Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Elevate form over function to get at less easily articulable truths.

Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Sat Mar 31, 2018 5:50 pm

Philosophy is really the digs unearthed by brawn and muscle
Incorporates a lot of nasty stuff underneath

Sinew and bloody entrails served one war another
that's what's left of his memory
Poor kid had to have mom and dad somewhere or brother looking for him for ever, thought missing,

Philosophy don't mind talking about you if you feel like that's true , then it becomes you so,
It don't care what you think other than making note: and philosophy does no hurt if hurt can be said a padding observance of a casual drop of some vague mistaken anecdote perhaps for others ears, deceptively and curtly, as if for your ears only, knowing the means of consequence,


What would've dear Machievelli say to those naive teary eyed who felt a sting of hatred every time some on harshly decried, a vagery, Ad Hominem, shame of our gathered who bespoke to inflame the passions of deprived and depraved .minds, whereas dear blood of our loved splashed upon those white marble temples of justice and hope,

Filling the air with the sulphur of demonic retribution as to fill a cover with its venomous mist in order to run to a supposed higher ground?

Is this the best defense against the legions of horror, of monsters of depravity?

Nay say some far away siren, a backward glanced sphinx guarding the habit of a prophetess, nay, do not fear yea children of a paradise lost in the rubble of what was once so shiny and glimmerry in the sun. Its pitty to hear things as if they truly were,

There, and see that mirage which has stood its ground,
Hold fast against that glare, tight now against the bosom of thine beloved, as if this be to the last.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:58 am

It's easier to win a battle than it is to conquer one' self.

Especially if not behind a shield but a computer.



I know Mowk at times I'm such a dork. Hope You see this probably not. But it straightens requisite levels maybe, in part.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Mowk » Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:42 am

don't you ever want to give it a rest? Is being, becoming, is. perhaps it is time to cooperate, what ever the fuck that is, is being and becoming? like anyone can know better than is.

yet cooperation is likely just as great a toll gate.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Mowk » Tue Jun 11, 2019 6:04 am

Sorry Meno, the bad advice stems more from my state of mind then recognition of any fault in yours.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:49 pm

Perhaps on the contrary , Mowk , ... ... ... ... ...

https://youtu.be/gp5JCrSXkJY
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Mowk » Thu Jun 27, 2019 4:35 am

Meno_ wrote:Perhaps on the contrary , Mowk , ... ... ... ... ...

https://youtu.be/gp5JCrSXkJY


I like folk music. Particularly fond of parsley, sage, rosemary and thyme, and a levy gone dry, but I've never driven a chevy.

Roots.

Music is an intriguing expression.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Mowk » Mon Jul 08, 2019 2:05 am

And the back story of these musicians is pretty cool too. Individually and in combination. Janis Joplin, Jimmy Hendricks, James Taylor, Jim Croce, Steven Stills, David Crosby, Niel Young, I'm all in.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:37 pm

Mowk wrote:And the back story of these musicians is pretty cool too. Individually and in combination. Janis Joplin, Jimmy Hendricks, James Taylor, Jim Croce, Steven Stills, David Crosby, Niel Young, I'm all in.



Yeah and how do You like metal? Cult?
Cult is so weird! But sweet. Grab you one in a min. Just anxious to come through.



https://youtu.be/VpRg1S9f_vs


https://youtu.be/Tfpn3wHoNGA
Last edited by Meno_ on Mon Jul 08, 2019 11:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Arcturus Descending » Mon Jul 08, 2019 5:52 pm

Hi Meno_ :evilfun:

It's easier to win a battle than it is to conquer one' self.



Conquering one's self consists of many battles being won along the way...but not necessarily winning the war.
"Look closely. The beautiful may be small."


"Two things fill the mind with ever new and increasing admiration and awe, the oftener and more steadily we reflect on them: the starry heavens above me and the moral law within me."


“Whereas the beautiful is limited, the sublime is limitless, so that the mind in the presence of the sublime, attempting to imagine what it cannot, has pain in the failure but pleasure in contemplating the immensity of the attempt.”

Immanuel Kant
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Mowk » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:46 am

slow and steady gets you along on the road, an accord.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:04 am

Mowk wrote:slow and steady gets you along on the road, an accord.




Sometimes rocky the road , rock steady , and hits with vehemence , but "when the going gets though , the tough get going." Billy Ocean
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Sun Sep 08, 2019 4:36 pm

75, Sil.et al. ; you don't wish You were in my shoes.
The thing is well, the old formula-de-differentiation, then re-partial integration, letting it fall naturally as a new given.
That can not be let go, the bind becomes the new reality:

Exuberant teleportation wrote:
"But the idea that we were seeded from some kind of quantum source in a larger ocean, like timeless genesis coming from a never ending nirvana could be quite harmonious."

in a uniform space time.

Paraphrasing this does not consist of an apology to opportune new friendships based on a changed partial reconstruction, but describes awareness of cosmic processes which hold it together iron clad, and from which absolute separation appears impossible.

This awareness drops all pretensions to otherwise explaining it: because the macro and micro economic relationships that precludes any and all interpersonal doubt.

Objectivity is beyond the nihilistic interpretation of a looking glass dasein. Cosmic intelligence overcomes any total de-difference into absurdity.

That is not easy to fathom, but those who stared unto the unfathomable abyss are forced to acknowledge it.

All nihilistic denials result in progressive projections based on diminishing actuality.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby iambiguous » Sun Sep 08, 2019 9:32 pm

Meno_ wrote:Objectivity is beyond the nihilistic interpretation of a looking glass dasein. Cosmic intelligence overcomes any total de-difference into absurdity.

That is not easy to fathom, but those who stared unto the unfathomable abyss are forced to acknowledge it.

All nihilistic denials result in progressive projections based on diminishing actuality.


I challenge you -- no, I dare you -- to bring this argument out into the world of human interactions and note how "for all practical purposes" it has profound implications in grappling to understand the "human condition".

Also, how does a grasp of this, given an in depth exploration of a particular set of real world interactions, reinforce for you the belief that philosophy is not for the feint of heart.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
And here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=194382
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Jakob » Sun Sep 08, 2019 10:31 pm

Meno_ wrote:75, Sil.et al. ; you don't wish You were in my shoes.
The thing is well, the old formula-de-differentiation, then re-partial integration, letting it fall naturally as a new given.
That can not be let go, the bind becomes the new reality:

Exuberant teleportation wrote:
"But the idea that we were seeded from some kind of quantum source in a larger ocean, like timeless genesis coming from a never ending nirvana could be quite harmonious."

in a uniform space time.

Nono, logically (locally) prior to spacetime.



Paraphrasing this does not consist of an apology to opportune new friendships based on a changed partial reconstruction, but describes awareness of cosmic processes which hold it together iron clad, and from which absolute separation appears impossible.

Enlightenments of sorts do all come with some kind of de-collapsed quantum field, its just a balancing act of the physical brain.
Anyway when all is decollapsed, there is no spacetime, there is only truth, which is potential.

all manifestation is "illusion", i.e. temporal and competing with other manifestation, and very particular, down to the atomic table. Truth is unmanifest in general and in the sublime embodiment of the manifest destiny of some cosmic pinnacle like the mind of an accomplished Pharaoh.

This awareness drops all pretensions to otherwise explaining it: because the macro and micro economic relationships that precludes any and all interpersonal doubt.

Objectivity is beyond the nihilistic interpretation of a looking glass dasein. Cosmic intelligence overcomes any total de-difference into absurdity.

well yes because Dasein is conditional to Dasein and so forth, it doesn't stand alone. Values are particular and required and thus limited and thus hubs and nexuses where the hands of order make economy out of chaos, and we get the edifice of mastery, Cosmos.

Definition of Dasein: Dasein ≠ Dasein.

That is not easy to fathom, but those who stared unto the unfathomable abyss are forced to acknowledge it.

All nihilistic denials result in progressive projections based on diminishing actuality.

Pathos of distance or golden shower.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Jakob » Sun Sep 08, 2019 10:55 pm

logically (locally) prior to spacetime.


so mass, any kind of mass, any kind of collapsed energy, implies, thus embodies, a timespan, simply because the cosmic void = the state of decollapsed brain = the absolute present.

From there on down, it all becomes slabs of time and weight.
The measure of time and weight is Relativity, and these values are both zero in the Absolute, which gives the "hidden1".




Inferred from nirvana, as being the decollapsed neuros
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:25 am

iambiguous wrote:
Meno_ wrote:Objectivity is beyond the nihilistic interpretation of a looking glass dasein. Cosmic intelligence overcomes any total de-difference into absurdity.

That is not easy to fathom, but those who stared unto the unfathomable abyss are forced to acknowledge it.

All nihilistic denials result in progressive projections based on diminishing actuality.


I challenge you -- no, I dare you -- to bring this argument out into the world of human interactions and note how "for all practical purposes" it has profound implications in grappling to understand the "human condition".

Also, how does a grasp of this, given an in depth exploration of a particular set of real world interactions, reinforce for you the belief that philosophy is not for the feint of heart.




The beginning of the word gives the idea of sub stance meaning as a positional qualifier for series of.vanishing points by which reality re-affirms it's self in a plathera of.possibilities.

The point 'being' toward it's absolute zero-sum in any particular existence.

The reality of this actualization implies or.is inferred from a state of no possible partial differentials that are constantly deprived from memory, since all potential content has meaning in particular situations.

Even if, the gaps between forgotten sets require multiple senses of symbolic form, they still can be connected and made into phenomes of.near identifiable or distinguishable particulars. These are particles which have no stasis in eternity, but are the primal elements of.absolute chaos , tirelessly and spatially recreating particularity , and sense.
The evolution of.the 'word' into any number.of.cognitive states create paradigms of.projected.insivisually identifiable sets (binomial -objective.senses a necessary process, and regression toward such absolute states is a requirement in all sensation


Now.prove it. The Darwinian evolution is a reverse image of.the devolution into a.philosophical and psychological regression of.lesser.symbolic.content, meaning approach into a state of existence where.the last.object.is one set where everything belongs into it including it's self

Objectivity is a dynamic of.intentive set of conduits ,(neural pathways) where signification approaches an ideal set of agreed upon clarity.

That such lack of meaning is utilizes as a.form of necessity, is becoming the mode of realization.

Uncertainty progressing.with increasing uncertainty is the cause of.simulated intelligence.

It travels faster then the reified linear established circuitry of.traditional behavior, therefore it is not.for the faint.of heart, who are unable or unwilling to process this , which started with Descartes-Leibnitz-Nietzche.

How real is this? As real as my corresponding with You Iambigious, in my opinion. How down to earth? Well , most humans are.unwilling to paticipate.

How does knowledge if this help? The phenomenology of this process has opted to form alliances, to stop making more then necessary paradigmns to project on basis of identifiable objective bracketed qualifiers , a good example is through the mind game of the Prisoner's Dilemma. They may not be acquainted with ' No Exit' but they do find co-operation among themselves as necessary for existential levels of relative stasis.

Unmanageable levels of projection are thereby minimized to achieve an acceptable level of objectivity among themselves
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby iambiguous » Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:40 am

Meno_ wrote:
iambiguous wrote:
Meno_ wrote:Objectivity is beyond the nihilistic interpretation of a looking glass dasein. Cosmic intelligence overcomes any total de-difference into absurdity.

That is not easy to fathom, but those who stared unto the unfathomable abyss are forced to acknowledge it.

All nihilistic denials result in progressive projections based on diminishing actuality.


I challenge you -- no, I dare you -- to bring this argument out into the world of human interactions and note how "for all practical purposes" it has profound implications in grappling to understand the "human condition".

Also, how does a grasp of this, given an in depth exploration of a particular set of real world interactions, reinforce for you the belief that philosophy is not for the feint of heart.




The beginning of the word gives the idea of sub stance meaning as a positional qualifier for series of.vanishing points by which reality re-affirms it's self in a plathera of.possibilities.

The point 'being' toward it's absolute zero-sum in any particular existence.

The reality of this actualization implies or.is inferred from a state of no possible partial differentials that are constantly deprived from memory, since all potential content has meaning in particular situations.

Even if, the gaps between forgotten sets require multiple senses of symbolic form, they still can be connected and made into phenomes of.near identifiable or distinguishable particulars. These are particles which have no stasis in eternity, but are the primal elements of.absolute chaos , tirelessly and spatially recreating particularity , and sense.
The evolution of.the 'word' into any number.of.cognitive states create paradigms of.projected.insivisually identifiable sets (binomial -objective.senses a necessary process, and regression toward such absolute states is a requirement in all sensation


Now.prove it. The Darwinian evolution is a reverse image of.the devolution into a.philosophical and psychological regression of.lesser.symbolic.content, meaning approach into a state of existence where.the last.object.is one set where everything belongs into it including it's self

Objectivity is a dynamic of.intentive set of conduits ,(neural pathways) where signification approaches an ideal set of agreed upon clarity.

That such lack of meaning is utilizes as a.form of necessity, is becoming the mode of realization.

Uncertainty progressing.with increasing uncertainty is the cause of.simulated intelligence.

It travels faster then the reified linear established circuitry of.traditional behavior, therefore it is not.for the faint.of heart, who are unable or unwilling to process this , which started with Descartes-Leibnitz-Nietzche.

How real is this? As real as my corresponding with You Iambigious, in my opinion. How down to earth? Well , most humans are.unwilling to paticipate.


I'm sorry, my friend, but you've earned it: :banana-linedance:

Straight up, though, come on, admit it. The above is just an exercise in irony aimed at exposing the intellectual gibberish that passes for "serious philosophy" among some online.

There is simply no way in hell that you can actually be serious yourself here.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
And here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=194382
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:55 am

Reductions toward absurdity are veiled as ironic. But still they operate with methodical logic .in fact its a question of degree of difference that determines intended usage. Perhaps there is a boundary between them that signifies the level of conscious versus unintended meaning between the two, the amazing thing that they both are credible states of mind.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby iambiguous » Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:01 am

Meno_ wrote:Reductions toward absurdity are veiled as ironic. But still they operate with methodical logic .


I'll take that as a maybe. :wink:
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
And here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=194382
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:21 am

iambiguous wrote:
Meno_ wrote:Reductions toward absurdity are veiled as ironic. But still they operate with methodical logic .


I'll take that as a maybe. :wink:




Lets say we're both prisoners and would like to narrow down meaning that serves our purposes. Could I say, will You settle for an intended meaning that.contains both, somewhat ironic, yet rather absurd to say? Could that lead to some discussion as to an objective and accepted mind set?
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:26 am

Let's say in reference to adding a third partner who would add more clarity.
Lets say the guy would insist on equal measures of both. Would the new idea become more typical of a sustainable position at a later time, if they were to be thus interpreted? I don't know but we may think of some such intermediate term. At this time I don't think if there is one.



How about this way.


'Situational Irony Definition If such an expected outcome fails and instead another contrary outcome occurs, the absurdity is termed situational irony. Such a form of irony is the result a discrepancy in perspective, such that what is known and expected at one moment differs with what is known later on.'

This analysis does seem to imply a hybrid.

Discrepancy of irony , in perspective, meaning from one moment to another. Now is this not what a regression is all about? Where certain jumps, leaving out noticeable connective elements present a dilemma between the criminals, and their trying to create an objective, from one moment to the next, an objective closely associated with an acceptable object to which lets say we both could relate to, a trancendentaly object from which we could jump over the disconnected gaps. If there is no effort to gloss over them , by ignoring them and setting up a continuum in spite of those missing variables, then the implication is, that we can never understand how each of us, or rather the prisoners merely presuppose and feign 'understanding' the continuous logical sequence.

Then it can be said that objectivity can not be formed, and parts of it, elements of it, are missing, but we deny the missing elements and project the emidentical or mutual and recipriticality that makes mutual understanding possible.

This is where we presume to identify on lower more general, but 'thinner' levels of symbolism.

That could as well be subliminally glossed over, by denying that missing train of thought, and inherently suggesting that the other has some of those missing elements in order and by virtue of finding them without merit, or worse, something offensive and incomplete. This incompleteness is denied from the Dasaine, and that in completeness is experienced as a negative part of the other.

So we construct defective objectivity under a transcendental umbrella, but after to disagree for the sake of a faux objectivity.

We agree that a simulation is better then nothing at all. We have to agree to do this, for we are in a changing perspective of various ' no exits' and that is something we have to endure systemically.

You may not wish to go on with such an arrangement, but then You are aware of the perilous nature of prison politics.

You're not participating is not an option in closely related institutional part I option, and can lead to further social regression that has been pointed to by Levi Strauss and some existential analysts.

The freedom to leave, combined with personal autonomy, versus the opposite, that of being constrained by the increasingly cultish restraint exercises as the symbolic relationship things out toward one dimensionality, presents at times almost magical bindings associated with a loss of autonomy and freedom to determine levels of association and if dissassociation.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:38 am

Thus loss of autonomy and freedom create quasi magical situations , appears trivialized, and almost as almost absurd.
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Re: Philosophy is not for the faint of heart

Postby Meno_ » Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:03 am

iambiguous wrote:
Meno_ wrote:Reductions toward absurdity are veiled as ironic. But still they operate with methodical logic .


I'll take that as a maybe. :wink:



Ok fair enough.
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