Death

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Re: Death

Postby WendyDarling » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:07 pm

There are all these places people have concocted, rather than accept that the dead know nothing.

Living souls, never dying souls.

I shall return with my scriptural evidence I am certain. [-o< :evilfun:
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Re: Death

Postby zinnat » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:42 pm

pilgrim-seeker_tom wrote:Empirical evidence overwhelmingly points to "dead forever".

Okay.

Despite the overwhelming empirical evidence Phyllo's precis is surprising ... "I'll go out on a limb"

Sanjay ... seems you have exposed a frightful human emotion ... humiliation. :-)

Will you allow me a question?

What stage of body decomposition exists ... "since some weeks"?

Body Decomposition Timeline

24-72 hours after death — the internal organs decompose.

3-5 days after death — the body starts to bloat and blood-containing foam leaks from the mouth and nose.

8-10 days after death — the body turns from green to red as the blood decomposes and the organs in the abdomen accumulate gas.

Several weeks after death — nails and teeth fall out.

1 month after death — the body starts to liquify.

All that technical things are not a issue here. What if the body is kept in cold condition to avoid decomposition?


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Re: Death

Postby phyllo » Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:56 pm

All that technical things are not a issue here. What if the body is kept in cold condition to avoid decomposition?
Oh??

So now the body is flash-frozen to preserve it??? And subsequently if it is thawed out and the person resurrected? (Assuming one has the technical ability to do this.)

This seems to run up into a logical problem ... you could potentially flash-freeze a live person and then 'revive' him.

So if you flash-freeze a person at the moment of death, how do you that he is effectively dead? You lost that period of time after death which confirms that the person is really dead. Was that actually "the moment of death" or not? You don't know.
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Re: Death

Postby zinnat » Sat Sep 09, 2017 3:54 pm

phyllo wrote:
All that technical things are not a issue here. What if the body is kept in cold condition to avoid decomposition?
Oh??

So now the body is flash-frozen to preserve it???

I have not said anything like that. My answer is just to address the issue of decomposition.


And subsequently if it is thawed out and the person resurrected? (Assuming one has the technical ability to do this.)

Is it possible?

This seems to run up into a logical problem ... you could potentially flash-freeze a live person and then 'revive' him.

Again, is it possible by all scientific means and knowledge we have till date?

So if you flash-freeze a person at the moment of death, how do you that he is effectively dead?

By the established benchmarks like absence of breath, heartbeat and brain activity etc.

You lost that period of time after death which confirms that the person is really dead. Was that actually "the moment of death" or not? You don't know.

The actual moment of the death is not important. The only thing which is important is whether one becomes dead once or not.


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Re: Death

Postby zinnat » Sat Sep 09, 2017 4:04 pm

Secondly phyllo, i am not going to use any such thing/theory in my reasoning which has not be empirically proved yet. I will rely on only such things which are proven scientifically and anyone can confirm it.

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Re: Death

Postby phyllo » Sat Sep 09, 2017 4:09 pm

I'm not sure why you brought up the idea of keeping the body cold in order to avoid decomposition.

Does this discussion of death depend on preserving the body or not?
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Re: Death

Postby zinnat » Sat Sep 09, 2017 4:36 pm

phyllo wrote:I'm not sure why you brought up the idea of keeping the body cold in order to avoid decomposition.

Does this discussion of death depend on preserving the body or not?


The issue of keeping in the cold comes only because pilgrim seeker tom said that the body will start decomposing afetr three days.

As i said above, preserving the body is a not a issue here. The only issue e\relevant here is whether one is declared once dead according to our establish medical/scientific benchmarks or not.

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Re: Death

Postby pilgrim-seeker_tom » Sun Sep 10, 2017 1:42 am

All that technical things are not a issue here. What if the body is kept in cold condition to avoid decomposition?


Sanjay ... thanks for addressing my question. Body decomposition is not universal ... apparently there are numerous exceptions to the norm ... Ste Bernadette comes to mind. I observed her corpse in Nevers France ... while some cosmetic work has been acknowledge it remains a wonder/mystery.

Recovery from "Clinical Death" is not new ... though the time frame between death and recovery is always only a few minutes. Your story mentions "since several weeks" ... an example in a league of it's own.

Is There Life After Death? Study Suggests Consciousness Continues After Heartbeat Stops

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/10 ... 50582.html

While I can't say I 'know' it is possible ... I believe it is possible.
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Re: Death

Postby pilgrim-seeker_tom » Sun Sep 10, 2017 2:54 am

WendyDarling wrote:
There are all these places people have concocted, rather than accept that the dead know nothing.

Living souls, never dying souls.

I shall return with my scriptural evidence I am certain. [-o< :evilfun:


2 Kings 2:11

As they were walking along and talking together, suddenly a chariot of fire and horses of fire appeared and separated the two of them, and Elijah went up to heaven in a whirlwind. 12 Elisha saw this and cried out, “My father! My father!


The Biblical chatter about Elijah's return to life on earth are too many to mention.
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Re: Death

Postby A Shieldmaiden » Sun Sep 10, 2017 3:02 am

zinnat

Are you referring to the yogis who claim to be able to stop the heart beating? I recall something about this when I visited India.

Nevertheless, the scientific evidence is slim to none that yogis can voluntarily stop their heart.
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Re: Death

Postby zinnat » Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:10 am

A Shieldmaiden wrote:zinnat

Are you referring to the yogis who claim to be able to stop the heart beating? I recall something about this when I visited India.

Nevertheless, the scientific evidence is slim to none that yogis can voluntarily stop their heart.


No, i am not talking about yogies.

By the way, there is no such yogi who can stop breathing, lose the pulse and heartbeat even for one hour and becomes alive again. If anyone claims so, he is simply lying.

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Re: Death

Postby zinnat » Sat Sep 16, 2017 5:02 pm

I think i have waited enough for replies. I will present my argument tomorrow.

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