Having a beer with Bob

Elevate form over function to get at less easily articulable truths.

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Arminius » Tue Aug 11, 2015 7:11 pm

phoneutria wrote:I like this.

I like it too.

Orbie wrote:Me too, go on Ir! Please!

Yes, go on, please, Ierrellus!
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Wed Aug 12, 2015 1:21 pm

Pain songs "do not play on today's radio." This media is a cult of youth catering to adolescent sexual fantasies. Even in country songs singers opine about such things as dirt country roads they have never traveled. Somebody in New York City gets a song idea and sells it to Nashville. Nobody wants to hear the honesty of hurt anymore. So Bob and I are dinosaurs, respecting Hank Williams and George Jones. According to Bob, there were many "cry in your beer" songs, but George Jones sang alcoholic music.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Thu Aug 13, 2015 3:20 pm

Alcohol soothes and enhances all personal demons.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Thu Aug 13, 2015 4:18 pm

makes the demons viable
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Aug 14, 2015 12:42 pm

Orbie wrote:makes the demons viable

Demons dance to the music. Dancing, they are not so horrid.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Sun Aug 16, 2015 1:44 pm

As long as they don't try the three-step.
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
partly cloudy, with a few showers
 
Posts: 7596
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:34 pm
Location: Night of infinite faith

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Sun Aug 16, 2015 2:31 pm

Orbie wrote:As long as they don't try the three-step.

What three step? You, me and it or a waltz?
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
Ierrellus
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Posts: 12270
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Sun Aug 16, 2015 5:05 pm

it was meant allegorically, will reference it in a minute, well, maybe 5.
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
partly cloudy, with a few showers
 
Posts: 7596
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:34 pm
Location: Night of infinite faith

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Sun Aug 16, 2015 5:32 pm

I was in the middle of something, per changes in organizational models, with planning, writing and persuading dynamics per LEWIN'S THREE MODAL METHOD.

Now how this applies to the above forum with Yiur inquiery in mind, is, even if it was You, It, and Me dancing, the traditinal 3 step, unlike the waltz, may create a situation, whereby You, or i could displace It, as the lead, to establish a proper and continuous
dance, thereby relegating it, to it's proper and dimunitive place.
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
partly cloudy, with a few showers
 
Posts: 7596
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:34 pm
Location: Night of infinite faith

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Arcturus Descending » Wed Aug 19, 2015 7:07 pm

Ierrellus wrote:In hell one can still sing.


Then perhaps it is only your purgatory.
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


I learn as I write!
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:57 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:In hell one can still sing.


Then perhaps it is only your purgatory.

I could only wish it were so. It seems like hell to anyone who has lost loves or loved ones. Music lessens the torture.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Arcturus Descending » Thu Aug 20, 2015 2:10 pm

Ierrellus wrote:
Arcturus Descending wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:In hell one can still sing.


Then perhaps it is only your purgatory.

I could only wish it were so. It seems like hell to anyone who has lost loves or loved ones. Music lessens the torture.


I don't wish to quibble here but if the music lessens the torture, it may still be just purgatory. At some point we walk out of or escape purgatory. Mythologically speaking, hell is eternal.
Losing a loved one can seem like a hell for awhile, no retrieve, but at some point even that pain becomes abated. Yes, it may linger on forever and a day but it doesn't necessarily have to be "hell". But it can be a teeter-totter effect.


I also thought that you might be referring to Bob from this forum. I'm glad that you have someone in your life to share some beers and good conversation with, Ierrellus. That's important.
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


I learn as I write!
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:51 pm

The songs do not purge; they simply make thinking a bit more tolerable.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
Ierrellus
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:59 pm

Hello Irr,

I am having a cheap Lambrusco after having abstained for to days, which is a record for me. I wish i had You, insteD OF BOB, TO SHOOT THE

BREEZE WITH, opps my words went capital for some strange reason.



As far as music as an expurgative is concerned, i
have a date with Kathy , my cousin next year in
Budapest to hear the ring cycle, of Wagner, and that for me , at least causes a complete meltdown. At that point, i agree with him, that his contra Nietzche,
makes sense.


It is only my life long fascination and reverence for
Friedrich, which comes back to Charles Ives' Eternal,
and unanswered question.

Later
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
partly cloudy, with a few showers
 
Posts: 7596
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:34 pm
Location: Night of infinite faith

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Sat Aug 22, 2015 12:50 pm

Bob and I are Christians, hence not too fond of the mad anti-Christ ravings of Nietzsche. I've read several of N's works and was duly impressed by his aphorisms and lyrical style of writing. He broke with Wagner over "Parsifal", a Christian work.
I would have liked to have talked with him, maybe over a good German beer. Did he go mad, or was he just misunderstood?
Old time religion bathed in beer--that's Bob and I. We are saved from madness!
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
Ierrellus
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Posts: 12270
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2006 12:52 pm
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Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Sun Aug 23, 2015 10:16 am

It's hard to say / There is serious contention by some professionaks that N was really mad. Others think he feigned it for very severe politicaly sevre causes, that only pleading insanity could possiblyn some of the pressure.

But, in the same token, some others think Christ was mad, and both of them have been analyzed ij absentia.

Others' still, the surrealist,panter Salvadore Dali, was thought to be quite mad, until a famous psychoanalyst thought he made it uo to increase his popularuty. But then he was self admittedly mad, as he was admittedly created an art of it, in fact a method to it.

Lastly, there is an interesting side line to this madness concept, and that is the undertow of it, that to avoid it, some groups of really bad and mad people getting together to get rid of the hostility and madness, by acting it out in the gtpip channelling of this anger, and realising it's awesome energy.

One thing is certain, supressing it, does cause madness in the real sense, by the internalization of the guilt over the self-blame and destruction of the self esteem angry people feel, when they can not act it out, channell it, or some how get rid of it.

To turn the other cheek is this very madness, which only the truest of souls can bear. Crucifiction is an overcomng in the negative sense of how Nietzche thought about it, the madness is overcome both internally and externally.
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
partly cloudy, with a few showers
 
Posts: 7596
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:34 pm
Location: Night of infinite faith

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Sun Aug 23, 2015 10:17 am

The next round is one on me.
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
partly cloudy, with a few showers
 
Posts: 7596
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:34 pm
Location: Night of infinite faith

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Sun Aug 23, 2015 1:00 pm

I like Dali and Kafka. Both have shown that much of life can be surreal. I don't think either was mad in a clinical sense. Both used creativity to overcome life's irrationality. I wonder if the creativity owed to wine or beer? Or if creativity acts as a sedative?
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
Ierrellus
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Posts: 12270
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2006 12:52 pm
Location: state of evolving

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:43 pm

Both Dali and Genet were irredeemably and effectively schizophrenic prior to their attachments/accomplishments, their saving grace, coming about to rescue them..In the case of Genet, he had to be sainted by no less then Sartre, and had to have his murder sentence commuted by the French Academy to avert life in prison. How divided a soul was he? Chist's divided sould, his self crucifiction is not so obvious, but Nietzche, the ant-Christ had a lot more tools to play with, as far as presedence. Madness for Nietzche is a tretch, half mad maybe.
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
partly cloudy, with a few showers
 
Posts: 7596
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:34 pm
Location: Night of infinite faith

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Mon Aug 24, 2015 2:29 pm

Bob's and my conversations do not get deep into philosophy or literature. The beer finds us on a gut level of life with losses. Country music used to play to that; it doesn't anymore.
The old joke goes--I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy. :D
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
Ierrellus
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 12270
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2006 12:52 pm
Location: state of evolving

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Mon Aug 24, 2015 2:29 pm

duplicate
Last edited by Ierrellus on Mon Aug 24, 2015 2:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
Ierrellus
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 12270
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2006 12:52 pm
Location: state of evolving

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Wed Aug 26, 2015 2:09 pm

well sounds good, Ir, casual leit-motif, me, last night i wannabe honest, out like ligthing with moonshine, almost as devastating as white ligthning, really wanted to slap myself on the back, reeeeel hard, but my arms didn't go around my torso, couldn't reach it.
guess, condemned to a sort of kts kind of depth, into the dungeon. -but it's ok, snce it's all the same, really, they meet in the virtual world, ----which is as real as the original, hence i am assured. (the devil made me do it)
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
partly cloudy, with a few showers
 
Posts: 7596
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:34 pm
Location: Night of infinite faith

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Thu Aug 27, 2015 3:19 pm

"Malt does more than Milton can
To justify God's ways to Man." ---A.E. Housman
Steer clear of the white lightening, my friend. I say this from the few brain cells I have left.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
Ierrellus
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 12270
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2006 12:52 pm
Location: state of evolving

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Ierrellus » Thu Aug 27, 2015 3:19 pm

duplicate
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
Ierrellus
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 12270
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2006 12:52 pm
Location: state of evolving

Re: Having a beer with Bob

Postby Orbie » Thu Aug 27, 2015 5:11 pm

Ierrellus wrote:duplicate


Yeah, true as they claim, but here is one not of Housman's caliber but meaningful all the same, by Ref Leppard:

"No promises
No guarantees
When you come down here

You're already a junker
You wanna ride white lightning
You just sign your name

If You wanna dance with the devil
You gotta play his way
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
Orbie
partly cloudy, with a few showers
 
Posts: 7596
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 6:34 pm
Location: Night of infinite faith

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