I have seen a couple of racist(i guess… in the end they aren’t) movies (the believe, american history x, ect.) and they don’t seem to be that far off. In american history x particularly they offer startling statictics such as one in ever 3 black males is going though some step the the corectional process. I didn’t believe this so i went to my school library and cheaked out the statictics for my self… they were true. for violent crimes such as murder, rape, armed robery over 30% all the way up to some where around 51% were committed by blacks, who compose apromiatly 12% of the population 
, but can our problems in America be blamed on the mexicans sucking out wellfare, jews demoralising our society, and blacks for causing violence?
There are more factors than being ‘black’ or a ‘jew’.
What do you think of poverty? Education grade and the possibility to have a decent education?
How about the history of the jews? Doesn’t that count anymore? Forgot that the ‘American dream’ was built on the back of black slaves? No that doesn’t count anymore. They are causing problem so get rid of them instead of sharing your wealth which technically belongs 100% to them?
So what do you think? Think that blacks and jews are born to do something bad? How good is the life of an ordinary black when comparing it to the ordinary life of a ‘white’? I would call that atleast a factor.
No… These kind of doltish comments piss me off. I would like to know the source of your statisics because that is just a bunch off bull-shit to me. You wouldn’t expect to see this kind of ignorant post at ILP. Please give me your sources.
How about the history of the jews? Doesn’t that count anymore? Forgot that the ‘American dream’ was built on the back of black slaves? No that doesn’t count anymore. They are causing problem so get rid of them instead of sharing your wealth which technically belongs 100% to them?
Ummm…yeah, because slavery helped get the country started, hundreds of years later Macintosh and Microsoft belong to the descendants of slaves?
I’m not buying that at all.
And since I’m Irish, Cajun, and Cheyenne, that means I don’t owe anything, right? So none of my taxes should ever be used to support programs that aid anyone of african descent, right?
That’s another load of bull.
The truth is that our current society and the problems of old (and those that continue) are so irrevocably tied together, that there’s really no sorting any of it out.
Yes, poverty, education, and racism all play roles. Then again, so does personal choice. So, what we need to do is get the education level, and poverty to such a degree that they’re no longer major concerns. We simultaneously (I don’t know any other way to manage it) need to put an end to racism (insofar as we can). Then, all we have left is personal choice, and personal history. Those who were systematically abused can be given treatment and hopefully will manage to function in society. Those who simply made bad choices have put it on themselves and must suffer the consequences.
Will this ever happen? I don’t know. We’ll see. I will diligently hope, and work towards such goals. In then end I’ll at least be able to say that I tried.
I’m not saying that all. Microsoft belongs to Bill and the other shareholders like Mac. belongs to Steve and it’s shareholders. But black people have bought the first shares of the USA (though unwillingly) but never got the chance to cash those shares.
.
Are you saying that black people have in average the same personal choice to steal? Rubbish. Until those factors aren’t worked out you can’t even blame personal choice because the minorities don’t posses the status of the normal american citizen.
Hadj,
honestly, I feel like that line of thinking can be more degrading to minorities. Humans have been separated from animals with regards to having reason, free will, soul/morality. In some ways, by denying that the oppressed have personal choice, you are denying some of their humanity, reducing them to the level of animals.
i have always been quick to point out economic/educational differences rather than racial in terms of these statistics… most of these violent criminals are not simply black, but rather young men with no jobs and no hope in sight. at the same time, you always have a choice as a human being. i am not talking about someone starving stealing some food. these are violent crimes here, some may be robberies gone bad, but certainly that does not account for all or, i would even guess, most murders. what about rape? when does being oppressed somehow alleviate you from responsibility? how exactly does one’s own oppression justify your oppression of another?
i have one more thing to ask. Hadj, you seem to be very loud in terms of America’s oppression of minorities. I am just curious what you have to say about the netherlands. The last time i was in the Amsterdam (about 4 yrs ago), I noticed that roughly 75% of the prostitutes were black. I noticed roughly the same numbers in terms of drug dealers (the guys pushing hard drugs on the street). Most of the blacks I encountered there seemed to be in those two trades. Does the Netherlands, a bastion of liberalism, not share some responsibility for this (since we are on a “blame society” kick). Maybe my impression was simply totally outta whack, but it was very striking to me at the time.
I’m not denying anything however you must make priorities. And blaming low-priority items won’t make things any better; thus get ridding of ‘top priorities’ is more effective. If the American people can get rid of the top items than we can level yourselves to some lower issues until then keeping thinking about the main factors who brought them there in the first place.
[sarcasm]Did you know choice can be influenced by several factors?[/sarcasm] I do not try to justify crimes commited by black in America however you can’t blame them because they are black. Choices are for the most individual choices and that is justification enough to reward or punish someone, no doubt about that.
It’s not a coincendence that blacks happen to be poor and have a low education. Ever thought what the cause maybe?
We don’t have color problem in the Netherlands, none at all. Since the WWII blacks and white are getting along. And from what I know most prostitutes in the Netherlands are illegal (Romania, China, Thailand, Indonesia)…so the color doesn’t play a role.
It’s known that natives are running the drug economics. Liquidation mainly occurs on white people how strange it maybe. So once again, color doesn’t play a role (I study in Amsterdam). We blame mainly illegals for the current problems. be it white, yellow or/and or black.
P.S. Most ‘junkies and beggars’ are black in Amsterdam.
Well its not that someone steals because they have no money, its more that people don’t steal because they do.
Give your average CEO ten days without so much as a sandwhich and they’ll take the whole damn boardroom in to hold up the quickymart. They already have the moral charater of theives, they just don’t have the motive.
Perhaps you could define “low-priority” and “top priorities” for me, cause quite frankly, I haven’t the foggiest what you’re talking about here.
So why in the world did you counter my initial post? I’m getting the impression you misread my statement.
Well, several actually. Racism is one. But it’s also the fact that people tend to die within the same socio-economic rung they were born in, so even without racism it would still be difficult for black people to get better jobs and better educations because they would still be living in the areas with the worst schools and get lower paying jobs.
And since we can’t actually combat racism effectively on any direct level, a good counter strategy is to target education and jobs, so that the stigma of “the angry young black man who steals TVs and cars and sells crack on the street” is no longer so easy a label to apply.
If you change the image of the black community that the rest of the world has (especially the WASPs) you can do a lot to eventually combat racism, and then improvements should get easier.
so why does the money that i earn belong to the black man? Don’t worry he will get his payment even if it means putting a bullet in my chest. Look that the statistics for christ sake. the minorities are crime prone. you can blame it on poverity if you want. but does poverty justify murder?!
i got these statistics out of a book checked out from my high school!
Homicide Offending Rates per 100,000 Population by Race
White Black Other
1976 5.1 44.7 7.4
1977 5.3 42.3 8.3
1978 5.5 42.3 7.0
1979 6.0 45.2 9.5
1980 6.7 49.9 6.2
1981 6.1 44.8 6.2
1982 5.8 39.8 6.8
1983 5.3 35.6 6.4
1984 5.3 32.8 5.2
1985 5.1 33.3 5.6
1986 5.4 36.8 6.4
1987 5.3 35.6 4.9
1988 5.0 40.3 4.3
1989 5.1 41.9 4.3
1990 5.6 46.9 4.1
1991 5.7 50.4 5.4
1992 5.2 46.8 5.8
1993 5.2 49.3 5.6
1994 5.0 46.1 4.9
1995 4.9 39.1 5.1
1996 4.5 35.8 4.7
1997 4.1 32.4 4.5
1998 4.1 28.4 3.5
1999 3.6 25.5 3.9
2000 3.4 25.8 3.
this is from the Bureau of Justice Statistics
in 2000 a black man was 7 times more likely to comit a murder than a white man
(my apologises for not condensing the posts)
Am i the only one who sees these mexicans border hopping. They come into a Land where they have no right to be, and get here because the politicians don’t have the balls to tighten the grip on the border in fear of losing votes from the mexican population(who don’t vote much anyway)! Then this illegal imagrant steals my car, joins a gang atempts to kill my brother in law, and sells drugs on the side for some spending cash. I have met people in poverty and never stolen a dime! maybe i’m the only one who sees this because i live near the border, but i can asure you this is not a problem in some distant land thousands of ocean miles away. this is happening in my back yard and parhaps someday yours
Well fine, blame the Mexicans, just not the Latinos. There is a sutble differance there but its key. In other words, be sure to diffentiate the brown college professor visiting from Massicussis, and the illegial immigrateing gang banger who just hopped o’re the border.
Actually those illegal mexican immigrants are the ones bussing your tables, washing your cars, cleaning up your trash, picking the fruits and vegetables that you eat [in sweltering heat while breathing in chemicals] and doing all the shit work that most Americans don’t want to do. Most of them are not here to commit crimes, they could do that in Mexico. They are here to work, because there are jobs here, jobs that simply are not filled by Americans. Mexican immigrants, illegal and legal, play a huge role in the economy of Texas and the SW, and without them, many of those economies would suffer greatly… Since you live near the border, you should be better aware of the fact that your economy (and thus your families livelihood) depend on having cheap labor to do scut work. If you don’t believe me, talk to some business owners down there. Or go to Texas and watch the bridge at Laredo and see thousands of Mexicans, legally entering this country to serve Americans food, clean there houses, pick up their trash, etc. I would rather not stereotype, but most Mexicans coming over here are very solid, hard-working people who just want a job so they can feed their families. Even the illegals send huge amounts of money back to their families to support them, while living on tiny amounts. Hmmm, hard-working, family people… I say let more of them in the country. Educate them, make them Americans. America will be much better off for it
You blame the black man, or the mexican for the high crime rate, but what you should really be taking into account is the circumstances that lead up to these statistics. Minorities live and are brought up in a high crime rate area. They are surrounded by poverty and crime. Is it not so that minorities are the victims in the first place. Placed in a society where they are looked down upon and expected to commit crimes, why shouldnt they? If you have ever lived in these types of circumstances you would have an entirely different perspective on this subject. If you come from nothing, you have to be willing to take chances. More often than not, minorites are taken as criminals, and cannot even get jobs. This leads to desperation, remember that they are poor and have been that way for most of their life. You get tired of living in this circumstances and you are constantly looking for a way out. Look at the projects, they are surrounded by cages. I dont think you are asking the right questions. How would you feel if you were, not by choice, placed in this type of position. How do you think you would react?
to follow up with the economic bent on things… does any have crime statistics from the Depression in comparison with percentages from today? Any other place/era with high unemployment and little to no social net should help prove the point as well.
I’m sure he’s just misinformed jess… Here’s some good statistics on prison populations…
BULLSHIT! They have just as much of a right to be here as you do! In fact, they are more or less direct decendents of the Native American people, so it could be argued that they have more of a right to be here then you do! Did your forefathers cross the land bridge from Asia? Furthermore, I live in Texas, so know about immigrants. They don’t come here to steal your car, they come here to find a job that you would feel like you are too good for. What is wrong with that?
Are you trying to say it’s genetics? Are you and your family poor? Do you live in a ghetto. Were you raised in a ghetto? If not I wouldn’t condemn those who are/were.
Amen!