Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

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Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Brando » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:03 am

It is often stated, that Logical description in Panlogism determines natural processes. This is a way of abstraction instantiated in nature. Is it possible, that Nietzsches thought of the eternal return of the given is a consequent of this hypothesis? In so far as the same is measured through this abstraction, so Change signifies the same in a Abstract manner? So Spartacus is via abstraction the same as the Pariser Community?
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby James S Saint » Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:53 pm

Brando wrote:It is often stated, that Logical description in Panlogism determines natural processes.

I can verify that. In that regard, Hegel was right.

Brando wrote:This is a way of abstraction instantiated in nature. Is it possible, that Nietzsches thought of the eternal return of the given is a consequent of this hypothesis? In so far as the same is measured through this abstraction, so Change signifies the same in a Abstract manner? So Spartacus is via abstraction the same as the Pariser Community?

I have no idea ..
.. even of what you said. :-?
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Arminius » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:36 pm

James S Saint wrote:
Brando wrote:It is often stated, that Logical description in Panlogism determines natural processes.

I can verify that. In that regard, Hegel was right.

Yes.
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Arminius » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:56 pm

James S Saint wrote:
Brando wrote:This is a way of abstraction instantiated in nature. Is it possible, that Nietzsches thought of the eternal return of the given is a consequent of this hypothesis? In so far as the same is measured through this abstraction, so Change signifies the same in a Abstract manner? So Spartacus is via abstraction the same as the Pariser Community?

I have no idea ..
.. even of what you said. :-?

I guess he means how or why Nietzsche came to his concept of the eternal return. It was because he had read some interesting books about physics, especially about thermodynamics.

Brando, what is your first language?

Maybe I can better understand you if you say what you mean in your first language (depending on which it is).
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby James S Saint » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:07 pm

Arminius wrote:
James S Saint wrote:
Brando wrote:This is a way of abstraction instantiated in nature. Is it possible, that Nietzsches thought of the eternal return of the given is a consequent of this hypothesis? In so far as the same is measured through this abstraction, so Change signifies the same in a Abstract manner? So Spartacus is via abstraction the same as the Pariser Community?

I have no idea ..
.. even of what you said. :-?

I guess he means how or why Nietzsche came to his concept of the eternal return. It was because he had read some interesting books about physics, especially about thermodynamics.

Brando, what is your first language?

Maybe I can better understand you if you say what you mean in your first language (depending on which it is).

I'm pretty sure that would be English. The problem that I have is with his presumptuous sentence structure - too many taken-for-granted inferences, such as, "a way of abstraction instantiated in nature". I could read that in a variety of ways, but it would be nice to know which one he intended.

And when he says "determines", is he really referring to "causing" or "distinguishing"? Without that, I don't really know what "hypothesis" he intends.

And then there is, "In so far as the same is measured through this abstraction". Emmm... the "same" what? I assume by "this abstraction", he is referring to Logic or Panlogic.

Then the question: "Change signifies the same in a Abstract manner? So Spartacus is via abstraction the same as the Pariser Community?" Appears to be a complete non-sequitur to me. How did "change" get into this??
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
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Posts: 25807
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Arminius » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:58 pm

James S Saint wrote:
Brando wrote:This is a way of abstraction instantiated in nature. Is it possible, that Nietzsches thought of the eternal return of the given is a consequent of this hypothesis? In so far as the same is measured through this abstraction, so Change signifies the same in a Abstract manner? So Spartacus is via abstraction the same as the Pariser Community?

I have no idea ..
.. even of what you said. :-?
James S Saint wrote:
Arminius wrote:I guess he means how or why Nietzsche came to his concept of the eternal return. It was because he had read some interesting books about physics, especially about thermodynamics.

Brando, what is your first language?

Maybe I can better understand you if you say what you mean in your first language (depending on which it is).

I'm pretty sure that would be English. The problem that I have is with his presumptuous sentence structure - too many taken-for-granted inferences, such as, "a way of abstraction instantiated in nature". I could read that in a variety of ways, but it would be nice to know which one he intended.

Yes.

James S Saint wrote:And when he says "determines", is he really referring to "causing" or "distinguishing"? Without that, I don't really know what "hypothesis" he intends.

I guess, he means "a way of abstraction instantiated in nature". :wink:
If so, then we would have to go back to this:

James S Saint wrote:The problem that I have is with his presumptuous sentence structure - too many taken-for-granted inferences, such as, "a way of abstraction instantiated in nature". I could read that in a variety of ways, but it would be nice to know which one he intended.

:)

James S Saint wrote:And then there is, "In so far as the same is measured through this abstraction". Emmm... the "same" what? I assume by "this abstraction", he is referring to Logic or Panlogic.

Then the question: "Change signifies the same in a Abstract manner? So Spartacus is via abstraction the same as the Pariser Community?" Appears to be a complete non-sequitur to me. How did "change" get into this??

Yes, basically, I can only guess too. But look at the word "Pariser" again.
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby James S Saint » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:07 pm

Arminius wrote:
James S Saint wrote:Then the question: "Change signifies the same in a Abstract manner? So Spartacus is via abstraction the same as the Pariser Community?" Appears to be a complete non-sequitur to me. How did "change" get into this??

Yes, basically, I can only guess too. But look at the word "Pariser" again.

I assumed he meant a "Parisian community" being analogous to Sparta or perhaps Spartacus, but ... still doesn't assimilate. :-?
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
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Posts: 25807
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Arminius » Wed Sep 20, 2017 12:13 am

James S Saint wrote:
Arminius wrote:
James S Saint wrote:Then the question: "Change signifies the same in a Abstract manner? So Spartacus is via abstraction the same as the Pariser Community?" Appears to be a complete non-sequitur to me. How did "change" get into this??

Yes, basically, I can only guess too. But look at the word "Pariser" again.

I assumed he meant a "Parisian community" being analogous to Sparta or perhaps Spartacus, but ... still doesn't assimilate. :-?

He meant the Parisian community, and he meant Spartacus.

But the word "Pariser" is German.

And I do not think that he made a real typing error in that case. It was more something like a lapsus linguae.
Or the one behind "Brando" uses this username as a sock puppet and wants to set us on the wrong track. ( :angry-jumpinganger: ) :lol:

Who knows?
:chores-chopwood:
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Alf » Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:34 am

I am pretty sure that the one behind "Brando" is not the unmanly one with no real supporters and therefore dozens of ILP accounts.

He certainly has only one ILP account.

And you are certainly right, Arminius, that his first language is German.
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Brando » Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:39 am

Yes I am from Germany. The Parisian Community and Spartacus: without abstraction (uprising, another model of Society in a communist sense ...) they are different. So if the Parisian Community can be viewed as a Repetition of Spartacus it is via abstraction. Panlogism is a theory of abstraction (grounding in the concrete), so it is in favor of such identities mentioned above. So Nietzsche's concept of the eternal return of the same presuposes Panlogism?!
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Arminius » Wed Sep 20, 2017 3:36 pm

Brando wrote:Yes I am from Germany.

Willkommen.
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby James S Saint » Wed Sep 20, 2017 3:39 pm

Arminius wrote:
Brando wrote:Yes I am from Germany.

Willkommen.

"Welcome in".
:wink:
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 25807
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Alf » Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:31 pm

James S Saint wrote:
Arminius wrote:
Brando wrote:Yes I am from Germany.

Willkommen.

"Welcome in".
:wink:

Ah, yes. :idea:

Well, I come in. :wink:
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Re: Logical Panlogism and the eternal return of the same

Postby Alf » Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:34 pm

Sorry, Branko.

Willkommen!
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