Reality - Version 0.0

I think it’s a hardware or linguistic problem. Our language, for example, sets our limitations and it’s still quite primitive. Optical illusions (or linguistic paradoxes) are an example of this - contradictions.

What if there is nothing wrong with our hardware nor capabilities, but there is something about the limits of existence itself ~ is what I meant. …the limits as to what can be drawn or occur. I do agree though, that our language could do with some advancing or loosening up. Paradoxes happen because we get tongue tied or because reality does.

I guess what makes me think this is I always trace everything back to nothing as in zero - perhaps it is the mental burden of mathematics. I do not think there is a minus something first. To me nothing is infinite - nothing is the thing that comes before anything or everything. Where there is nothing there is room to place something.

I am not talking about the indivisible point but rather what we currently call space. If nothing did not come first then space must of come first - but then inside space which must be infinite would be an infinite amount of nothing because you would be able to fit an infinite amount of indivisible points. But if the substance of an indivisible point is not really there then nothing no longer exists either. Would space still exist?

Then I think to myself: Well space - there cannot be inside of space - what contains space - what is the container that holds space. But it seems there can not be outside of space either. So space is a hard problem.

This hurts my head.

You can not put something where something already exists. You can only put something where nothing exists. Space being substance-less then is nothing. Then there is the problem of the apparent medium which exist throughout the space - the propagation medium that allow radio waves to travel.

Unless we have been going about this the whole wrong way and instead we live in a big solid clump.

Maybe energy/matter are able to stretch out into a medium-less space by them-self.

Each direction I take I am met with something that does not quite add up.

:angry-banghead:

I can only surmise that there must be a counter-balance of some sort and that would be “all and nothing”. If the universe does not expand then it must be strung like a hammock but in all dimensions - strung to what - you know it messes with the mind and yet still shows itself.

](*,)

I guess this is why I’d prefer to bring it back to the mind’s limits. I suppose it’s possible that there are multiple dimensions which overlap, wholly or partially, as may be suggested in the multiverse theory. So you’d have many universes with different laws that may be overlapping thus perhaps causing a slight change in the physical laws and may account for the ‘unexplainable factor’. Something like this, maybe it’s not even bubbles of universe, maybe it’s just layers of dimensions that are different but possibly interactive on some level (like the matrix in Interstellar); though I wouldn’t know how we’d go from there (I don’t mean to bring in the God factor or supernatural).

I also think, that maybe our perception of space and direction is too small, in regard to the “whole” maybe it’s the case that the “whole” loops on itself, in that you may be traveling “forward” but you’d end up traveling in a circle. A circle can be seen as a type of infinity too, right? So, maybe there is no forever forward in a traditional sense. It would be similar to our perception of earth being flat by looking out (or walking) at the horizon, except it may also be in other dimensions, not just spacial dimension. Like a giant infinity loop.

Imho you become one with the oneness [emptiness, philosophers stone, goddess crone, the eternal womb], as it is the base of all things. Being within the base is also like a doorway to anywhere, an universal centre. This is usually achieved in death and is natures way of moving stuff about, you know given death and change it kind of needs that. I do however think there must be some kind of film or layer between that and the existential plane, possibly something in quantum mechanics, and entanglement. When we have quantum computers capable of reading the maths of that, we will be able to move between worlds in the universe and planes of existence as if like taking a single step.

the last paragraph makes sense.

The forum is a melting pot of ideas - the object is to walk away with a healthy outlook after considering all the thoughts that we throw at each other. Sometimes the thoughts of others strengthen our own thoughts even if not especially when we disagree.

There are plenty of better things for me to do but I feel this is relative. Sometimes one has to do mundane things yet there are better things to do that have to wait. I find this sort of thing exercises the mind like a game and provides a reset of sorts.

I like to increase the minds limit by not thinking a particular way and then use focus to formulate consistent thoughts. It is this imagination that has led to invention in the past. I really like your overlapping multiple dimensions and straight away folding dimensions come to mind.

I think there are many layers; some layers are understandable and others are yet to be understandable; I think there is more to it than all of our current models put together.

The messy middle seems to be where all the interesting things take place, even things I do not believe prove to be interesting.

Indeed what if there is nothing wrong with our hardware and capabilities? ; however what if there is no limit to the universe? Like the above mentioned multiverse; I will now present some glue.

Emergence from Convergence

Emergence 1. the process of becoming visible after being concealed. 2. the process of coming into existence or prominence.

Convergence a. (of a number of things) gradually change so as to become similar or develop something in common. b. come together from different directions so as eventually to meet.

So properties of thought that are now hidden from view and people are so sure are different from another persons thought but can not materialize the thought and spend time arguing on precursor thoughts eventually converge and emerge.

Pre-emergent thoughts are converging mental artifacts of the collective cognitive process. Is this not one of the reasons that we talk?

encode_decode

How do you define creator? What words come to you? Does the “God” word come to you?

Could that word possibly get in the way?

This reminds me of one of my favorite quotes ~~ by Rumi ~~

“Be patient toward all that is unsolved in your heart and try to love the questions themselves, like locked rooms and like books that are now written in a very foreign tongue. Do not now seek the answers, which cannot be given you because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answer.”

I find it doubtful that we will at some point “live along some distant day into the answer” not with our puny brains.
But if we try to force the answers, if we are torn between two answers, maybe we will miss something that might have otherwise come to us. Who knows.

What boggles my mind is the origin of the origin. So fascinating yet so unanswerable, right?

Hello Arcturus Descending,

I hope you are well - I enjoy our little chats.

You ask tough questions.

I am not sure I can define creator in this context.

Creator it the first word that comes to me. Lol. Universe is another one.

Yes the word God does come to me. Whether to believe would partially depend on the context.

Yes, possibly.

I love the quote that you presented and I love the questions themselves.

I think I understand what you are saying - it seems so fascinating - but I do not know if it is unanswerable so I don’t want to lead you up the garden path by answering a question that I cannot answer with conviction - I think that would be unkind to you and I don’t want to be unkind to you because my few interactions that I have experienced with you tell me that you are a likeable person.

I do however like the way your mind works - it seems to me that you really know how to live life in an enjoyable way - I like joy. I am tempted to nickname you “Joy” but I wont because your handle “Arcturus Descending” is a pleasant pair of words to read - is the Arcturus part of your username referring to a star?

:smiley:

encode_decode

Hello, encode_decode. I hope that you too are well. I also enjoy our little chats. Perhaps next time I will bring marshmallows and you can build a fire. Do you know how to rub two sticks together to start a fire?
Bring matches, just in case.
Do you want to know something? I thought of an android when I read your first lines…just the way you presented the words. I have kind of a weird mind. Do androids enjoy things? Did Data enjoy things? :evilfun:

I only wish that I was capable of asking tough questions. That would make me a good philosopher, no?
I only said the above because so many use the word God in this sense. Isn’t “God” too simplistic? But I suppose it works. Everything needs a label, right?

It isn’t so clear to me how you are using the word “believe” here. Are you saying that your belief in a God is dependent on the below? Perhaps not ~~ but perhaps so. But all of the below can lead to a clearer estimation of what God may be but without absolute proof…if any of that made sense.

con·text
ˈkäntekst/Submit
noun
the circumstances that form the setting for an event, statement, or idea, and in terms of which it can be fully understood and assessed.
“the decision was taken within the context of planned cuts in spending”
synonyms: circumstances, conditions, factors, state of affairs, situation, background, scene, setting More
the parts of something written or spoken that immediately precede and follow a word or passage and clarify its meaning.
“word processing is affected by the context in which words appear”

It may get in the way, for me, because sometimes that’s where it all ends.

Me too.

What being “unanswerable”? The existence of God or of a God which includes every definition that we can give it?
Are you saying that there is a satisfactory answer for the existence of God? One that would give rise to absolute truth and knowledge of this concept which we call a God?
I enjoy garden paths so do not worry about that. I love flowers. :evilfun:

What is the question again?

Why would it be unkind? I’m agnostic. I’ve already gone through the fire and the purging of doubting and struggling and giving up the concept of a personal God or a God which we make in our own image and likeness.
I kind of enjoy the great mystery of it all and it brings that deep black well closer to me in a sense then I have ever experienced.
Rumi is so so cool!

What boggles my mind is how it could have ever come to be. I do not believe in the OT narration. I continue to be stymied. I am constantly made aware of how picayune my brain is when contemplating this thing called God.

:chores-chopwood: :chores-chopwood: :chores-chopwood:
:evilfun:

I can sometimes be a likable person but not always. lol That would depend on the circumstances and what is called for. I can, at other times, be a fierce dragon.
verywell.com/what-is-the-halo-effect-279590 :evilfun:

You would appear to be a very “affirming” kind of person. The world needs that.
I like Joy too. I actually love Joy. That is the middle name of my daughter because I knew from the first moment I saw her that she would give me great joy ~~ but even when she doesn’t lol, she still does.

Nicknaming me Joy would be like calling God “love”. Is truth based on impressions and sensations?

But of course. There was a time when I was “Rising” but I decided to dive into the depths. It all just depends on my inclination.

Arcturus Descending

I can tell you that I know there is an efficient way to do it and an inefficient way. The efficient way involves a a type of bow from memory. I will bring matches, just in case.

Cool. Androids could be made to enjoy things and I vaguely remember an episode or two where Data did indeed experience enjoyment.

I read two more tough questions and one question that would depend on how you were to define a good philosopher.

The concept of GOD is not so clear to me the way that people explain him/her/hermaphrodite/it/etc. My belief in GOD is dependent on there still being many hints out there. Absolute proof . . . interesting notion.

OMG - four more tough questions - flowers are interesting - brings to mind Fibonacci Numbers.

=D>

Dont ask me, I am lost.

:laughing:

My youngest daughter’s middle name is Joy. Isabelle Joy. I will refrain from posting our surname in public however - I can say that it is over two thousand years old and British Celtic in origin.

Astronomy is sadly not my strong suit. I love the heavenly bodies and I probably have enough Physics behind me to get it.

Suffice to say her book: Measuring the Universe - made me feel rather inadequate given it is supposed to be for layman and I still found it tough going - in my defense I was approaching my mid twenties and leaving Aerospace behind for Software Engineering. I might get it better these days though. I know one can be surprised by what one remembers.

Diving into the depths of the mind and reality are my things these days.

:-k

:greetings-wavegreen:

James

I would be very interested in discussing the topic.

While we are discussing the topic I would like us to cover the concept of zero and infinity. I initially use zero and infinity as tools for contrast, to make “stuff” stand out among the background.

I have three questions for you James:

  1. What is zero?
  2. What is infinity?
  3. What is stuff?

:-k

:smiley:

…and welcome back. :sunglasses:

James S Saint

  1. So a placeholder for something?
  2. In reality or concept?
  3. Now we are talking.

:-k

:sunglasses:

:sunglasses:

What initiates the original change(affectance)? Surely it must have always been there.

Yes. Affectance has always existed and always must exist … everywhere. There can be no absolute void anywhere … ever. It is a mathematical impossibility.

James S Saint

I totally agree with you on this - the problem I face is both sides of the coin. How does one go about proving no absolute void? How does one go about proving such a void?

Would it not be important to understand how the both cancel each other out? That understanding would lend credence to such a scenario of something always being there.

:smiley:

@ James: An opinion at this point would even be welcome.

James

I will keep this short and imprecise. You should still be able to catch my gist. You could say it is compressed delta encoding.

[b]∴ Reality - Version 0.0 is impossible.

There can only be Reality - Version 0.000…0001 ∨ PtA.
[/b]
The number of zeros is arbitrary.

because Absolute Homogeneity is impossible as you have proven in your previous post.

:sunglasses: