Analysis of a despicable friend

The water in the river has moved on … there’s no way to locate the water that flowed by yesterday. :slight_smile:

We are both trying to let go of the river bank … let the water carry us where it wills. No way of knowing when or where we will struggle to reach the security of the river bank again. Yet again … an issue better left to our unconscious mind to manage.

B

A personal anecdote illustrating how I unwittingly allowed my unconscious mind to guide me. I sat on top of the elephant and made no attempt to influence it. :slight_smile: One of the many occasions where I attempted to “let go of the river bank”.

From my notes on my first long walk June - September 2000
[b]

I have nothing like anything like Your experience, my journeys being never longer then the 23.5 marathons with my children , about say, and I am kind of guessing here, 25 years ago.

You could say that I have had a number of mystical experiences throughout my life.

Now I will interrupt this train of thought to express a feeling/thought I have, which sounds kind borderline, because at times I can’t delineate my feelings from my thoughts or cam happen. Its like a recurrence of a much lower level of being , which has not yet reached the level of conscious existence . When o realize its happening then incam feel these very rudimentary thoughts come up, and I feel then my willpower looses its efficiency and things happen . Since I’m with You in its embryonic forms , and feel rather them know about Your resiliency, the mierpe of my mind can’t distinguish between your bordered area and mine

Just now , coming from my daughter where I usually go to babysit my latest grandson I thought about this, and came upon the idea of allusions, or literature which ties in, and then hoping it would tie into whatever that evolving channel that is slowly developing between us.

In this way the pseudo margins can remain at a middle level , where affrontery, overindulgence , or aloofness can set in.

Now go back to a very popular book even longer since its publication , a. DH Lawrence relic, of which o cam only say, the title infers a wider content them it really is. That is what struck me them and it still does. It was titles , Sons and Lovers. So much for that
And I will try to get a hold of it and pull something out of it that I think would prevent it from being a tie breaker.

We are both of is dealing with sons and fathers and that focus usually pushes our own father outside into the literally grayish background
Which brings me to painting that evolved from the gold lustered middle aged focus of equal attention to both inside and out, inferring a harmony missing today at least on casual inspection .

I did learn something new that long walks bring all kinds of real life hallucinating realities and the compression of Your very long walks will certainly could could bring these about, some of which, in Your case, shows , at least to me , that these cam come about either from the inside , or the out, depending whether your sources are of behavior or action referred or, wether your travels consist like bird like existential glimpses types by sensory thought out models .

If the latter is more prevalent than the compression leads underground and the sun conscious draws in things, spirits, demons or whatever into a typificative force that pulls in these things from the outside. in an effort to neutralize this onnwe force. You are yet beyond classification to my feeling states no clear thought has yet assembled in my mind which could attempt a unified reconstruction. of lets say You at a certain age

Here I stop because You are right about the river, I am deep underwater, can hold my breath and I do, where I can grab unto something and try to leave it , where I feel I willing drown and go ashore for a bit
There went that born again, invisualize a horse, and we are sitting or I. sitting on it and he is a friend and I feel comfortable drifting with it downstream, but wonder if it would be as helpful upstream.

I think one of us will need am accommodation, while we’re at the river’s mercy, one of is need to be swimming upstream while the other upstream so as to see the other one directly, and again referring to more unconscious material graaped by a conscious upstream effort to help the other who is merely drifting down the lazy river

Incidentally what happened to Von Rivers I wonder
Or form that matter the character from Quiet flows the Don

I will have more empty spaces to fill up therefore it is learning on me that perhaps I am the one downstream bit not sure I want to permanently assume that

Yikes … my excitement just got tempered with intimidation.

You are a walking encyclopedia and your most recent walk through some of the less illumined parts of your inner labyrinth is somewhat intimidating … for me at least.

Your comments are so rich it will take me weeks or more to grasp some of the subtleties.

First yet another anecdote that popped out in reading your post … from my third walk … the most difficult and dangerous by far … of my four walks.

From my notes Ruta de la Plata summer of 2003 … I had just completed my walk from Seville to Santiago Compostella.

[b]

[/b]

A couple of thoughts that jumped out at me:

[b]

[/b]

For me, I wwould change one word … the word “lower” to the word “higher”.

[b]

[/b]

You often refer to some written work that when I go to get some information I stumble on something that seems so relevant. In this case two things:

  1. My father … the man I never knew. A cousin posted this picture of my dad on FB a few months back. Still a teenager I presume … just before leaving to go overseas and join the war effort. I should add that my father lost his two closest brothers to the war effort … he came back alone.

When I first gazed at the picture of my dad I recognized the man I never knew … I never saw a look like the one on my father’s face in the picture. Maybe you could do me a favor and tell me about my dad … your impressions from the photo.

  1. When checking out William Goldman I found the following paragraph … written by Goldman about himself.

[b]

[/b]

The highlighted text reminds me of my reaction to the first occurrence of your word “compression” . I haven’t mentioned it yet but my thinking eventually went to “decompression chamber” . I started to think of my walks as my personal “decompression chamber” . I see Goldman refering to his writings as his personal “decompression chamber” .

Good morning Pilgrim. Just woke up from my slumber, and the first thing that struck me how very ambitious the mind is. I will spend most of the morning in the small cafe that we have our breakfast to devote more time to writing, because I have a fear of a growing suspicion that my work really I’d a lazy man’s way to swim down river. The thought of comparing Buddha and Parmenedes/Heraclitus came to me that I would like to expand upon for Heraclitus the river was a subjective deconstruction where his moorings were undetermined and relative only to his perceptions as for Buddha it was tied or moored between two sides at the same location, in effect of transporting passengers who probably traveled the river in all its length.For Buddha, it was a trancendenta experience.

But later on this

As for Your father, I will study the face and presumably Your mom who is pictured with him and attempt to describe my impressions.

But that, after breakfast.

The overabundance of symbolism has a reason: it is the nearly absolute opening of the doors of perception, as Huxley refers to it, and James Joyce is capable to pull it off.
It is reinforced by various schools of thought, but mostly by aetistox devices which unhapmered, have successfully overcome the resistance through indirect channels , since the first I believe, work had opened the way. Marcel Duchamp’s Nude descending the Stairs was such a milestone from which many others followed

This breaking up of the visual field waa actually a forerunner
and anesthesia to those very disturbed individuals who felt that to let.go of the glorious illuminated texts of prerealism, was almost a sin.

My break time as I have to scroll back and look at Your father and the lady with him, who I am presuming to be Your mother.

He appears young , very hopeful and full of life , who wouldn’t be with a gorgeous doll like the gal beside him.
Maybe its bedore he went to join the WW 1 effort, I would be intrigued to see a picture of him after he came back.Like good old Minnesota from whence Yours truly has gone west after mom got very sick of smoking herself to death gaining maybe 10 more years of like and if I get my act together where I can send picture along. Including my own dad and of course old grand dad, since this regression goes way down the line , confusedly exposing the paradoxically ambiguous dilemma , as to what block the chip is supposed be off from.

Nevertheless , that reduction is prophetically held by its own limit, At most only three generations at most…

Since one picture is worth much more than all the genealogical volumes one can keep his hand on, at the moment I’m pressed to go there verbatim, until I figure out, instead of dwelling in 2 how to get it across paralleling constantly any precept i’ve notion of it coming across /the river.

So that’s my next big project .
My friend of my opening character of whom I will hope to say more , somewhat less them volumes, I may see soon and have some talking with if I find him so inclined , but it is really difficult to talk to him nowedays.

To give You an example, I saw him a few days after that , and all I could get out of him was how thrilled he was to cut down on drink because he found a way to reach heavenly highs by building a foundation with whisky and ginger ale to good grade marijuana. Nonreal problems with the shakes and hangovers nor finding himself in unfamiliar situations morning after

From here downstream , unconventionality . Now I’m searching for the song that phrase enimates from.

Later, it may even more.

When I was young it seemed that life was so wonderful, a miracle, oh it was beautiful, magical,

And all the birds in the trees, well, they’d be singing so happily , joyfully, playfully watching me

But then they send me away to teach me how to be sensible logical , responsible, practical,

And they showed me a world where I could be so dependable , clinical, intellectual, cynical

There are times when all the world is asleep , the questions run too deep for such a simple man

Won’t you please please tell me what we’ve learned I know it sounds absurd but please tell me who I am

Now watch what you say or they’ll be calling you a radical , liberal, fanatical, criminal

Won’t you sign up your name, we’d like to feel you’re acceptable, respectable, presentable, a vegetable

At night when all the world is asleep
The questions run so deep

For such a simple man
Won’t you please please tell me what’s learned
I know it sounds absurd , but please tell me who I am.

Later .

Right or wrong … seems we are clinging to the river bank at the moment … necessary to retain sanity.

Your friend Peter … just reread your opening post … my mind wants to focus on the opening and closing words:

[b]

[/b]

[b]

[/b]

a perfect synopsis of the individual … a tribute to your depth of perception.

sad that your friend hasn’t stumbled on an appropriate “decompression chamber” … a necessary prerequisite to exploit the merit of his time spent in Hell.

PS

I’m reminded of the story of Helen Keller … her time in Hell may have been the reservoir she drew on to construct her impressive contribution to the human family.

More emerging thoughts …

Paraphrasing the question “Who am I” …

What is the contribution I’m being call on to make to the human family?

[b]

[/b]

To push that to its most extreme,

From those to whom everything is given( good and bad), everything is expected.

I’m purposefully reading into it, in light of a not yet worn out Nietzsche classics 'Beyond Good and Evil. - although I am hard pressed for total agreement with it.

A few authors come to mind Thomas Mann is on the top of my list as far a complexity and misunderstanding goes. In Jacob and His Brothers one anecdote/scene comes to mind , the first volume relates his struggle with learning 1,2,3, the mechanics of it. In Magic Mountain he notes am old countess, who, when entering the dining room, always sits facing away from others. Jerzy Kozonski says to his barber upon the later asking him why he didn’t look into the mirror to see himself, answers 'Because I know only too well, what I look like.

So much for boundaries drawn around self images. But literature abounds abounds with images of all sorts.

You know, Pilgrim, You too, have given me openings , and another idea occurred to me, in our literate conversations , we have to evaluate each other, it goes on, inn the river , weather at what times do we go on as did we don’t understand, that at times I am Your father and at other times You are mine. This is important because it has to do with a growing richness of understanding the precept as it correlates with my impression about Your son, and mine in another sense. You see , all this is really quite complex and that was one of Your initial entrances to this forum

Another thing I am working on is the object of both how our vision of our sons develop a signal where red flags come up, and where do these cause us to signal one another on a different level, lets say, 'i am not about to throw caution to the wind, in spite of declarations otherwise made. These declarations are overt , and may come later in the day we would care to admit, because the modality of such correspondence veers more to the object than the objective of it

Dostoevsky, in his underground messages made overt , consciously, delicately moored to the store’s bank, did not care about thinking of such things as the immediacy of internet communication, and that is a factor to consider.

So I part with these passing thoughts, hoping You are well, until next time

Oh, I almost forgot, I’ve been trying to get hold of my good friend Frank, bit he has made himself invisible, does not answer his phone or return calls , but he does this periodically on occasion, so no real worries here.

Delightful reading … my conscious … or unconscious mind … is shouting at me … ultreya … don’t let yourself get snagged on anythang … big or small. Clarity will reveal itself at the appointed time. I intend to reread this thread again and again.

Some thoughts triggered by your comments and some thoughts that popped into my head waiting for your post … in no particular order.

[b]

[/b]

Read these words a few minutes after reading your post … they seem to echo your thought:

Part I

[b]

[/b]

Part II

[b]

[/b]

Part III

[b]

[/b]

It’s counter intuitive that pain and suffering be the seed of goodness. Counter intuitive yet abundantly visible in our objective reality.

Ping pong diplomacy confronts gunboat diplomacy … yet again.

The efficacy of communication vehicles have always been a stumbling block in the history of human evolution … no more so … the pace of human evolution is accelerating log-arithmetically … internet being the enabler … and there’s no slowing it down.

Individuation … a complex notion … compels us to stop leaning on and stop leaning against … who is capable of such an Olympian feat?

My good friend God behaves the same way. :smiley:

At first I thought, a comma was missing between friend and God, then I realized there need not be. , there is no difference.

It’s so strangely iconic to hear these words as if my dear father , resurrected and spoke through Your mouth.

And, could be.

According to Webster, language is not really iconic, generally.
A very strangely anti positive drift down the river.

Now for now, that settled the my previous inquiry.

A yuge drift down the river. :slight_smile:

Begs the question …

[b]

[/b]

  1. The “Views” count suggests about 20 passive readers.

  2. What does “Google Bot” is online mean? An extension to our audience?

  3. Your father, my father, Your son, my son?

  4. Others?

Begs another question …

[b]

[/b]

Paraphrasing the word “iconic” … social constructs and their attendant proprieties (SCAP)

SCAP was on stage in my conscious mind a lot since your post yesterday. Seems to me SCAP has a significant influence on our thoughts and as a consequence on the words appearing on the screen.

For example the words … “my son” … infers …

  1. ownership … possession

  2. responsibility/accountability

  3. connection … bond

All of the above are consequences of SCAP … the “torrent of human custom”

Begs the question:

Have I failed SCAP? … or … has SCAP failed me?

By what standard standards it failed? Yours? Your sons? Others?

Or some kind of consensus of the above by comparing the above’s most prevelant descriptions? Most everyone gets bogged down here, because they can not get behind it., or past it. Is lime to be more specific here but boinderies are appearntly sustain some kind of blockage , here, I am sridtonf downstream and You too at this time we are seeing some out jogging branch unto which we both could grab a hold , but they may be too brittle and breakable at this point.

It’s possible there were no ‘failures’ … we make judgements based on incomplete information using SCAP as the metric.

[b]

[/b]

Yeah! … and that’s the beauty of this thread … we’re both trying hard not to get bogged down … let’s sail on by. :slight_smile:

[b]

[/b]

… or strong enough to get snagged on. :slight_smile:

Moving on …

I’m reminded of a graphic I shared a few monnths ago. The graphic was designed by a young Chinese woman who was studying visual communications at the time. She volunteered to design a graphic to be used as a logo for our new group “Grail Quest Geeks”. The group got off to a great start and just as quickly ‘died’ … seems the individuals involved were afraid to discover the ‘grail’ … ???

The graphic spoke to me today … something new … something I never saw before despite the fact that I have reflected on it … and chatted with others about it … several times.

Previous thoughts about the potential ‘message’ in the graphic:

  1. The yin yang symbol in the center represents the universe/cosmos. Concsiousness emanates from this source.

  2. The rings around the center represent varying degrees of consciousness … sentient beings close to the center, other life forms further from the center.

  3. Gib asked me several months ago about the pebbles … for me … represents consciousness of inorganic matter.

So what’s new today?

The dominant color of the graphic … black … gazing on the color today triggers the thought … we live in the shadow(s) of reality.

Perhaps recognized almost three millennia ago.

[b]

[/b]