"Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

The origins of the imperative, "know thyself", are lost in the sands of time, but the age-old examination of human consciousness continues here.

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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Arcturus Descending » Thu Apr 21, 2016 3:45 pm

Ierrellus wrote:Arc,
Speaking from personal experience I have known crack heads, alcoholics and marijuana users. The crack heads and alcoholics will kill you if given the chance. The cannabis users simply get the munchies and chill out. Since the powers that be cannot prevent anyone from using these drugs, it might be reasonable for them to legalize the least lethal.
Parameters for marijuana use can be established when the drug is legalized and age limits are set on its use. We don't need another "prohibition era" , which will criminalize those who will get the drug anyway. It is possible that prohibition of alcohol led to organized crime in America. Prohibition of marijuana may be doing the same thing.


The lesser of two evils does not really make the lesser of the two evils less harmful.
It may become the most harmful.

I'm not so sure that they are the same thing, as for your last two statements.
Give an inch they take a mile.
SAPERE AUDE!


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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby jerkey » Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:36 am

True to form, yet they perceive themselves as naive, or even victims.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:34 pm

jerkey wrote:True to form, yet they perceive themselves as naive, or even victims.

Who are "they"?
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:29 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:Arc,
Speaking from personal experience I have known crack heads, alcoholics and marijuana users. The crack heads and alcoholics will kill you if given the chance. The cannabis users simply get the munchies and chill out. Since the powers that be cannot prevent anyone from using these drugs, it might be reasonable for them to legalize the least lethal.
Parameters for marijuana use can be established when the drug is legalized and age limits are set on its use. We don't need another "prohibition era" , which will criminalize those who will get the drug anyway. It is possible that prohibition of alcohol led to organized crime in America. Prohibition of marijuana may be doing the same thing.


The lesser of two evils does not really make the lesser of the two evils less harmful.
It may become the most harmful.

I'm not so sure that they are the same thing, as for your last two statements.
Give an inch they take a mile.

I have friends who use marijuana. I cannot condemn them. I use "legal" drugs for the same reasons.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Arcturus Descending » Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:08 pm

Ierrellus wrote:
Arcturus Descending wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:Arc,
Speaking from personal experience I have known crack heads, alcoholics and marijuana users. The crack heads and alcoholics will kill you if given the chance. The cannabis users simply get the munchies and chill out. Since the powers that be cannot prevent anyone from using these drugs, it might be reasonable for them to legalize the least lethal.
Parameters for marijuana use can be established when the drug is legalized and age limits are set on its use. We don't need another "prohibition era" , which will criminalize those who will get the drug anyway. It is possible that prohibition of alcohol led to organized crime in America. Prohibition of marijuana may be doing the same thing.


The lesser of two evils does not really make the lesser of the two evils less harmful.
It may become the most harmful.

I'm not so sure that they are the same thing, as for your last two statements.
Give an inch they take a mile.

I have friends who use marijuana. I cannot condemn them. I use "legal" drugs for the same reasons.


What I am condemning is legalizing marijuana - I'm not condemning your friends, Ierrellus.
SAPERE AUDE!


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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Apr 22, 2016 3:07 pm

Oh ,but you are if you do. You would criminalize my friends for possession.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Sun Apr 24, 2016 2:00 pm

This thread is about to enter its fifth year. My heartfelt thanks to all who have contributed to it.
Maybe we can close it with good wishes to all who participated. Have a happy, healthy life.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:39 pm

On second thought, observing threads in this forum, this one may indeed still be relevant.
Is there anyone here who does not see the pharmaceutical industry as the enemy to mental health and the psychiatrists and psychologists as duping the patient? Suffering from major depression, genetically inherited, I have found some stability in meds and some positive mental influence from psychotherapists. Am I alone in finding some positive results from the current psychiatric treatment?
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby WendyDarling » Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:23 pm

Ierr,

No, you are not alone.
I AM OFFICIALLY IN HELL!


Cutting folks for sport is a reality for the poor in spirit. I myself only cut the poor in spirit on Tues., Thurs., and every other Sat.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:29 pm

Ierrellus wrote:On second thought, observing threads in this forum, this one may indeed still be relevant.
Is there anyone here who does not see the pharmaceutical industry as the enemy to mental health and the psychiatrists and psychologists as duping the patient? Suffering from major depression, genetically inherited, I have found some stability in meds and some positive mental influence from psychotherapists. Am I alone in finding some positive results from the current psychiatric treatment?


I believe the entire society is duping the patient, down from the doctors to their every day acquaintances. It's all a conspiracy, even the Doctors themselves are being duped and brainwashed.

Dogs seem happier than humans. When they see a squirrell, they chase after it. Yet Men are not allowed to chase what they desire, feminists call it "Cat Calling" and the punish anyone who dares it. Men sit in cubicles every day like caged animals. They are not even allowed to play computer games on the job. It's all a bunch of social bullshit, people's dogma, ironically preventing people from behaving as free dogs.
Dogs are happier...can this picture lie?
Image

So I present to you a song, in honor of the "WIld Dog" in us all, begging to be free of the tyranna of social dogmas. Dog-ma...being told what to do by ma's.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:32 pm

What I am condemning is legalizing marijuana - I'm not condemning your friends, Ierrellus.


You're not the boss of us Arc. You ain't nobody.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Tue Jul 19, 2016 1:47 pm

I'm just tired of hearing blame for society when society is comprised of individuals who should be responsible members of a society, should be able to repair what is wrong in society. In other words to blame society for its ills may be to blame oneself for not getting involved in society. If the DSM5 is extravagant, fix it. If big pharmacy and psychiatrists are in cahoots to sell drugs, stop them!
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 2:03 pm

Ierrellus wrote:I'm just tired of hearing blame for society when society is comprised of individuals who should be responsible members of a society, should be able to repair what is wrong in society. In other words to blame society for its ills may be to blame oneself for not getting involved in society. If the DSM5 is extravagant, fix it. If big pharmacy and psychiatrists are in cahoots to sell drugs, stop them!


Give me a squadron of a couple of multimillion dollar jets, and society will change.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Tue Jul 19, 2016 2:23 pm

That's the fairy tale of those who suffer from a victim mentality--some superhero or enough weapons will rectify all of society's ills. The individual needs not feel responsible for what is wrong or how to fix it!
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 2:27 pm

Ierrellus wrote:That's the fairy tale of those who suffer from a victim mentality--some superhero or enough weapons will rectify all of society's ills. The individual needs not feel responsible for what is wrong or how to fix it!


I'm not responsible for society, it's crazy to say that I am.

Did I declare war on Iraq? No.
Did I build the mental institutions and write the DSM 5? No.
Do I actually have any say in the DSM 5? No.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Tue Jul 19, 2016 2:41 pm

Ultimate Philosophy 1001 wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:That's the fairy tale of those who suffer from a victim mentality--some superhero or enough weapons will rectify all of society's ills. The individual needs not feel responsible for what is wrong or how to fix it!


I'm not responsible for society, it's crazy to say that I am.

Did I declare war on Iraq? No.
Did I build the mental institutions and write the DSM 5? No.
Do I actually have any say in the DSM 5? No.

So you live somehow outside of the society in which you live? You are saying that your voice for truth doesn't matter, that the steamroller that is mindless society will just overrun everyone?
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 5:14 pm

Ierrellus wrote:
Ultimate Philosophy 1001 wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:That's the fairy tale of those who suffer from a victim mentality--some superhero or enough weapons will rectify all of society's ills. The individual needs not feel responsible for what is wrong or how to fix it!


I'm not responsible for society, it's crazy to say that I am.

Did I declare war on Iraq? No.
Did I build the mental institutions and write the DSM 5? No.
Do I actually have any say in the DSM 5? No.

So you live somehow outside of the society in which you live? You are saying that your voice for truth doesn't matter, that the steamroller that is mindless society will just overrun everyone?


That's exactly how it is.

I mean, look at the elections.

Our choices on the plate:
Total fascist who wants to take away our American rights

Total warmonger and a corrupt banking felon who wants WW3.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Wed Jul 20, 2016 1:05 pm

Don't want to look at the elections. They are too divisive. I'd say the politics of politics and the politics of MI treatment are apples and oranges--both fruit, but each a separate state of affairs.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby anand_droog » Thu Jul 21, 2016 1:04 pm

Ultimate Philosophy 1001 wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I'm just tired of hearing blame for society when society is comprised of individuals who should be responsible members of a society, should be able to repair what is wrong in society. In other words to blame society for its ills may be to blame oneself for not getting involved in society. If the DSM5 is extravagant, fix it. If big pharmacy and psychiatrists are in cahoots to sell drugs, stop them!


Give me a squadron of a couple of multimillion dollar jets, and society will change.


Ierrellus, you have a point; any positive change in society can only be through a mass individual awakening, not by means of good Fuehrers and infallible bombing strategists.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pg2np37JNEg

Trixie, if you have the airport, I have the jets. Err, no, I mean, I have a better idea; give me your airport. If you have so much land, why not think about your land being the first home of the new type of non-nationalist enclaves generally emerging in lands lawfully taken in the name of the people. We shall uplift and sustain civilization (i.e., a life support system) in our rising enclaves. Coming back to the topic, we can even ensure the return of mental health by putting the brakes on nationalist govern-mental illness. All such a system needs is a new, egalitarian*, non-nationalist, economic system to be its backbone.

If you can focus your thoughts enough to understand the science of what i lay out, the basic new (old) civilizational concept is outlined here: http://www.djedefsauron.net/index.php?o ... Itemid=148

* each gets as much as he gives, not "slightly" lesser due to usury. I'll be putting out my whitepaper on this new economic system soon enough. It's based on the monetary theories and philosophy of Silvio Gesell.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby anand_droog » Thu Jul 21, 2016 2:50 pm

regarding this, i mean, the general matter of reform and the matter of bringing it about ASAP... i wrote a poem, maybe you'll like it:

/FAST://

Go to school
(take a loan)

Get a job
(as your hobbies die out)

Buy poisoned goods
(belly dance for your boss)



Buy yuppie buy
Commit suicide



Get promoted
(pull another down)

Eat some more
(as most of mankind starves)

Join the old boys' club
(lose your hair)


yuppie says Hi
I'm like goodbye




//SLOW://



when trapped in the Absurd

instead of making children suffer the same

Even giant pandas have the sense

to leave reproduction to a better day

But he marries, and soon the big bang

as if there's no better way

as if there's nothing better to do

oh, his greed and desperation!

And whatever he knows

He teaches to his children

And thus, day after day

the Yuppie cycle starts anew



//FAST://


Go to school
(take a loan)

Get a job
(watch your hobbies die out)

Buy poisoned goods
(belly dance for your boss)



Buy yuppie buy
Commit suicide




Get promoted
(pull another down)

Eat some more
(as mankind starves)

Join an old boys' club
(lose your hair)

the yuppie says Hi
I'm like goodbye



//SLOW://


How could we be like

rats chasing the pied piper

Racing against logic

in search of fools' gold



The information age

has deleted man's confusion

Late, but like fate,

It's the Dawn of the Millennials' revolution!

//
Soon to be converted into a top post-punk/heavy metal (blended, in the manner of Killing Joke) super-hit ! Ahem,.... any suggestions, or? .... shall we go ahead with... this... and the Millennials' Revolution?
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ultimate Philosophy 1001 » Thu Jul 21, 2016 4:04 pm

Trixie, if you have the airport, I have the jets.

I don't have anything but lots of furniture, electronic components, appliances and TV's. I'm a broke ass nigga.

If you have so much land, why not think about your land being the first home of the new type of non-nationalist enclaves generally emerging in lands lawfully taken in the name of the people. We shall uplift and sustain civilization (i.e., a life support system) in our rising enclaves. Coming back to the topic, we can even ensure the return of mental health by putting the brakes on nationalist govern-mental illness. All such a system needs is a new, egalitarian*, non-nationalist, economic system to be its backbone.

But that doesn't sound as exciting as tearing everything to pieces ala Raptor Call of the Shadows.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Jul 22, 2016 1:18 pm

anand_droog wrote:regarding this, i mean, the general matter of reform and the matter of bringing it about ASAP... i wrote a poem, maybe you'll like it:


Go to school
(take a loan)

Get a job
(as your hobbies die out)

stay late at "work"
(belly dance for your boss)

Buy dull boy,
Die dull boy,


Get promoted
(pulling another down)

Eat some more
(as most of mankind starves)

Join a Club
(pass wind in a golf course)

Buy dull boy,
Die dull boy,



when trapped in the Absurd

instead of making children suffer the same

Even giant pandas have the sense

to leave reproduction to a better day

But he marries, and soon the big bang

as if there's no better way

as if there's nothing better to do

oh, his greed and desperation!

And whatever he knows

He teaches to his children

And thus, day after day

the Yuppie cycle starts anew



Go to school
(take a loan)

Get a job
(watch your hobbies die out)

stay late at work
(belly dance for your boss)

Buy dull boy,
Die dull boy,


Get promoted
(by pulling another down)

Eat some more
(as mankind starves)

Join a club
(pass wind in a golf course)

We ain't cut out for that

No we ain't cut out for that!



How could we be like

rats chasing the pied piper

Racing against logic

in search of fools' gold



The information age

has deleted man's confusion

Late, but like fate,

It's the Dawn of the Millennials' revolution!

//
Soon to be converted into a top post-punk/heavy metal (blended, in the manner of Killing Joke) super-hit ! Ahem,.... any suggestions, or? .... shall we go ahead with... this... and the Millennials' Revolution?

Good poem! Hopefully, the Millennials will institute laws for use of cannabis. Lesser of two evils? More die from prescription drugs than from marijuana. I welcome the revolution.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Mon Jul 25, 2016 4:05 pm

Ultimate Philosophy 1001 wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:On second thought, observing threads in this forum, this one may indeed still be relevant.
Is there anyone here who does not see the pharmaceutical industry as the enemy to mental health and the psychiatrists and psychologists as duping the patient? Suffering from major depression, genetically inherited, I have found some stability in meds and some positive mental influence from psychotherapists. Am I alone in finding some positive results from the current psychiatric treatment?


I believe the entire society is duping the patient, down from the doctors to their every day acquaintances. It's all a conspiracy, even the Doctors themselves are being duped and brainwashed.

Dogs seem happier than humans. When they see a squirrell, they chase after it. Yet Men are not allowed to chase what they desire, feminists call it "Cat Calling" and the punish anyone who dares it. Men sit in cubicles every day like caged animals. They are not even allowed to play computer games on the job. It's all a bunch of social bullshit, people's dogma, ironically preventing people from behaving as free dogs.
Dogs are happier...can this picture lie?
Image

So I present to you a song, in honor of the "WIld Dog" in us all, begging to be free of the tyranna of social dogmas. Dog-ma...being told what to do by ma's.

So you are not a member of the society you see as ill?
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby anand_droog » Tue Jul 26, 2016 1:15 pm

Ierrellus wrote:Good poem! Hopefully, the Millennials will institute laws for use of cannabis. Lesser of two evils? More die from prescription drugs than from marijuana. I welcome the revolution.


And, of course, you are welcome into the "millennials" revolutionary cohort. For being a millennial is not about age, it is rather about a specific enlightened type of ideology: Are you with us, or with the "ancien regime", the evil socio-economic (particularly herdist*, debt-capitalist) customs (incorporated), which had lorded over all the millenniums before ours, and now imperils us too??

* a broad category, under this you have your anti-marijuana customs, propagated by those who are afraid of nature and convinced that humans should crush nature (and themselves! For are they not part of nature). Enlightenment is the key word. How, and where-from, in a world of stupidity (as Trixie might ask)?

Even 10 years back, the world looked as if it were on the surefire path towards "idiocracy", but now how suddenly it has changed, with young people murmuring against capitalism and folly in general, and, for example, rallying around an economic reformist like Bernie Sanders (even if he's out of the race... of course, the enlightened are not yet the majority, but the ranks of the enlightened have swelled and this phenomenon promises to consume the world, it is just a matter of time).
Ah, but such are the ways of destiny...
The leaders of the millennial generation, like ourselves, are not educated primarily by schools, but by the marvels of the age of information.
No surprise, then, if they see that what is today miscalled 'civilization', is actually an extreme disaster which no words or adjectives (short of an entire book) can possibly do justice to, so full of maladies, as we all know
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Re: "Mental" Illness: The Future of Treatment

Postby Ierrellus » Tue Jul 26, 2016 2:18 pm

Transition from a society based on exploitation to one based on enlightened brotherhood is never without growing pains. In the 1960's I was a conservative until the shootings of MLK, Bobby and students at Kent and Jackson State Universities. Those things woke me up from my "dogmatic slumber". Although we have made some inroads in civil rights, etc., our government remains resistant to change. Trixie may be right about the sad state of current society. But I don't see the revolutionary fervor to fix it, as was experienced in the 60s as clearly evident in century 21. Maybe I'm too local to realize what's going on 2016.
Maybe the internet will serve as an instrument of peace and justice. It will have to mature beyond its current fixation on popular t. v. sports and movie stars.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
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