Amateur Nihilism

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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby WendyDarling » Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:18 pm

Iambiguous,
Let's hash this out in the rant house polemics thread that's just begun. By all means, explain your conscience there.
I AM OFFICIALLY IN HELL!

I live my philosophy, it's personal to me and people who engage where I live establish an unspoken dynamic, a relationship of sorts, with me and my philosophy.

Cutting folks for sport is a reality for the poor in spirit. I myself only cut the poor in spirit on Tues., Thurs., and every other Sat.
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby iambiguous » Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:21 pm

Urwrongx1000 wrote:Lamb, no more derailing threads with your petulant nonsense. Nobody wants to hear it. If you can't stay on the topic of this thread, which is nihilism, then you should leave. Take your attention-seeking behavior elsewhere.


Perhaps, like Satyr, you should just ignore me. :wink:
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby iambiguous » Wed Aug 16, 2017 5:14 pm

WendyDarling wrote:Iambiguous,
Let's hash this out in the rant house polemics thread that's just begun. By all means, explain your conscience there.


Actually, since this thread pertains to nihilism, and I like to call myself -- here and now -- a "moral nihilist", let's keep it here.

My aim is to probe the extent to which someone may well be but an "amateur nihilist" when their moral and political values come into conflict with others.

My "thing" here as it were.

As for the role that my conscience plays in all this, I basically explained that above.

As with everyone else, I came into this world equipped biologically/genetically with a brain able to generate and then to sustain one.

This:

...an aptitude, faculty, intuition or judgment that assists in distinguishing right from wrong.

The very dictionary definition of a "conscience".

Just like you. Just like every other poster on this thread.

But: It is this part that I would like most to explore:

...over the long course of human interaction [going all the way back to the caves], there have been any number actual, extant historical, cultural, experiential narratives regarding that which "here and now" was deemed to be right or wrong.

Now, as philosophers [ethicists] what are we to make of this?

Is the manner in which Jane or Abdul or Ivan or Fung or Kirra or Maria or Aguta exercises his or her conscience in a particular context able to be assessed as the right thing or the wrong thing to do?

Is there a manner in which one behavior or another can be said to be most in sync with nature? Or with a "moral imperative"?

With a "clear conscience"?

Again, focus the beam here on a specific behavior of yours. How is it a reflection of your conscience? What is your reaction when it comes into conflict with the behaviors of others. Whose conscience can be said to be more "reasonable" or more "virtuous"?


With or without the polemics. On this thread or in creating a new one.

Preferably in the philosophy forum. With the proviso that the polemics there is not meant to be construed as personal attacks, merely a device for debating.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby WendyDarling » Wed Aug 16, 2017 6:31 pm

If you cannot define your conscience personally, what you believe is worth protecting, then there won't be any meaning to our conversation for it won't be my conscience conflicting with your conscience in a down-to-earth scenario. In other words, if you don't take a position, you have no position.
I AM OFFICIALLY IN HELL!

I live my philosophy, it's personal to me and people who engage where I live establish an unspoken dynamic, a relationship of sorts, with me and my philosophy.

Cutting folks for sport is a reality for the poor in spirit. I myself only cut the poor in spirit on Tues., Thurs., and every other Sat.
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby iambiguous » Wed Aug 16, 2017 7:18 pm

WendyDarling wrote:If you cannot define your conscience personally, what you believe is worth protecting, then there won't be any meaning to our conversation for it won't be my conscience conflicting with your conscience in a down-to-earth scenario. In other words, if you don't take a position, you have no position.


In other words, until I grasp the precise definition/meaning of these words, there isn't a snowball's chance in hell that we will ever take the discussion out into the world of actual conflicting human behaviors.

To explore our own values and our own behaviors as they pertain existentially to these words:

...over the long course of human interaction [going all the way back to the caves], there have been any number actual, extant historical, cultural, experiential narratives regarding that which "here and now" was deemed to be right or wrong.

Now, as philosophers [ethicists] what are we to make of this?

Is the manner in which Jane or Abdul or Ivan or Fung or Kirra or Maria or Aguta exercises his or her conscience in a particular context able to be assessed as the right thing or the wrong thing to do?

Is there a manner in which one behavior or another can be said to be most in sync with nature? Or with a "moral imperative"?

With a "clear conscience"?

Again, focus the beam here on a specific behavior of yours. How is it a reflection of your conscience? What is your reaction when it comes into conflict with the behaviors of others. Whose conscience can be said to be more "reasonable" or more "virtuous"?

Looks like [as with so many objectivists over the years] we are "stuck".

You can just assume that my frame of mind is not applicable to you and that those who don't share your own are clearly not defining their words as all reasonable [and virtuous] men and women are obligated to.

Boy, does that bring back memories!! :wink:
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby WendyDarling » Wed Aug 16, 2017 7:31 pm

Well this is a literary exchange so you and I both need to understand words of importance, but that requires you to be forthright which ain't a part of your contraption. :wink:
I AM OFFICIALLY IN HELL!

I live my philosophy, it's personal to me and people who engage where I live establish an unspoken dynamic, a relationship of sorts, with me and my philosophy.

Cutting folks for sport is a reality for the poor in spirit. I myself only cut the poor in spirit on Tues., Thurs., and every other Sat.
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby iambiguous » Wed Aug 16, 2017 7:55 pm

WendyDarling wrote:Well this is a literary exchange so you and I both need to understand words of importance, but that requires you to be forthright which ain't a part of your contraption. :wink:


Note to others:

See how this works?

We can go on and on and on and on and on squabbling over the definition and the meaning that we give to the words used in our "analysis" of these relationships.

Wendy,

How about if we both agree that your own meaning is the default here.

Now, using the manner in which you understand the meaning of the words I use here...

...over the long course of human interaction [going all the way back to the caves], there have been any number actual, extant historical, cultural, experiential narratives regarding that which "here and now" was deemed to be right or wrong.

Now, as philosophers [ethicists] what are we to make of this?

Is the manner in which Jane or Abdul or Ivan or Fung or Kirra or Maria or Aguta exercises his or her conscience in a particular context able to be assessed as the right thing or the wrong thing to do?

Is there a manner in which one behavior or another can be said to be most in sync with nature? Or with a "moral imperative"?

With a "clear conscience"?

Again, focus the beam here on a specific behavior of yours. How is it a reflection of your conscience? What is your reaction when it comes into conflict with the behaviors of others. Whose conscience can be said to be more "reasonable" or more "virtuous"?


...how would you reconfigure them into a frame of mind more in sync with your own assumptions regarding what these words [in this order] would mean to a [more] rational man or woman.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby Otto_West » Wed Aug 16, 2017 11:00 pm

Iambiguous I'm all ears and waiting for a response. Don't keep me waiting.
Your entire world of fantasy and make believe is doomed, have a nice day.
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby James S Saint » Wed Aug 16, 2017 11:51 pm

iambiguous wrote:See how this works?

We can go on and on and on and on and on squabbling over the definition and the meaning that we give to the words used in our "analysis" of these relationships.

Stop being ambiguous and that won't happen.
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby iambiguous » Thu Aug 17, 2017 7:30 pm

Otto_West wrote:Iambiguous I'm all ears and waiting for a response. Don't keep me waiting.


I did respond. Just not in the manner in which one is expected to respond if they and they alone have the one and only "natural" understanding of these relationships.

Or, rather, the manner in which we define the words used to respond.

Which have always got to be in sync with one or another objectivist creed.

So, how do you define a/the rational understanding of "amateur nihilism"?

Also, what is your take on this:

...over the long course of human interaction [going all the way back to the caves], there have been any number actual, extant historical, cultural, experiential narratives regarding that which "here and now" was deemed to be right or wrong.

Now, as philosophers [ethicists] what are we to make of this?

Is the manner in which Jane or Abdul or Ivan or Fung or Kirra or Maria or Aguta exercises his or her conscience in a particular context able to be assessed as the right thing or the wrong thing to do?

Is there a manner in which one behavior or another can be said to be most in sync with nature? Or with a "moral imperative"?

With a "clear conscience"?

Again, focus the beam here on a specific behavior of yours. How is it a reflection of your conscience? What is your reaction when it comes into conflict with the behaviors of others. Whose conscience can be said to be more "reasonable" or more "virtuous"?


And don't forget, this is the philosophy forum.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
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Re: Amateur Nihilism

Postby iambiguous » Thu Aug 17, 2017 7:56 pm

James S Saint wrote:
iambiguous wrote:See how this works?

We can go on and on and on and on and on squabbling over the definition and the meaning that we give to the words used in our "analysis" of these relationships.

Stop being ambiguous and that won't happen.


Another "retort", James?

In any event, my focus is not on starting or stopping to be one thing or another, but on how [in a world sans God] we can demonstrate that who we think we are "in our head" "here and now" is that which can be communicated to others such that all reasonable men and women are obligated to share this as in fact true.

Or, to put it another way, how we become who we think we are from the cradle to the grave.

And, that, once we shift from the world of either/or [embedded in the laws of nature] to the world of human interactions entangled in conflicting moral and political narratives [the world of is/ought], our value judgments come, instead, to embody the manner in which I construe the meaning of dasein, conflicting goods and political economy.

If, in fact, that is true. After all, I have no way in which to demonstrate definitively that it is. Also, even human interactions may be entirely intertwined in a wholly determined universe.

Then I challenge objectivists of your ilk [with or without God] to explore our respective assumptions about these relationships out in the world of conflicting human behaviors.

In other words, the part that you avoid like the plaque. Over and again, my friend, I have challenged you to bring your convictions from the Society, Government and Economics forum into the Philosophy forum.

There we can explore the existential parameters of both RM/AO and the Real God.

Instead, your preference here revolves around "definitional logic". That way up in the clouds you can cling to the tautological assumptions you make about What Words Must Mean.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
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