Power of Nil

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Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:01 pm

An organism rejects fluctuating ordered/chaotic energies to begin the process of self-organizing, we call life.
Skin/membrane, exoskeleton the flexible 'boundary' of its continuous repulsion of undesired other.

Self-consciousness emerges as a separation of ego - lucid self - from self - unconscious, automated processes. Detachment of mind, or part of mind, from body, which is the start of nihilism.
What is nihilism?
The defensive reaction to reality, projecting into it what it denies existence to, i.e., the absolute.
Self-consciousness is the trigger, exposing the organism to how it compares with other, producing insecurity and vulnerability.
It's solution is to impose a cognitive barrier, using language, between itself and an indifferent threatening cosmos - otherness. Ideological alternate reality.
To such a mind a cosmos void of absolutes - i.e. one-god, universal morality, universal meaning, universal purpose - is a 'negative', implying its own desire to negate it using its own mental abstractions.
Nihilism implies an inversion. Noumena no longer adapt to phenomena - no longer represent them - but phenomena become noetic constructs that can be created mentally and projected into a world that lacks them.
The only way to accomplish this is through semiotics. Words/symbols, representing these absent absolutes, or these "missing" from reality concepts.
Essentially the mind 'negates' reality, by projecting into it what is lacking, and what it needs to cope with existence.

The experienced world is declared 'illusory' or 'superficial' implying a more real reality hidden in the beyond or the below - occult, accessible only to the select, initiated few. This is a reference to the organisms own psychology. This occult alternate reality only exists in the organism's mind, and may be shared, if it is promoted, as a shared alternate reality - Abrahamic religions are born.
Spirituality of the nil.
A memetic alternative reality that usurps, in theory, the physical, experienced world.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:11 pm

Nihilism develops two distinct variants, corresponding to its binary paradigm.

It's pure form, that simply negates all, without justifications or offering a alternative; its 'positive' form, which is self-contradicting, which offers its abstractions as alternate realities.
The former is more effective, the latter more seductive and so more popular.
Providing an alternate reality, entirely based on words/symbols, offers salvation from an indifferent threatening world, particularly to those born with inferior genetics.
A number increasing in human environments that have almost eliminated culling and have replaced natural selection with social selection.
All the positive nihilist must do is provide a relative self-consistent model with minimal connections to reality, to support its self-justifications; more importantly it must offer hope, in the form of power, freedom, sexual promise, hedonism, to those desperately seeking for such compensations.
Positive nihilism is at the root of current political ideology, marketing practices, psychotherapy, or anything that must manipulate and exploit weakness via the mind.
Nihilism is a political tool, and a marketing tool. It offers nullifications of reality the individual craves, ro it offers 'corrections' to reality, to what is missing ni th world, which individuals need to cope with their won existene.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby promethean75 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 5:56 pm

if 'nihilism' were an objective phenomena and accessible to scientific inquiry, you'd be able to pin it down like you want and say something intelligible about it. but because it represents something only explicable through one philosophical narrative or another, what it 'means' can be any number of things.

all one can do is find the most common features of the available narratives and use those as a very limited, very generalized description. if you wanted only to do this, instead of constructing grand narratives about it (which for the above reasons is a waste of time), you'd simply describe a nihilist as someone who doesn't believe that a vast majority of philosophical statements are true. moreover, that even considering those that are true, they still provide no definitive guidance for human action.

there are natural nihilists and then there are seasoned nihilists. the natural nihilists never had the capacity to recognize the confusion inherent to the philosophical language game and begins as a skeptic (without knowing how that skepticism is warranted). the seasoned nihilist has 'been there and done that', has intimate experience with the philosophical language game, and then finally steps back from it with a genuine understanding of why that is a reasonable thing to do.

but keep in mind that all this stuff is at the level of propositions - a nihilist is critical of the proposition to produce any certainty beyond the immediacy of experience, as well as the problem of the epiphenomenal nature of qualia (that they have no causal effect on actions) - and as such one doesn't 'act' like a nihilist. meaning, you cannot spot a nihilist and say his apparant behavior is because he believes x. therefore, a nihilist is indistinguishable from anyone else. a nihilist certainly does 'act as if there are values' and 'find things very much meaningful.' only, he doesn't bother himself with explaining of justifying any of this because to do so would involve the implication of the very thing he dismisses; the philosophical narrative.

don't mean to shut this thread down before it even gets started, but there is nothing more to it than what i've explained.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 6:46 pm

Easterners already knew that nothingness does not mean nothing.
The key word there is 'thing", as in some-thing, and no-thing, implying no thingness.
what is this 'thing"?
It is how a subjective consciousness experiences - interprets - order, by simplifying/generalizing a pattern into a abstraction - a thing.
So, no-thingness mans no patterns, no order.

This corresponds to the ancient Greek conception of chaos - ΧΑΟΣ - expanse.
If we use Heidegger's language, space impossibility and matter/energy, order, is probability.
The no-thingness is an absence of order - patterns that can be experienced as appearance.
Nothingness is not void of energy, of existence.
Existence cannot come from non-existence. But order, can emerge within chaos.
What is void is existence of order.
Nothingness implies a state of random energies - an expanse of possibilities with no probabilities, from which the probable emerges as a 'beginning" of some-thingness.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 6:56 pm

promethean75 wrote:if 'nihilism' were an objective phenomena and accessible to scientific inquiry, you'd be able to pin it down like you want and say something intelligible about it. but because it represents something only explicable through one philosophical narrative or another, what it 'means' can be any number of things.
Nihilism is a psychological reaction to reality.
there is no 'one' and no 'nil' in existence. Both are mental abstractions - ideas/ideals. Their meaning is based on the individual's relationship with existence.

I already explained all that...but you do not bother to read. Because you are a cynic using the nil to dismiss anything and everything too troubling or requiring more than a bit of effort.

all one can do is find the most common features of the available narratives and use those as a very limited, very generalized description. if you wanted only to do this, instead of constructing grand narratives about it (which for the above reasons is a waste of time), you'd simply describe a nihilist as someone who doesn't believe that a vast majority of philosophical statements are true. moreover, that even considering those that are true, they still provide no definitive guidance for human action.

there are natural nihilists and then there are seasoned nihilists. the natural nihilists never had the capacity to recognize the confusion inherent to the philosophical language game and begins as a skeptic (without knowing how that skepticism is warranted). the seasoned nihilist has 'been there and done that', has intimate experience with the philosophical language game, and then finally steps back from it with a genuine understanding of why that is a reasonable thing to do.
Skepticism is warranted in everything, because there is no absolute and so no possibility of omniscience.
But skepticism can also be sued as a psychological tool, like selectively demanding absolute evidence when this is impossible, in one context, and then showing remarkable leniency in others...like how you swallowed Will to Power, with no second thought.

promethean75 wrote:Yuo have no power to shuit anything down.
You but keep in mind that all this stuff is at the level of propositions - a nihilist is critical of the proposition to produce any certainty beyond the immediacy of experience, as well as the problem of the epiphenomenal nature of qualia (that they have no causal effect on actions) - and as such one doesn't 'act' like a nihilist. meaning, you cannot spot a nihilist and say his apparant behavior is because he believes x. therefore, a nihilist is indistinguishable from anyone else. a nihilist certainly does 'act as if there are values' and 'find things very much meaningful.' only, he doesn't bother himself with explaining of justifying any of this because to do so would involve the implication of the very thing he dismisses; the philosophical narrative.

don't mean to shut this thread down before it even gets started, but there is nothing more to it than what I've explained.
You have no power to shut anything down. you are merely a gadfly - Will to Powerlessness.
You've already made it clear that Will to Power does not apply to you, but to your god, the universe, who has the will and the power, and you are but a reflection - power through association.
Herd psychology.

Everything is a proposition.
One has to evaluate what is more and what is less probable.

Nihilism, as I said a dozen times before, is a attitude, projecting abstractions as a defence against a cosmos that does not provide to it what it expects and demands.
Your idol Nietzsche, only spoke of psychology. His only insights were psychological, nihilism is psychological, eternal return is psychological.
He had nothing new to say outside human psychology.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:43 pm

Student of S or S himself?
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:44 pm

Without the nil, there is no one.
This agrees with the cosmological model of the ancients that believed in chaos preceding existence. The age of the Titans, preceding the age o the Olympians.
A metaphorical way of saying that chaos precedes order, and order is where thingness is probable - from no-thingness, to some-thingness.
Nothingness is not ...nothing.
Nothingness is the absence of probability or order that can be interpreted as thingness - abstraction.

Without nil there is no life. Life being the negation of what is other than itself.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:45 pm

Karpel Tunnel wrote:Student of S or S himself?
Are you s...sure?
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:50 pm

Aegean wrote:
Karpel Tunnel wrote:Student of S or S himself?
Are you s...sure?
That those are the options? No. Wanna answer?
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:51 pm

Answer what question?
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:52 pm

Aegean wrote:Answer what question?

Student of S or S himself?
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:54 pm

I don't speak geek code.
I don't even know what 's' means.
A letter?
Spiderman?
Superman?
Schopenhauer?
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:55 pm

Aegean wrote:I don't speak geek code.
I don't even know what 's' means.
A letter?
Spiderman?
Superman?
Schopenhauer?
Well, that's an answer, actuallly, thanks.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:57 pm

Suffering succotash, something sure smells something stupendous.

S-aright!
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Wed Dec 11, 2019 10:32 pm

Absolute power of the nil.
If the absolute one is non-existent, then the absolute nil must be worshiped in its place.
A slight flaw only proves the absolute power of the nil.
If absolute evidence of the singularity is offered, then we must admit that the absolute nil is the fabric of reality.

example
If absolute gnosis cannot be proven - omniscience - then we are all equally ignorant.
If absolute power is not evident - omnipotence - then we are all equally powerless.

Nil creates a negative uniformity.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Thu Dec 12, 2019 1:11 am

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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Thu Dec 12, 2019 11:06 am

Aegean wrote:An organism rejects fluctuating ordered/chaotic energies to begin the process of self-organizing, we call life.
Skin/membrane, exoskeleton the flexible 'boundary' of its continuous repulsion of undesired other.

Self-consciousness emerges as a separation of ego - lucid self - from self - unconscious, automated processes. Detachment of mind, or part of mind, from body, which is the start of nihilism.
What is nihilism?
The defensive reaction to reality, projecting into it what it denies existence to, i.e., the absolute.
Gotta check in on your various 'its' in the sentence. The nihilist projects into reality the absolute that his own philosophy denies the possibility of?

IOW 'it' nr. 1 refers 'reality', 'it' nr. 2 refers to nihilism?
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Thu Dec 12, 2019 11:43 am

Karpel Tunnel wrote:
Aegean wrote:An organism rejects fluctuating ordered/chaotic energies to begin the process of self-organizing, we call life.
Skin/membrane, exoskeleton the flexible 'boundary' of its continuous repulsion of undesired other.

Self-consciousness emerges as a separation of ego - lucid self - from self - unconscious, automated processes. Detachment of mind, or part of mind, from body, which is the start of nihilism.
What is nihilism?
The defensive reaction to reality, projecting into it what it denies existence to, i.e., the absolute.
Gotta check in on your various 'its' in the sentence. The nihilist projects into reality the absolute that his own philosophy denies the possibility of?
Yes. the noetic is projected into reality to "correct" its absence.

IOW 'it' nr. 1 refers 'reality', 'it' nr. 2 refers to nihilism?
I don't know which one you label #2.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Thu Dec 12, 2019 12:06 pm

The power of nil is founded on the absence of absolutes:
absolute gnosis; absolute power, absolute oneness (singularity).

The positive psychosis takes advantage of this absence to declare its own abstractions the hidden absolute, using language to substitute for actions; using noumena in the absence of phenomenal (empirical) evidence.
The pure nihilist psychosis takes advantage of this absence to selectively deny and dismiss what si threatening to tis well-being, on the ground that it lacks absolute evidence, and to remain true to his preferred ideology, on the grounds that is is as plausible as any other, given that there is no omniscience.

To put it another way....in th absence of a one-god (anthropomorphic absolute) - omniscient omnipotent, omnipresent - the desperate mind declares himself a god, ro declares all men equally powerless and ignorant.
If not absolute one, then absolute nil.
The concept of absolute can be renamed 'universe' or 'one' (singularity), ridding itself of the infantile anthropomorphosis but retaining all other traits and implications, such as the absence of free-will to maintain "innocence" as a substitute for salvation.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Thu Dec 12, 2019 2:16 pm

Aegean wrote:Yes. the noetic is projected into reality to "correct" its absence.
by nihilists, not, say, religious people?

IOW 'it' nr. 1 refers 'reality', 'it' nr. 2 refers to nihilism?
I don't know which one you label #2.


The defensive reaction to reality, projecting into it what it denies existence to, i.e., the absolute.
The second it, the red one.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Thu Dec 12, 2019 2:47 pm

Karpel Tunnel wrote:
Aegean wrote:Yes. the noetic is projected into reality to "correct" its absence.
by nihilists, not, say, religious people?

My definition expands to include secular forms of absolutism.
I acknowledge the origins in psychology, which develops into spiritual nihilism - religions like Abrahamism's triad - and then evolves into secular forms, like post-modernism, Marxism, etc.


Karpel Tunnel wrote:
The defensive reaction to reality, projecting into it what it denies existence to, i.e., the absolute.
The second it, the red one.

I trace the origins back to emerging self-consciousness, exposing the ego - lucid part of self - to a reality that distresses it, producing existential anxiety.
It gradually becomes aware of how it compares to other, producing insecurity and vulnerability, which nihilism acts as a defence against.

What does existence deny existence to?
Absolutes, i.e., certainty, perfection, completion, wholeness, omniscience, omnipotence, or any term understood as an absolute, including 'god', 'truth', 'morality', 'self'...
Absolute = indivisible, immutable, singularity.
The mind fabricates these concepts - abstractions - and then demands them to be in existence - projecting them as already existing.
When it fails to discover them, or when faces with the possibility that they be entirely of tis own making, it calls the cosmos a 'negative'.
So, nihilism, the concept itself, is an expression of nihilism.
A cosmos void of a one-god, universal morality, universal purpose, is not a negative but a positive, because it makes life possible, and because it exists, as it is, without requiring these noetic absolutes.
The projections themselves, if taken literally, and as what they are, becomes expressions of nihilism as they would negate the cosmos as it is.

But my positions proposes a cleansing of language from these corruptive elements and the appropriate definition of words, by understanding what language is and why it evolves.
For example, the concept of 'morality' need not a one-god to have meaning, nor is it entirely subjective, but refers to a kind of behaviour we witness in many species, and not only in the homo sapient.
What is common between these species?
They all use cooperative survival and reproductive strategies, necessitating tolerance and sympathy to facilitate the process and to overcome an already present fight/flight mechanism.
Morality does not require a god, nor is it subjective, or a social construct.
We must differentiate ethics from moral behaviour, as we have between genetics and memetics.
I use ethics to make the distinction clear.
Ethics evolves as an addition to the already evolved moral behaviour, as a way to facilitate coexistence on a human scale - and not a tribal one.
But this requires unpacking.

My position claims that much of modern language use is infected by nihilistic understanding, due to the effect of Abrahamism over the past 2,000 years.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Thu Dec 12, 2019 2:54 pm

To make it more clear...I claim that because language is infected by nihilistic defensiveness, much of what passes for "philosophy" is nonsensical debates over ideologies, and psychological fabrications.
More politics and marketing, if not psychological expressions of anxiety.
We are so used to this misuse of language that we adopt obscurantism as a profound insight, because it allows us to project into the vague poetics our own psychological issues and find relief in how they are reflected back in an endless dialogue over nonsense.
Occultism was a primitive way of converting the unknown, which produced anxiety, into something intimate - by naming it. Now it has become an argument in itself.
We accept nonsense using occult insinuations because we fear that what we perceive to be true is, in fact, so.
We secretly wish to erase the obvious...and this 'secret' is what makes the occult so effective.
It seduces and exploits human frailty and need/desire.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Karpel Tunnel » Thu Dec 12, 2019 4:48 pm

Just to tie a few threads, so to speak, together......
He concludes with a defensive annihilation of all ideas as equally in error, and because there are no absolutes he easily finds a gap to exploit and to dismiss all ideas.


In the either/or dichotomy of simplistic binary logic, what even animals are capable of, the dilemmas arise, and the solutions presents themselves as emotional appeals, and moral options.

The Nihilist taking the only thing he can understand, his own absolutes, his own emotions, and simplicity as a guiding light, assumes that whenever a superior probability is presented it is an expression of an absolute certainty, or of an omniscient truth.

This is also a defensive method, dismissing all superior perspectives on the ground that they are not absolute truths, or accusing them of proposing an absolute truth which is indefensible.
Now their own simplicity can hide behind the common ground of imperfection, for that which is not perfect must be equal.
Either/Or.
With no omniscience, no God, all is relative.
Degrees vanish in relation to a fluctuating world.
All is either/or, and since what is left is nil, then some settle for nil, while the majority, of the more hypocritical kind of Nihilist, settle for emotional justifications - in the absence of absolute knowledge, the deciding factor are emotional.,
Here, because emotions are shared, common, base, all find congruence in the lowest-common-denominator or they are monsters with evil intents.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby Aegean » Thu Dec 12, 2019 5:02 pm

Nil is essential to life, because it delineates self from other. This occurs organically with the emergence of the membrane/skin/exoskeleton.
Self-Awareness begins with a simple premise: I am what I am not because consciousness is outwardly focused - it evolved to deal with world.
The negation of other is essential to preserving self.

But where it becomes psychotic is when this negation dominates reason.
Nil becomes a weapon to deny whatever threatens and chalenges the organism's well-being and it becomes a emptiness it believes it can fill with tis own abstractions - to 'correct' the absence of what it needs and desires.
Words/Symbols become representations of these esoteric constructs - see the neurotic iambiguous - which can now be sued as defences or to construct alternate realities - Paradise/Utopia.
This is why language is fundamental to nihilism. It has no external grounding so it compensates with the projections of language.
See how 'logos' was corrupted by Christians into 'god' - words are now divine, magical expressions of a godly mind - a creator.
Instead of representing reality they construct it.
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Re: Power of Nil

Postby surreptitious75 » Thu Dec 12, 2019 7:42 pm

Because words are abstractions they can describe reality as some want it to be rather than how it actually is
The interpretation of reality then becomes more important than reality itself even though we all see the world through a subjective lens
Everything we experience and everything we know is filtered through that lens so any expression of the absolute cannot really be known

The metaphysical unfalsifiable Abrahamic God is the supreme example of this for it is so perfect that it can only be a conception and not a reality
The secular version of this is the concept of Universe which does actually exist in reality but can only be experienced at a very infinitesimal level
And one other version of this is mathematical infinity which is only a concept but one that can also only be perceived at a very infinitesimal level
A MIND IS LIKE A PARACHUTE : IT DOES NOT WORK UNLESS IT IS OPEN
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