the limits of control,free enterprise and technology, and

[obe]

There are limits to everything. The sociopsychological-economic curves of recessions associated with free enterprise have had fairly predictable rates of change, and major recessions have only been able to be remedied by major social upheavals such as wars, major attempts at social improvement and gross infusion of capital by private and/or public entities. All these were stop gap attempts of a topical nature, structurally, a very undefined, confusing state of affairs existed in capital markets, ideological processes, and control and check mechanisms installed. Marx the ideologue can be associated with roughly 100 million deaths, fascism a very comparable number, and "democratic values" too, with sizable statistics, especially in the former colonial empires. Colonialization and its aftermath entailed more than wars, it needed huge infusion of capital, most of which went into the pockets of such figures as Sukarno, Diem, the Shah or Iran, etc. The excuse was, that post colonial societies were unable to benefit from democracy as a grass roots movement. The point being made is, is with the evolving milestones of high technology applications, the dictators are falling.control is becoming increasingly technological, and we are approaching the big Brother scenarios that were only written about previously. However control, too, has facets, and beyond the control of the mass psychological propaganda of the value makers, of the ad-men, there remains the determiners yet very loosely associated areas of capital markets, and the political processes. Capital markets are very nervous. The equalization of capital world wide, has vastly larger implications-as the previously mostly regional ones, and the mechanisms although in place, are not nearly fine tuned. Therefore the controls have not yet set in, as to function in a smooth, predictable way, and controls are becoming the focal point in determining monetary value, (inflation/deflation) the cost of borrowing, and the availability of monetary supply. This is where limits come in. Limits of accumulation, have everything to do with a very basic human trait: to utilize capital markets by controlling the profit margin whereof labor can be of maximal benefit to both the holders and the producers of capital. This is very Marx ian, and this description is a topical representation of a failed communist empire. However communism failed because of factors beyond my scope. However, one thing is certain, capitalism didn't succeed on steps following the demise of Communism.its only adversarial ideology, and strictly speaking with fascism defeated triple bilaterally, this was unforeseen. What is going on here? The only conclusion which can be drawn is, that with social and political control well established in most advanced industrial societies, the only uncontrolled facet of. Democratic societies is uncontrolled accumulation. The uncontrolled wealth begotten by a new kind of subjugation, is what is structurally unsound in the new worldwide capitalism, and it is that, which may, if left unsaid, bring it to its knees. I am afraid, the past few years, may be nothing but a thinly veiled foreshadowing of the horrors to come.

[Smears]

Obe, I want to talk to you a little bit about putting things into a form that is easy to read on a forum.

What you've done here has is what some people would refer to as a wall of text. http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.p ... 0of%20text

I'd like to be able to read what you've posted, because the first line or two seemed interesting, but I can't focus my eyes for that long that well on that many words bunched together like that.

[Jamazing]

I'd like to be able to read what you've posted, because the first line or two seemed interesting, but I can't focus my eyes for that long that well on that many words bunched together like that.

I would agree. I skipped down to read comments to find out if the struggle was worth it and found Smears comment.

Obe, I hope you do it, I am interested. Poor format and structure have a negative subconscious effect on the reader. I don't want that to hinder my view of what you have to say, therefore I will wait.

[xhightension]

There are limits to everything.

Does this come from your static, dead perception of the world?

[Smears]

Here's some nice stuff about limits.

http://www.google.com/search?sugexp=chr ... sssumption

[xhightension]

Here's some nice stuff about limits.

http://www.google.com/search?sugexp=chr ... sssumption

Why don't you break it down for me. I'm not feeling the laborious google-link reading, really.

[Smears]

Well you can't measure something if you don't know where it begins and ends. So you need limits, and if you can't prove those limits are "real" or whatever, then you still need them in order to be able to properly break down alot of complicated shit.

[xhightension]

If something is unmeasurable then that thing is limitless?

[ScavengingVulture]

In a finite world.......

[obe]

If something is immeasurable then that thing is limitless?

Hightension, smears: if "that thing" is limitless, yes its also immeasurable. But that thing is a function of control. Specifically, control of the growth of capital seems to be limited by the few checks available. To limit capital acquisition implies control over it. An unlimited field in capital acquisition for sure can derive a measure of it's value, and scavenger is right, if the field is limited,
This derivative has become fairly predictable, the controls necessary have not been without misses
Recessions and depressions require up-ending controls on market and paper/money flow adjustments, such as lowering interest rates, saving institutions "too big to fall", increasing the money supply, (with borrowing), and controlling trading practices' etc.
The limits to capital holding, is pretty non existent, and as capital holdings grow, existing control apparatus seem to pale by comparison.The effect of this,is that markets are effected by an artificiality of 2 dimensions: One, by increasing the money supply while simultaneously holding down interest rates pressures the markets held up by an accumulation of debt, while the resulting inflation is held in check. This is very much like a Ponzi scheme, where we are betting everything on the short term.
Two, the flight into gold, makes things even more confusing, since it creates additional vagueness, by capitol acquisition seemingly a "hidden" variable Since there seems to be no accountable currency acquisition (, not to speak of a further undermining of an already baseless (not backed by gold or silver) currency, instability becomes systemic.
This state of affairs is candy coated by the incredibly low interest rates, and immense public indebtedness. The economy feels stable, for now, by these manuvers by the Fed, however, these are stop gap, near term solutions to a problem, which everyone acknowledges, but don't not want to admit, with no obvious solutions, in sight.
The limits of growth were very well exemplified by President Gerald Ford, and he would have done fine if not for the Iran hostage crisis, which denied him a second term. What followed was Reagenamics, and deregulation. In a limited field,
Function of control is limited by short term assymptotes, hence values become incalculable. , That's my take on it, and we as modern industrial societies are reduced to short term manipulation, Long puts on paper are very risky, it was shorting with low margins which caused the Great depression, and although they do have more controls in place, it is the equity/debt ratio which may be the culprit now.

[Kryptocyphe_9]

Marx the ideologue can be associated with roughly 100 million deaths

wat

[obe]

Marx the ideologue can be associated with roughly 100 million deaths

I meant 100 million plus overall because of ideological struggles between 3 main systems: Marxism, fascism, and capitalism/democracy. The number is probably higher if you count in WW1, (there are suggestions, that WW1&WW2 are one continual struggle for control of ideologies)- marxism was the biggest "new" ideologie to upset the status quo. Fascism may have been a reaction to a destabilized monarchial system.

wat

[Kryptocyphe_9]

Some disambiguation:

Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels
Political Marxism
Classical Marxism
Historical Materialism
Criticism of capitalism
Revolution, socialism, and communism
Academic Marxism
Social democracy
Socialism
Communism
Marxism–Leninism
Trotskyism
Maoism
Left communism
Dispute that the Soviet Union was Marxist
Marxism-Leninism after Stalin
Post-Stalin Moscow-aligned communism
Eurocommunism
Anti-revisionism
Hoxhaism
Western Marxism
Structural Marxism
Autonomist Marxism
Marxist humanism
Marxism-Deleonism
Marxist feminism