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logic and knowledge

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2017 7:07 pm
by Dan~
Can logic produce knowledge or truth, on its own, in any way?

Why does any kind of logic exist in the world, unless the world was in some way logical?

Re: logic and knowledge

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:17 pm
by Magnus Anderson
What exactly is logic?

Re: logic and knowledge

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2017 10:33 pm
by Dan~
Magnus Anderson wrote:What exactly is logic?

I was asking myself that same question.

Logic is basically conclusions.
Thought-structure.
Maybe.

The meaning of the word will differ from person to person.

Re: logic and knowledge

PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 5:30 am
by Mr Reasonable
Magnus Anderson wrote:What exactly is logic?


YES.

Re: logic and knowledge

PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 5:51 am
by James S Saint
Logic is merely the consistency in and coherency of your language or thoughts. The universe is not logical, your language or thoughts concerning the universe is either logical/coherent or not. Logic has nothing to do with the universe itself.

Re: logic and knowledge

PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:38 pm
by Magnus Anderson
Would you agree that speaking, which uses objects of language such as words and sentences, is not the same as thinking, which uses objects of thinking such as facts and interpretations?

If this is so, if speaking is separate though not necessarily unrelated to thinking, meaning, it's possible to think without speaking and speak without thinking, then why, when explaining what logic is, is there so much emphasis on language?

Our contact point with reality is experience and the building block of experience is an object known as event.

Experience is an expansive sequence of events.

Intelligence operates on events. Its job is to register repeating subsequences of events -- patterns -- within the main sequence of events. Its purpose being to form a conclusion regarding some unknown event with the ultimate aim to predict some future event, to form a conclusion regarding what's going to happen in the future, in order to be able to prepare ourselves for it.

Words, sentences and other objects of language are linguistic events -- a very small subset of events -- the purpose of which is to represent other events in a format that is communicable.

So why is there so much emphasis on language?

Re: logic and knowledge

PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:37 am
by Meno_
Dan~ wrote:Can logic produce knowledge or truth, on its own, in any way?

Why does any kind of logic exist in the world, unless the world was in some way logical?



The way logic works can be demonstrated as a reductio to its origins.


If you take the expression Cogito ergo Sum , you have a triad consisting in a premise and a conclusion connected by a cnjunction 'ergo'. The' because' is an essential connective
without which the premise and the. conclusion would be
irreducible





In the triad 'esse est percipii' the set-is- a connector.. Here, est-is the essential term without which the to ideas would be disconnected.


We see an upward logic between the ergo of the first to the certainty of second, without comparing the substantialitys of neither .

Now if we go the other way, and reach the limits of logic connections, where connection are not thought about as related logically, we reach the level of identity. Words are not needed at a certain limits at that level because, identifiable concepts need not signify differences at those levels.

Not that differences of situations do not exist to initiate differentiation of concepts, but these differences are not yet ideational, they are situational.


For example, the difference between the protective hidenness of darkness offer an escape route to a running aborigines trying to escape a pursued trying to identify and capture that human being.

The choice for that being is to stand his ground in the light of day, or escape into the darkness

This is a situational choice, automatic and instinctual in earlier man. The logic of choice is hardwired, and it is determined as a foregone conclusion.

The idea develops from instinctual fear motives to a pre reflexive , to the dual choice, based on the very modern existential triad -esse est percipii. The arrival of the 'is- as the connective between being and awareness is logically turned upside down, from from a prior triad of Cogito ergo Sum.

The logical connection of -is- becomes thought and existence as made certain by logic
Here logic returns a sense of identity, the nature of reason.

The difference is that before the Cogito, consciousness of existence was not differentiated by reason.

Does that mean that prior to the Cogito reason did not exist? No, merely it had no function to connect, because.the idea had not yet differentiated its content-The self.

The logic was a simple awareness based on the fight and flight pronciple from light into the hidenness of darkness.


Logic came first in the form ofn automatic signaling of danger and the necessary action taken in consequence of that danger

The logic built into more sophisticated forms of linguistic communication came much later.

Knowledge through language as an accumulation of information as seen in terms of development of functional applications of the choices through logical channels, then the different forms of logical thinking through experience become uncovered, and discovered.

Re: logic and knowledge

PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:02 am
by D3R7
Dan~ wrote:Can logic produce knowledge or truth, on its own, in any way?

No facts, no knowledge, got nothing to induce knowledge from.