Reality - Version 0.0

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Reality - Version 0.0

Postby encode_decode » Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:57 am

Enter at own risk to sanity. Here is something we can argue about.

:evilfun:

First there is nothing - secondly inside this nothing there is infinity - it is infinity that fills the void of nothing.

This gives us zero(nothing) and one(infinity)

Apparently infinity is 99.99% empty but still infinite.

The left over 0.00, . . . . . ,1 tells us that infinity can not know itself.

Now with infinity and zero we are able to create infinite combinations of "stuff", obviously not all at once or we would be approaching entropy. This "stuff" is in many combinations called things like selves, planets, stars etc. all of which blends back into infinity at different times and arises from infinity at different times.

Now we have Zero, One, Stuff(Duality) - as easy as 1, 2, 3

So stuff is just combinations that exist inside the infinite(one) and the infinite exists inside the nothing(zero). Higher combinations go above the Duality but are constituted of the said duality and further of the chain of existence.

Chain of existence(reality) = zero + one -> stuff contained within.

Go for it!

:D

Now for a fairy-tale ending - when infinity knows itself it is annihilated by nothing - no more stuff. To be reborn into the same configuration mentioned above. This is because of the collapse that entropy brings about fighting the ultimate order. A duality exists from the onset.
Bounded Rationality is always at work - the flow of mind is an ever changing dimension that is bound to reality, logic and emotion. Possibly and probably more. There are more versions of reality than people.
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby Dan~ » Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:24 am

I feel like I'm constrained between two simple and false ideas :

Atheism :
Creationism :

Who holds the real answers?
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby encode_decode » Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:58 am

Dan~ wrote:I feel like I'm constrained between two simple and false ideas :

Atheism :
Creationism :

Who holds the real answers?

=D>

Yes - that is how I feel - on one hand I feel like there is a creator and on the other hand I feel like there is no creator. I certainly hold no real answers. I am just torn in a reality where both sides of the argument make some sense but cannot be reconciled - or can they?

In a moment of inspiration a while back I was able to reconcile the discreet with the linear - hopefully I can do that again and present it here.

In the meantime I am torn to know where a creator fits into it all unless it is like MIB where Will Smith opens the locker to find a little world inside.

:D
Bounded Rationality is always at work - the flow of mind is an ever changing dimension that is bound to reality, logic and emotion. Possibly and probably more. There are more versions of reality than people.
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby James S Saint » Tue Apr 11, 2017 3:11 am

encode_decode wrote:First there is nothing...

What makes you think so?
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby encode_decode » Tue Apr 11, 2017 3:36 am

Just a toy. I am playing with a toy thought.
What makes you think so?

Wouldn't infinity have to be able to fill "something" and that perfect "something" be "nothing"?

Do I actually believe this? Not really. I think there is more to it than that. I am happy to be the one defending it.

I present here a simple toy that we can throw at each other or knock each other out with.
Bounded Rationality is always at work - the flow of mind is an ever changing dimension that is bound to reality, logic and emotion. Possibly and probably more. There are more versions of reality than people.
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby James S Saint » Tue Apr 11, 2017 3:57 am

encode_decode wrote:Just a toy. I am playing with a toy thought.
What makes you think so?

Wouldn't infinity have to be able to fill "something"

"Infinite" merely means "endless". There is no actual "infinity". That word is used merely as a euphemism for a misplaced idea.

encode_decode wrote:..and that perfect "something" be "nothing"?

To be "perfect" is to match 100% something or some concept. There is no "perfect", save it be only in concept.

encode_decode wrote:Do I actually believe this? Not really. I think there is more to it than that.

Good start.
encode_decode wrote:I am happy to be the one defending it.

Surely there is something better to do with youth?

encode_decode wrote:I present here a simple toy that we can throw at each other or knock each other out with.

Idle hands .. are ... 8)
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby Pandora » Tue Apr 11, 2017 7:03 am

I think maybe there is a dimension missing in our consciousness. Things just don't add up as we perceive them now. I don't mean mystical perception, maybe another evolutionary jump in awareness level. Perhaps this could be assisted with technology.
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby Amorphos » Tue Apr 11, 2017 8:46 pm

"Infinite" merely means "endless". There is no actual "infinity". That word is used merely as a euphemism for a misplaced idea.


The terms are neither here nor there, and may not be apt for something as vast as reality is. They are just words ~ which are based upon limits, but somehow we have to think of reality as one vast thing. How would you describe one vast thing that is reality? Don’t say affectance because that would be something in that something if it is anything et al. You cannot describe one big thing as a collection of little things, as that doesn’t say what those things are in and we are back to square one.

Pandora wrote:I think maybe there is a dimension missing in our consciousness. Things just don't add up as we perceive them now. I don't mean mystical perception, maybe another evolutionary jump in awareness level. Perhaps this could be assisted with technology.


Interesting, do you think that is a lack of mental prowess or a lack in philosophical definition which explains it?
I’ve been wondering about thins lately, and I think the universe suffers the same problem. It simply cannot fully draw or visualize itself. Even that the said limit is what stops it from stretching into infinity, except that it did begin at being infinite. Hmm something incongruous [or hidden even?] here me thinks.

_
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby James S Saint » Tue Apr 11, 2017 10:17 pm

Amorphos wrote:The terms are neither here nor there, and may not be apt for something as vast as reality is. They are just words ~ which are based upon limits, but somehow we have to think of reality as one vast thing. How would you describe one vast thing that is reality? Don’t say affectance because that would be something in that something if it is anything et al. You cannot describe one big thing as a collection of little things, as that doesn’t say what those things are in and we are back to square one.

I would have to disagree.
Clarify, Verify, Instill, and Reinforce the Perception of Hopes and Threats unto Anentropic Harmony :)
Else
From THIS age of sleep, Homo-sapien shall never awake.

The Wise gather together to help one another in EVERY aspect of living.

You are always more insecure than you think, just not by what you think.
The only absolute certainty is formed by the absolute lack of alternatives.
It is not merely "do what works", but "to accomplish what purpose in what time frame at what cost".
As long as the authority is secretive, the population will be subjugated.

Amid the lack of certainty, put faith in the wiser to believe.
Devil's Motto: Make it look good, safe, innocent, and wise.. until it is too late to choose otherwise.

The Real God ≡ The reason/cause for the Universe being what it is = "The situation cannot be what it is and also remain as it is".
.
James S Saint
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Posts: 24517
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby Pandora » Wed Apr 12, 2017 4:46 am

Amorphos wrote:Interesting, do you think that is a lack of mental prowess or a lack in philosophical definition which explains it?
I think it's a hardware or linguistic problem. Our language, for example, sets our limitations and it's still quite primitive. Optical illusions (or linguistic paradoxes) are an example of this - contradictions.
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby Amorphos » Wed Apr 12, 2017 5:11 pm

I think it's a hardware or linguistic problem. Our language, for example, sets our limitations and it's still quite primitive. Optical illusions (or linguistic paradoxes) are an example of this - contradictions.


What if there is nothing wrong with our hardware nor capabilities, but there is something about the limits of existence itself ~ is what I meant. …the limits as to what can be drawn or occur. I do agree though, that our language could do with some advancing or loosening up. Paradoxes happen because we get tongue tied or because reality does.
The truth is naked,
Once it is written it is lost.
Genius is the result of the entire product of man.
The cosmic insignificance of humanity, shows the cosmic insignificance of a universe without humanity.
the fully painted picture, reveals an empty canvas
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby encode_decode » Wed Apr 12, 2017 8:17 pm

James S Saint wrote:
encode_decode wrote:First there is nothing...

What makes you think so?

I guess what makes me think this is I always trace everything back to nothing as in zero - perhaps it is the mental burden of mathematics. I do not think there is a minus something first. To me nothing is infinite - nothing is the thing that comes before anything or everything. Where there is nothing there is room to place something.

I am not talking about the indivisible point but rather what we currently call space. If nothing did not come first then space must of come first - but then inside space which must be infinite would be an infinite amount of nothing because you would be able to fit an infinite amount of indivisible points. But if the substance of an indivisible point is not really there then nothing no longer exists either. Would space still exist?

Then I think to myself: Well space - there cannot be inside of space - what contains space - what is the container that holds space. But it seems there can not be outside of space either. So space is a hard problem.

This hurts my head.

You can not put something where something already exists. You can only put something where nothing exists. Space being substance-less then is nothing. Then there is the problem of the apparent medium which exist throughout the space - the propagation medium that allow radio waves to travel.

Unless we have been going about this the whole wrong way and instead we live in a big solid clump.

Maybe energy/matter are able to stretch out into a medium-less space by them-self.

Each direction I take I am met with something that does not quite add up.

:angry-banghead:

I can only surmise that there must be a counter-balance of some sort and that would be "all and nothing". If the universe does not expand then it must be strung like a hammock but in all dimensions - strung to what - you know it messes with the mind and yet still shows itself.

](*,)
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby Pandora » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:28 pm

Amorphos wrote:
What if there is nothing wrong with our hardware nor capabilities, but there is something about the limits of existence itself ~ is what I meant. …the limits as to what can be drawn or occur.

encode-decode wrote:If the universe does not expand then it must be strung like a hammock but in all dimensions - strung to what - you know it messes with the mind and yet still shows itself.
I guess this is why I'd prefer to bring it back to the mind's limits. I suppose it's possible that there are multiple dimensions which overlap, wholly or partially, as may be suggested in the multiverse theory. So you'd have many universes with different laws that may be overlapping thus perhaps causing a slight change in the physical laws and may account for the 'unexplainable factor'. Something like this, maybe it's not even bubbles of universe, maybe it's just layers of dimensions that are different but possibly interactive on some level (like the matrix in Interstellar); though I wouldn't know how we'd go from there (I don't mean to bring in the God factor or supernatural).

Image

I also think, that maybe our perception of space and direction is too small, in regard to the "whole" maybe it's the case that the "whole" loops on itself, in that you may be traveling "forward" but you'd end up traveling in a circle. A circle can be seen as a type of infinity too, right? So, maybe there is no forever forward in a traditional sense. It would be similar to our perception of earth being flat by looking out (or walking) at the horizon, except it may also be in other dimensions, not just spacial dimension. Like a giant infinity loop.
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby Amorphos » Fri Apr 14, 2017 7:15 pm

though I wouldn't know how we'd go from there (I don't mean to bring in the God factor or supernatural).


Imho you become one with the oneness [emptiness, philosophers stone, goddess crone, the eternal womb], as it is the base of all things. Being within the base is also like a doorway to anywhere, an universal centre. This is usually achieved in death and is natures way of moving stuff about, you know given death and change it kind of needs that. I do however think there must be some kind of film or layer between that and the existential plane, possibly something in quantum mechanics, and entanglement. When we have quantum computers capable of reading the maths of that, we will be able to move between worlds in the universe and planes of existence as if like taking a single step.

the last paragraph makes sense.
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Once it is written it is lost.
Genius is the result of the entire product of man.
The cosmic insignificance of humanity, shows the cosmic insignificance of a universe without humanity.
the fully painted picture, reveals an empty canvas
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Re: Reality - Version 0.0

Postby encode_decode » Tue Apr 18, 2017 1:44 am

The forum is a melting pot of ideas - the object is to walk away with a healthy outlook after considering all the thoughts that we throw at each other. Sometimes the thoughts of others strengthen our own thoughts even if not especially when we disagree.

James S Saint wrote:Surely there is something better to do with youth?

There are plenty of better things for me to do but I feel this is relative. Sometimes one has to do mundane things yet there are better things to do that have to wait. I find this sort of thing exercises the mind like a game and provides a reset of sorts.

Pandora wrote:I guess this is why I'd prefer to bring it back to the mind's limits. I suppose it's possible that there are multiple dimensions which overlap, wholly or partially, as may be suggested in the multiverse theory.

I like to increase the minds limit by not thinking a particular way and then use focus to formulate consistent thoughts. It is this imagination that has led to invention in the past. I really like your overlapping multiple dimensions and straight away folding dimensions come to mind.

Amorphos wrote:I do however think there must be some kind of film or layer between that and the existential plane, possibly something in quantum mechanics, and entanglement.

I think there are many layers; some layers are understandable and others are yet to be understandable; I think there is more to it than all of our current models put together.

encode_decode wrote:I can only surmise that there must be a counter-balance of some sort and that would be "all and nothing".

The messy middle seems to be where all the interesting things take place, even things I do not believe prove to be interesting.

Amorphos wrote:What if there is nothing wrong with our hardware nor capabilities, but there is something about the limits of existence itself ~ is what I meant. …the limits as to what can be drawn or occur. I do agree though, that our language could do with some advancing or loosening up. Paradoxes happen because we get tongue tied or because reality does.

Indeed what if there is nothing wrong with our hardware and capabilities? ; however what if there is no limit to the universe? Like the above mentioned multiverse; I will now present some glue.

Emergence from Convergence

Emergence 1. the process of becoming visible after being concealed. 2. the process of coming into existence or prominence.

Convergence a. (of a number of things) gradually change so as to become similar or develop something in common. b. come together from different directions so as eventually to meet.

So properties of thought that are now hidden from view and people are so sure are different from another persons thought but can not materialize the thought and spend time arguing on precursor thoughts eventually converge and emerge.

Pre-emergent thoughts are converging mental artifacts of the collective cognitive process. Is this not one of the reasons that we talk?
Bounded Rationality is always at work - the flow of mind is an ever changing dimension that is bound to reality, logic and emotion. Possibly and probably more. There are more versions of reality than people.
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