Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

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Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby barbarianhorde » Thu Mar 23, 2017 5:59 pm

Some girl I hang out with is getting out of Ketamine. Why Ketamine?

The question I mean is, why do people fuck up their brains with horse tranquilizers and date rape drugs and pharmaceuticals?

Old guys smoke herbs on the porch. I get that. But a young healthy person using drugs, what can be the advantage.

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My own drugs of choice, are running fast, eating rare meat and raw vegetables and breathing super clean air. I would like to ski. But I would like to see a ski-racer on Ketamine, because they fall down a lot.
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Peter Kropotkin » Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:32 pm

Frankly, I had to look up Ketamine to find out what it was.....
you could almost write a history of the world by
following the need for people to get high....
it is clear that humans have been doing some sort of
drugs/alcohol since the beginning of time... hell,
we even have animals do it.... Birds getting high
on berries and flying into windows is quite a common event...
We cannot take someone to task for something that has been
done for millions of years by both animals and humans.....

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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Amorphos » Thu Mar 23, 2017 10:22 pm

Cannabis is my drug of choice, for me with a visual intellect it lights up my visualizations. I get by much of the time without it, but I find my work very much enhanced after a smoke. To me it is a tool in an arsenal of many, but being without it, is simply less.

I do understand why some people take drugs which knock’s them out, they have things or situations they would rather not think about. I equally think its a bit of a waste when there are no such reasons.

Its a difficult one, I don’t think the state should meddle in my affairs, but not meddling itself will yield an affect, namely that there would be an increase if legalised. For some drugs like weed, I hardly think it matters, or at least that authorities may need to have laws in place, but the way those laws are executed is important. As with many features of law, overuse tends toward extremes and that usually manifests an equivalent sub/culture.
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby barbarianhorde » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:54 pm

Amorphos wrote:Cannabis is my drug of choice, for me with a visual intellect it lights up my visualizations. I get by much of the time without it, but I find my work very much enhanced after a smoke. To me it is a tool in an arsenal of many, but being without it, is simply less.

Oh yeah? that's cool if it helps you with work, but which work do you do? I think a surgeon shouldn't smoke the dope.

I do understand why some people take drugs which knock’s them out, they have things or situations they would rather not think about. I equally think its a bit of a waste when there are no such reasons.

Idiots who take Prozacs and Lithium and Xanax, basically.

Its a difficult one, I don’t think the state should meddle in my affairs, but not meddling itself will yield an affect, namely that there would be an increase if legalised. For some drugs like weed, I hardly think it matters, or at least that authorities may need to have laws in place, but the way those laws are executed is important. As with many features of law, overuse tends toward extremes and that usually manifests an equivalent sub/culture.

Well, who gets the money. Is it back door for the guys that strangle your daughter or taxation prone so you and I can have a better life with infrastructure?

Birds getting high
on berries and flying into windows is quite a common event...

Kropotkodile, you are no villain that for sure. My life is already better now I know this.
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby barbarianhorde » Fri Mar 24, 2017 12:16 am

So Kropotkodile Lord of Secret Nature, can you tell me true or false,
Birds simply reptilians who bypassed normal evolution by eating berries and tripping so hard that they took to flight?
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Meno_ » Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:24 am

Back in the day was told , have no need for any drug, I can manufacture it by just thinking about, like it came from outside.
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Amorphos » Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:29 am

Oh yeah? that's cool if it helps you with work, but which work do you do? I think a surgeon shouldn't smoke the dope.


Absolutely. An artist however? As I see it we are not all the same, laws however do not make such distinctions.

who gets the money.


Money goes to the top, mostly.
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Whyzed » Fri Mar 24, 2017 2:18 am

You silly boy. Can't imagine the value of experience? It's not her soul you need to worry about.

It's a horse tranquiliser - so what. Warfarin is rat poison. it's also heart medicine - it thins the blood. I mean wtf, people with heart conditions are given RAT POISON!!! horrific, isn't it? ..........no, it isn't.

LSD has no toxicity pretty much. nor magic mushrooms. nor mescaline. nor nn-dmt. research it, you'll see what I mean. according to the World health Organisation, Ketamine has a good safety profile (anaesthetists administer it to babies in far higher doses mg/kg than recreational users take it). It is on the World Health Organization's List of Essential Medicines, 'the most effective and safe medicines needed in a health system'.

Random mutation transforms a molecule in the primordial soup into a self-replicator. It enumerates. Some of the self-replicators mutate into forms more likely to survive than their predecessors, so they do. They evolve over 4 billion years to become highly sophisticated survival machines. But a machine cannot make decisions... but consciousness can. Consciousness is [u]only motivated by[u] spiritual value - satisfaction, interest, intrigue enjoyment etc. So the genetic survival machines that reward consciousness for working for the survival of the DNA and punish it for not doing survive better than the rest. Have you ever seen the matrix? If you have lost sight of spiritual interest you may be terribly lost... LSD, like all psychedelics, attaches to the 5-ht receptors in the brain. Do you know what it does? it shuts parts of the brain down. just, shuts them down. That seems to be all. These parts of the brain appear to be filters for information. Like all parts of the body they are evolved mechanism designed to perform a survival function, a part of the machine. So what happens when you turn these parts of the brain off? You encounter kingdom come. Seemingly non-biological spiritual beings many orders of magnitude more spectacular and intelligent (it seems) than man, armed with symbolic scenarios seemingly rich in cryptic meaning relating to wisdom and understanding, displaying the issues of the mind and society. Attacking your anger issues, demanding sympathetic mentality, insisting on positivety and veneration, out to impress. Joy is power, only the kind may be permitted it. All others are enemies. Ask them a question, see what happens. 'What are you?' 'YOU', they say. 'What am I?' the acting out of a great void, everything being sucked away into oblivion... 'nothing'. matter plus antimatter =s nothing. But the equation must balance, energy can neither be created nor destroyed. matter + antimatter = nothing, but nothing = (matter+antimatter). you cannot experience hot and cold at the same time in the same place, yet both can exist. The big bang gave us 45% antimatter, 55% matter. The harmonic elements returned to nothing, leaving us behind. I can talk, or be silent. I have the choice. Out of nothing something arises. Nothing is watching you.

Shamanism was far more common in the days before organised religion... christianity was superimposed on top of paganism. Shamanism is about accessing the alternative dimension where anything can happen, surviving death as a spiritual being. If I were a machine reliant upon consciousness considering survival more important than spiritual experience I wouldn't want the poor captured shizophrenic fragment of the super psyche to know the party it was missing out on... it might try and escape.

What is terribly dangerous is drug abuse. It's a technology, and like all technologies must be handled with suitable care and responsibility, else it does far more harm than good. Talk sense to your friend and express that you want her to have the most wonderful, valuable experiences, and that you hope she takes the best of care so as to gain them and not suffer. Drugs are terribly tangled up with people who have the wrong idea about them, both small minded fundamental oppositionists (the unwitting enemies of the soul, perhaps... how innocence imitates evil, forgive me for lacking the maturity to temper my frustration, it's hard to see the sacred demonised in this way. Perhaps I am less than harmonic) and destructive, ill minded abusers. Of which their are many, unfortunately. Well, we will insist that drugs are bad. People are far more dangerous than drugs... and yet we don't reject relationship. we respect it all the more instead, and handle it with care. or at least we should. Work is helping others, money bus service. it's a sacred trust. I hope you can understand
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Pandora » Sat Mar 25, 2017 4:41 am

Sounds like a powerful drug that should be administered only in hospitals or in emergency medical cases, or under medical supervision. Maybe she was opiate tolerant and opiates weren't working for her pain anymore. Recreationally, I don't think it's use is justified. I remember when I heard that medical grade fentanyl was used recreationally I was in shock. That's very powerful stuff too (a lot more powerful than morphine) and VERY addictive. I think some people may have a subconscious death wish when they use these drugs recreationally. Society seems to encourage all kinds of dependence right from the very beginning, rather than educate and encourage people on how to manage and work things out on their own. :-?
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby gib » Sat Mar 25, 2017 7:34 am

barbarianhorde wrote:Some girl I hang out with is getting out of Ketamine. Why Ketamine?

The question I mean is, why do people fuck up their brains with horse tranquilizers and date rape drugs and pharmaceuticals?

Old guys smoke herbs on the porch. I get that. But a young healthy person using drugs, what can be the advantage.

"Here take, this"

Image

My own drugs of choice, are running fast, eating rare meat and raw vegetables and breathing super clean air. I would like to ski. But I would like to see a ski-racer on Ketamine, because they fall down a lot.


The first time I tried drugs, it was out of a rebellious disregard for social norms and an eager curiosity to explore the forbidden. I thought I could try it a few times and walk away. Fuck, was I wrong.
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It is impossible for a human being to go through life not thinking irrationally even if they think of themselves as rational
Also just as irrational decisions are not always bad then rational ones are not always good no matter what the intention
- surreptitious75

The rating of rationality can be higher and always is higher than the person trying to be rational. Rationality is less emotional than the person delivering it.
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby barbarianhorde » Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:16 pm

Whyzed wrote:You silly boy. Can't imagine the value of experience? It's not her soul you need to worry about.

It's a horse tranquiliser - so what. Warfarin is rat poison. it's also heart medicine - it thins the blood. I mean wtf, people with heart conditions are given RAT POISON!!! horrific, isn't it? ..........no, it isn't.

LSD has no toxicity pretty much. nor magic mushrooms. nor mescaline. nor nn-dmt. research it, you'll see what I mean. according to the World health Organisation, Ketamine has a good safety profile (anaesthetists administer it to babies in far higher doses mg/kg than recreational users take it). It is on the World Health Organization's List of Essential Medicines, 'the most effective and safe medicines needed in a health system'.

Random mutation transforms a molecule in the primordial soup into a self-replicator. It enumerates. Some of the self-replicators mutate into forms more likely to survive than their predecessors, so they do. They evolve over 4 billion years to become highly sophisticated survival machines. But a machine cannot make decisions... but consciousness can. Consciousness is [u]only motivated by[u] spiritual value - satisfaction, interest, intrigue enjoyment etc. So the genetic survival machines that reward consciousness for working for the survival of the DNA and punish it for not doing survive better than the rest. Have you ever seen the matrix? If you have lost sight of spiritual interest you may be terribly lost... LSD, like all psychedelics, attaches to the 5-ht receptors in the brain. Do you know what it does? it shuts parts of the brain down. just, shuts them down. That seems to be all. These parts of the brain appear to be filters for information. Like all parts of the body they are evolved mechanism designed to perform a survival function, a part of the machine. So what happens when you turn these parts of the brain off? You encounter kingdom come. Seemingly non-biological spiritual beings many orders of magnitude more spectacular and intelligent (it seems) than man, armed with symbolic scenarios seemingly rich in cryptic meaning relating to wisdom and understanding, displaying the issues of the mind and society. Attacking your anger issues, demanding sympathetic mentality, insisting on positivety and veneration, out to impress. Joy is power, only the kind may be permitted it. All others are enemies. Ask them a question, see what happens. 'What are you?' 'YOU', they say. 'What am I?' the acting out of a great void, everything being sucked away into oblivion... 'nothing'. matter plus antimatter =s nothing. But the equation must balance, energy can neither be created nor destroyed. matter + antimatter = nothing, but nothing = (matter+antimatter). you cannot experience hot and cold at the same time in the same place, yet both can exist. The big bang gave us 45% antimatter, 55% matter. The harmonic elements returned to nothing, leaving us behind. I can talk, or be silent. I have the choice. Out of nothing something arises. Nothing is watching you.

Shamanism was far more common in the days before organised religion... christianity was superimposed on top of paganism. Shamanism is about accessing the alternative dimension where anything can happen, surviving death as a spiritual being. If I were a machine reliant upon consciousness considering survival more important than spiritual experience I wouldn't want the poor captured shizophrenic fragment of the super psyche to know the party it was missing out on... it might try and escape.

What is terribly dangerous is drug abuse. It's a technology, and like all technologies must be handled with suitable care and responsibility, else it does far more harm than good. Talk sense to your friend and express that you want her to have the most wonderful, valuable experiences, and that you hope she takes the best of care so as to gain them and not suffer. Drugs are terribly tangled up with people who have the wrong idea about them, both small minded fundamental oppositionists (the unwitting enemies of the soul, perhaps... how innocence imitates evil, forgive me for lacking the maturity to temper my frustration, it's hard to see the sacred demonised in this way. Perhaps I am less than harmonic) and destructive, ill minded abusers. Of which their are many, unfortunately. Well, we will insist that drugs are bad. People are far more dangerous than drugs... and yet we don't reject relationship. we respect it all the more instead, and handle it with care. or at least we should. Work is helping others, money bus service. it's a sacred trust. I hope you can understand

I am moved. Would you say drugs has personalities?
Maybe drugs are persons, or like persons, where they have a soul. And they commune with the user.

India is now giving rivers human rights. Should drugs also have human rights.
Some faces of girls turn to moon landscapes with the heavy drugs. Maybe I am superficial but I dont like.

LSD for me, I only saw some weird stuff I knew was only my brain being temporarily out of order. I saw the moon draw circles and spirals and I understand what I meant, what my brain meant, he wanted to show me all of it. But the brain normally only shows a fragment. We draw the lines between fragments and this is our hypothesis of reality.
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby gib » Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:24 pm

What drugs do is they enhance brain function or they inhibit brain function. They either increase your ability to do something, experience something, or they decrease it. On occasion, you also get the brain going into different modes of information processing or switching to different algorithms. Psychedelic drugs in particular provide you with an opportunity to see your mind from a different angle, and just getting that opportunity can open you upon to insights you would never have imagined. You get to see how much of the world is real and how much is being produced by your own perceptions and experiences.

I like to compare the experience with the scene from Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade where Jones is "taking the leap of faith" across the abyss:



The abyss is the mind and the drugs are the panning of the camera. From one angle, you don't see the bridge, from a different angle you do. <-- You discover things you didn't even know were there.
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It is impossible for a human being to go through life not thinking irrationally even if they think of themselves as rational
Also just as irrational decisions are not always bad then rational ones are not always good no matter what the intention
- surreptitious75

The rating of rationality can be higher and always is higher than the person trying to be rational. Rationality is less emotional than the person delivering it.
- encode_decode

Is that a demon slug in your stomach or are you just happy to see me?
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby barbarianhorde » Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:32 pm

gib wrote:I like to compare the experience with the scene from Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade where Jones is "taking the leap of faith" across the abyss:



The abyss is the mind and the drugs are the panning of the camera. From one angle, you don't see the bridge, from a different angle you do. <-- You discover things you didn't even know were there.


NICE!!!
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby gib » Sun Mar 26, 2017 7:36 am

barbarianhorde wrote:NICE!!!


Thank you, good sir! :D
My thoughts | My art | My music | My poetry

It is impossible for a human being to go through life not thinking irrationally even if they think of themselves as rational
Also just as irrational decisions are not always bad then rational ones are not always good no matter what the intention
- surreptitious75

The rating of rationality can be higher and always is higher than the person trying to be rational. Rationality is less emotional than the person delivering it.
- encode_decode

Is that a demon slug in your stomach or are you just happy to see me?
- Rick Sanchez
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Whyzed » Sun Mar 26, 2017 3:14 pm

Yeah that's pretty cool, I think we could all benefit from realising that there are things we can't see and from a different angle understand things we could not have imagined. humbleness and open-mindedness may allow us to 'walk across air', or fly - but l I think in reality there is no 'magic', only the logical and explainable, but reality has abilities beyond our wildest Dreams surpassing magic as we imagine it. I think we should believe nothing and be prepared to consider anything whilst making intelligenclt, rational, well informed decisions (good gambles) for the purpose of spiritual ascension - raising ones mind to a place of greater personal value.

no I do not think that drugs have personalities. I think that random mutation produces chemicals that serve a survival purpose and therefore are selected for by evolution, becoming common to a species - for example psilocybin in magic mushrooms, which is a chemical weapon against other mushrooms the psilocybe species compete with. as their are billions of different chemicals in the world it doesn't surprise me that by coincidence one could turn a part of your brain on or off. I think that the mind has many secrets and mysteries and when you use one of these keys to unlock a new door or alter brain behaviour you can encounter aspects of Your Mind, even possibly other minds within a spirit dimension, that you otherwise would not. Maybe as Birds of a Feather flock together the beings of this dimension do not wish to speak to you, maybe rather they sought to entertain you and reinforce your valuing of life such that in time you might seek to serve so that you may achieve higher planes of being that support greater spiritual value, such as more synergistic and loving societies. Maybe if you return to these places with a different mentality you will encounter such beings, or maybe with an overly active imagination you will simply trick yourself into thinking such things are possible. But with an open mind and no certainties you may be able to spare yourself your delusions and open yourself to a leap of Faith. If you get it wrong you may be the guy who jumped from a building thinking he could fly when really he could not. But if you do not learn to fly the Minotaur may catch you. And yes, we can fly... With aeroplanes :D. worship the glory of the forest that is valuable to you and make no mistakes. Our mistakes punish us, but only when we are weak enough to make them. They draw our attention to our weaknesses and give us reason and opportunity to grow. fear and negativity are enemies. Those who learn to fear fear do not fear, and those who learn the magnitude of Life respect it. Embrace your self and fly. Godspeed
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Whyzed » Sun Mar 26, 2017 4:01 pm

Why can't you go find yourself, and make me want to know you? Why can't you go find yourself, and make me want to show you?

Deep down, all we want to be is happy. We may have infinite depth. In a place below self-realisation is a self-gratifying dreamer who does not understand the effect of their behaviours - a child playing with balls, the force of chaos, the bringer of creation, and suffering.

How do we learn the ways of love?

Shine a light so bright as to destroy the night and leave man prepared to face fear and fight, will to find way and wings for flight.

Self-gratification is the only sensible purpose. Why help if not to be helped? But when joy is power, my joy is other's benefit should I choose to bring joy. Am I up tot hat task? To love others is to love self, but maturity dictates the nature of love. To spoil a child is not love. Give all awareness, but only serve when served. Friends help one another, there is no other way.

When we die the capillary network surrounding the pineal gland in the brain fails... the active transport proteins embedded into the membrane of the capillary cells cease to transport serotonin and melatonin from the cerebrospinal fluid (CSF) which bathes the pineal and the capillary network, allowing the serotonin and melatonin in the CSF to encounter enzymes embedded in the surface of the pineal gland that convert serotonin and melatonin into nn-DMT, perhaps the most powerful psychedelic drug. It induces the 'tunnel of light' and profound experiences typically including encounters with higher beings and artwork far superior to man's efforts, in the large part or maybe in entirety. Hands, feet, kidneys, heart, you name it it looks like an evolved part of the body evolved to enhance the survival of our genes. So why on earth do we have a mechanism built-in to our brains to induce a psychedelic experience at time of death? I don't know!!! Maybe spiritual values (like enjoyment and relaxation) gives spiritual strength, enabling more value to be achieved, and that is the ambition and accomplishment of the soul to a great extent beyond biologically bound consciousness - in the ether. But as far as the DNA is concerned, It recharges our minds ready for another life of serving the DNA's survival agenda. Maybe when you die DNA gives your soul back to the spirit dimension, like an angler returning a fish to the lake. Might catch him again one day. Maybe another fallen dreamer will make easy prey for the DNA. But who is to blame - the machine? Who made the machine. And this stuff is such speculation... Maybe it's all nonsense.

But we have science, technology, interest, communications. The story continues...
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby James S Saint » Sun Mar 26, 2017 9:21 pm

gib wrote:What drugs do is they enhance brain function or they inhibit brain function. They either increase your ability to do something, experience something, or they decrease it. On occasion, you also get the brain going into different modes of information processing or switching to different algorithms.

Generally they increase one function by inhibiting others. Such leads toward a permanent alteration, often leaving out the enhancement and only maintaining the disabled, making a permanent overall decrease effect as well as personality change, usually more fear based (as that is all that is left for the brain to use ==> suspicion and paranoia).
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby barbarianhorde » Tue Mar 28, 2017 4:25 am

Man Whyzed you say no personality, but I see you speak as if they do, have souls, like gods even almost like some poster before sayd, filmsnob.
He said plants they have souls and when you take em in you take in their soul and become their soul, but what is a soul but neurons and configurations, zap-patterns really.

I like that life is a chemical boost. It's going no where, to its end, make the most of it.
Take a plant in you with you in the day you are two lifeforms, enjoying the chemistry of life together. But just dont fuck up.
But the fuckest up is if you never try.

But dont try the bad shit all at once. I mean the persons I know sometimes, they go far.
One guy, he swallowed antipsychotics. he is now dead. Like it said on the brochure. Side effect: blah, blah, death. blah, further blah. Face smashed on the pavement. Very medicinal for his mom. I dont mean to be cynical. but its not really me whose being cynical. I just report the facts dont shoot.

Drugs of pharma, no thanks
Drugs from the corner, no.
Drugs from the gods,

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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Magnus Anderson » Tue Mar 28, 2017 4:33 am

Hey barbarian, I was wondering if you ever were at one of those gabber parties back in the 90s? I think you would fit there perfectly.

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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby barbarianhorde » Tue Mar 28, 2017 4:36 am

James S Saint wrote:
gib wrote:What drugs do is they enhance brain function or they inhibit brain function. They either increase your ability to do something, experience something, or they decrease it. On occasion, you also get the brain going into different modes of information processing or switching to different algorithms.

Generally they increase one function by inhibiting others. Such leads toward a permanent alteration, often leaving out the enhancement and only maintaining the disabled, making a permanent overall decrease effect as well as personality change, usually more fear based (as that is all that is left for the brain to use ==> suspicion and paranoia).

Some people are really sensitive to drugs and get paranoid this is true. I know one was 19 when he ate space, and then he nearly discovered she was another gender. It was a terrible experience and she was rattled and never recovered even though he only did it once. Sad.
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Whyzed » Thu Mar 30, 2017 12:20 am

I don't think the drugs have soul or mind, but think they reveal it. As described by Gib allowing you to see your mind from alternative angles or on new levels.

Generally they increase one function by inhibiting others. Such leads toward a permanent alteration, often leaving out the enhancement and only maintaining the disabled, making a permanent overall decrease effect as well as personality change, usually more fear based (as that is all that is left for the brain to use ==> suspicion and paranoia).


I don't know about generally, but perhaps in some or many cases. It's the age proceeding massive hysterical and uninformed drug opposition, which is still prevalent or at least lingering. And drug acceptance is commonly very poor - b-boys and gangsters, immature youths, down and out bums and undesirables, personal issues, social decay and all the rest. The main thing to know about drugs, other than they are a powerful technology for good or evil - like all technology, then - is probably that we are terribly misinformed and uneducated - disregard what you thought you knew. Most drugs, in my experience, don't induce comedowns. Most are not physically addictive. I think permanent alteration is typically only the consequence of abuse, ad even then only with some drugs. I don't think you'll succeed in permanently altering yourself physically with maximum doses of LSD daily for ten years - no physical alterations are found yet. I think the only permanent alterations with non-toxic drugs is personal/mental, and can be for the better or worse but typically for the better, at least with some - psychedelics.

I think we really need to disentangle ourselves from the ideas surrounding drugs to the large part. Gust as people are good in some ways and bad in others, so too are collectives, like professional groups or civilisations. Ideas about drugs on the societal level are comparable (or maybe even are) immature traits or mental illnesses of societies. Whichever side of them you follow (for or against), you basically get harmed.

Many plants are very dangerous - datura, belladonna, fly agaric, mandrake. Man and nature (that the two could be, or should be distinguished - art does not imitate nature, nature imitates art) both make poisons. In some regions (Australia lol, or psychiatry perhaps) we may make more toxic substances than others - but western medicine still get's the job done. I think we should think of it as a necessary evil and fall back rather than an outright winner - the thing is you evolved over millions of years that your senses might guide you, but being an ancient system your guidance system is suited to the ancient rather than the novel - so your taste buds tell you what to and what not to eat if it comes from the garden or grew wild on a bush (more than not), but don't necessarily warn you that an e-number or pesticide is toxic. We don't feel radioactivity for instance, just the physical degradation that follows major exposure.

So shrooms (psilocybes) and mescaline cactuses are super safe - if used respectfully and maturely. Fly agaric is dangerous, as is belladonna. LSD is very safe (again, with respect), whilst 25-i is plain dangerous.

But the fuckest up is if you never try.


This is what I'm saying though - it's a dangerous world, but you're fucked if you don't play the game. It's true, but what's truer is that the fuckest up thing is if you bang 5 tabs and get behind the wheel, then write an 'exciting!!!' account of your great trip/car crash on erowid (grrrr).
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby WendyDarling » Thu Mar 30, 2017 2:36 am

erowid
= weirdo. (grrrr)
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby Mr Reasonable » Thu Mar 30, 2017 4:31 am

Anyone here actually ingested any ketamine?
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby gib » Thu Mar 30, 2017 5:27 am

WendyDarling wrote:
erowid
= weirdo. (grrrr)


:lol: That actually does spell weirdo if you rearrange the words. I never noticed that. I wonder if it's on purpose.

Good eye, Wendy!

James S Saint wrote:Generally they increase one function by inhibiting others. Such leads toward a permanent alteration, often leaving out the enhancement and only maintaining the disabled, making a permanent overall decrease effect as well as personality change, usually more fear based (as that is all that is left for the brain to use ==> suspicion and paranoia).


So far in my career of drug induced intoxications, I've come up with two theories to explain paranoia:

Theory #1: direct stimulation of the fear centers. Drugs that are known to give one "bad trips" usually strike at the hypothalamus, which plays an important roll in basic emotional responses. The paranoia comes about because we cannot deal with fear that comes from an unknown source. We experience terror, but cannot name that which we are terrified by, so we fill the void with something--people are watching me, that man wants to kill me, the cops are onto me, demons lurk near to me--so as to feel that we at least can identify the source of the fear and thereby gain a better sense of control over it. Nothing is scarier than fear we don't understand. (makes you think our paranoid delusions are actually helping us).

Theory #2: alarm system in the brain--same as theory #1--fear without a source--but this time stimulated indirectly. It's a theory that says the brain has an embedded alarm system that goes off when it detects insanity. Drugs, by definition, put one into a temporary state of insanity. If too intense, this state might set off certain "alarms" in the brain that signal the presence of danger--not danger from outside, but within the body--just as the stomach gets nauseous when it detects poisons--so it triggers the fear response. How does the fear response help? It compels one to hide somewhere, to find shelter, a safe place where nothing can get you. It's more or less the equivalent of lying down to rest when you're sick. If you just find a safe place to hide--stay there and do nothing--chance are your temporary state of insanity won't get you into any really trouble.

For a while, I figured theory #2 must be correct because bad trips triggered by unnamed terror arise on all sorts of psychedelics--mushrooms, acid, pot--chances are pretty minimal, I thought, that all such drugs happen to strike at the fear centers directly--more likely they all put one into a temporary state of insanity such that the "alarm system" in the brain gets triggered. But then I had a counter thought: all these drugs--the psychedelic--stimulate similar systems in the brain. I haven't researched it enough to pin down exactly what this system in the brain is, but on all such drugs, one has very similar experience--there must be a system in the brain that coordinates emotion, musical experience, and the imagination--all these drugs seem to heighten this system--emotions are more intense, music is more intense, the imagination is more intense--and so maybe it's this brain system that, when over stimulated, triggers the fear response--not necessarily in response to an alarm (but maybe it is in response to an alarm), but directly since fear is probably one of the emotions that is heightened within this brain system.
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Re: Drugs & Weed & Ketamine

Postby WendyDarling » Thu Mar 30, 2017 7:34 am

Gibroth,

Couldn't a good trip occur when one does not realize one has lost control; it's obliviousness? During a bad trip, one realizes one has lost control and unsuccessfully struggles to regain it? This struggle trips the fear switch. It's an alarm, definitely.
I AM OFFICIALLY IN HELL!

I live my philosophy, it's personal to me and people who engage where I live establish an unspoken dynamic, a relationship of sorts, with me and my philosophy.

Cutting folks for sport is a reality for the poor in spirit. I myself only cut the poor in spirit on Tues., Thurs., and every other Sat.
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