to subscribe to.
Policy reigns supreme among the high players of international finance, and the public marketplace of the local media is not only allowed, but encouraged to take up the slack.
Total international coup is inconceivable, as a natural byproduct.


That's pretty much how it is.

Of course, all the people that make up these hubs go to school SOMEwhere.
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Zero_Sum » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:53 pm

Anarchists don't have very good organized plans after the destruction of a civilization, nation, or society but fascists do. 8)
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Zero_Sum » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:56 pm

Peter Kropotkin wrote:
Zero_Sum wrote:
Peter Kropotkin wrote:Z:
There was the Dark Ages of Europe. Sometimes past history isn't much of a guide as everything is unprecedented now. Neo-liberalism making a comeback? I doubt it.

K: yes, and how often can we say there were a dark ages? yep, once in over 3000 years....
and yes, liberalism will make a comeback and we can see the signs even today.. with the
rise of Bernie and Warrens.. the very faith in capitalism has fallen, we see attacks upon
capitalism every day, something we haven't seen since the 1960's and before that, 1930's...

and history is a great guide to what is to come.. that is why we study history....
to see what is to come... we can see IQ45 as nothing more then another tinpot
wanna be dictator.... and we have seen how we get rid of pretenders to the throne..
we remove them...legally or otherwise.....

Z: It really doesn't matter who's elected next year or what mainstream political party ascends into power, the United States economy is still on the verge of collapse where it isn't going to care all that much who is in office.

K: it really depends upon the coming next year....as for being on the "verge of collapse"
doubt it... we are weakened, no doubt, but the fall from grace will take some time,
and perhaps last for decades... we can see IQ45 hastening the end, but Rome
was heading for collapse for centuries before it finally came....it will take a while before
the "Barbarians" come over the ridge to take over Rome/America....

Z: I almost want the democrats to win next year to speed up the process of chaos, destruction, and economic collapse but being the man of principles that I am I just can't vote for anybody at all next year.

K: ah, lying to oneself.. you have no principles, you have made that very clear....
wanting to destroy everything isn't about principles, but about being a 3 year old wanting
to knock down everything just to see the building fall....destruction for its own sake isn't
a principle, it is just wanton abdication of being an adult....any idiot over 3 can try to
destroy things, it is easy, ask IQ45.. no, the real trick is to build and be creative
and that takes time, a vision, values, honesty and integrity....

have you ever advocated for something instead of trying to destroy things?

I haven't seen it... no, your thing is negative, destructive, knock down civilization without
having some sort of plan or even a reason to destroy civilization....no, you are a child
who can only destroy.. you can't even consider the possibility of being creative and
positive and build something....for that takes work... and you are lazy.....

Kropotkin


I think human beings need a new clean slate and reset from zero hence why I view destruction as the method of getting that reset. Destruction is the method and means as a vehicle of change that I view is incapable of happening under this current environment without it. Has nothing to do with being lazy whatever that means.

I do have principles it's just different kind of principles that the average person wouldn't understand much.

There is no creation without destruction and I just want to see the current world destroyed in order to create or build a new one. I'm very creative just not in ways you're accustomed to.

So, why couldn't we enter the Dark Ages now? Is it I-pads?


K: ah, your principles are so advance and beyond anybody else that no one
could possible understand them....I see.....

it is easy, all too easy to want to smash the whole thing down,
remember, I am a former anarchist...the real trick is this,
what happens after the revolution? what is next? you have never
said anything about what happens next after the revolution?

and that is my problem.... destruction is easy, but coming up with
what is next, that is hard.....so people need a new beginning, what is
that new beginning? what is the next step in our "evolution" of being human?

what new world are you trying to build? Or is that way to beyond anyone to grasp
besides yourself?

it must be tough to be the only person alive who can be so advance as to
have some mysterious plan that will build the new world....

it must suck dealing with people who aren't as advanced as you....

Kropotkin



Well now that I think of it, yeah it kinda does suck. :) It certainly is lonely.

What's next after destruction? A variety of things that I could talk about a lot actually but the most important thing is that of a new beginning.

The United States has been collapsing since the late 1970's and you don't pay much attention to economics where I won't even bother there. You think we have a decade or two before terrible things happen whereas I think we have a year and maybe two at the most. :lol:
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:16 pm

Z: Well now that I think of it, yeah it kinda does suck. :) It certainly is lonely.

What's next after destruction? A variety of things that I could talk about a lot actually but the most important thing is that of a new beginning.[/quote]

K: no, the most important thing is what happens after the destruction..
destruction is easy... not hard at all...to want a "new beginning" without
stating what the new beginning is what I call lazy.... have a plan, even
if it is a bad plan, at least have a plan and you don't even have that much....

the failure of the French revolution is the failure of understanding
what is next....they too wanted the revolution and when they got it,
they had no plan into the future... the what next...….

ok, let try this... ok, we have roughly 7 billion people...
after the destruction, what do we tell these 7 billion people
what the plan is? ok, we have destroyed civilization... your are on your own?
is that really the plan? ok, people, create some new beginning for yourself....

how the hell is that supposed to work?

that is not a plan, that is wishful thinking....

not too different then the communist's plan, that the job is over once
we have created the "workers paradise".. that all folks...history ends....
move along, nothing to see here.....move where?

you are engaging in nothing more then wishful thinking that after
the revolution, we will have some new miraculous beginning that I
can't explain or describe but I have faith in it.... my goodness,
you are nothing more then a Christian thinking that after the end times, we
will be living in some thousand years of perfect paradise...….
but first come the destruction.... then some miracle will occur....

jeez whiz....why didn't I think of that?

have blind faith in some miraculous beginning that will occur after the
great destruction....

good luck with that....

Kropotkin
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wind up with neither."
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:24 pm

Z:

Well now that I think of it, yeah it kinda does suck. :) It certainly is lonely.

What's next after destruction? A variety of things that I could talk about a lot actually but the most important thing is that of a new beginning.

The United States has been collapsing since the late 1970's and you don't pay much attention to economics where I won't even bother there. You think we have a decade or two before terrible things happen whereas I think we have a year and maybe two at the most. :lol:[/quote]


K: I am having a problem keeping up with your editing new stuff into your post...
my brother graduated with a phd in economics and we discuss economics all the time....

I was alive in the 1970's... I doubt you were... the point where we began to have
problems was with uncle Ronny, Raygun…. we can trace the beginning of the end to
his destructive polices of destroying the lower and middle classes.....

every single tax cut, the welfare for the rich program, brings us one step closer
to some really serious problems....we do have decades to solve them, but our time
is growing short as IQ45 is engaged in some serious destruction of what is decent
about America and worth saving....

Kroptkin
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wind up with neither."
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Zero_Sum » Fri Nov 15, 2019 4:52 am

Peter Kropotkin wrote:

K: I am having a problem keeping up with your editing new stuff into your post...
my brother graduated with a phd in economics and we discuss economics all the time....

I was alive in the 1970's... I doubt you were... the point where we began to have
problems was with uncle Ronny, Raygun…. we can trace the beginning of the end to
his destructive polices of destroying the lower and middle classes.....

every single tax cut, the welfare for the rich program, brings us one step closer
to some really serious problems....we do have decades to solve them, but our time
is growing short as IQ45 is engaged in some serious destruction of what is decent
about America and worth saving....

Kroptkin


Yeah, I edit my posts repetitively. I give you fair warning now, it's just how I write online.

I was born in the wonderful year of 1987, the first major economic crash of the United States in recent memory before 2007 with the introduction of Reaganomics which explains how shitty my entire life has been. There's one thing I agree with neo-liberals on and that is neo-conservative economics have been devastating on the United States. I know this because I've been forced to live under it my entire life. What I disagree with you on however is your so called economic solutions to the problems, your solutions are no solution at all.

I don't think economic reform is possible in this nation anymore which is why I've become very revolutionary as of late.
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Re: It's a wonderful time period in the United States 2020

Postby Zero_Sum » Fri Nov 15, 2019 4:59 am

Peter Kropotkin wrote:
K: no, the most important thing is what happens after the destruction..
destruction is easy... not hard at all...to want a "new beginning" without
stating what the new beginning is what I call lazy.... have a plan, even
if it is a bad plan, at least have a plan and you don't even have that much....

the failure of the French revolution is the failure of understanding
what is next....they too wanted the revolution and when they got it,
they had no plan into the future... the what next...….

ok, let try this... ok, we have roughly 7 billion people...
after the destruction, what do we tell these 7 billion people
what the plan is? ok, we have destroyed civilization... your are on your own?
is that really the plan? ok, people, create some new beginning for yourself....

how the hell is that supposed to work?

that is not a plan, that is wishful thinking....

not too different then the communist's plan, that the job is over once
we have created the "workers paradise".. that all folks...history ends....
move along, nothing to see here.....move where?

you are engaging in nothing more then wishful thinking that after
the revolution, we will have some new miraculous beginning that I
can't explain or describe but I have faith in it.... my goodness,
you are nothing more then a Christian thinking that after the end times, we
will be living in some thousand years of perfect paradise...….
but first come the destruction.... then some miracle will occur....

jeez whiz....why didn't I think of that?

have blind faith in some miraculous beginning that will occur after the
great destruction....

good luck with that....

Kropotkin


I have many ideas of what could make things better on many fronts socially, existentially, economically, and politically but at the same time I'm just a poor extremely low income middle age man that lives in the Midwest of a town with a population of 2000 people.

I have no real power, influence, or capital to change much of anything. All I have is my rage and desire for retribution.
"I'm sorry, but the lifestyle you've ordered that you've grown accustomed to is completely out of stock. Have a nice day! "-$$$
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Zero_Sum
Evil Neo-Nazi Extraordinaire.
 
Posts: 2560
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:05 pm
Location: U.S.S.A- Newly lead Bolshevik Soviet block. Also known as Weimar America.

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