In this thread I’ll explain why I think the current way many approach how the two human gender relate/compare to each other in society fails to adequately explain it, and I will propose my own explanation.
Let’s start with the obvious. All except the most insane of the feminists and MRAs will agree that male and female are 2 biologically different sexes, meant to fulfill distinct but complimentary roles. So, we can establish that the sexes are not equal - men are superior at some things, and women are superior at others. In my experience I’d say that MRAs are generally a bit more receptive to this information than feminists, but another time about that.
Despite recognizing the differences between males and females, many of these very same MRAs and feminists will also argue that men and women should be “equal under the law”. I will show why equality under the law fails.
Since men and women are different when you make them equal under the law, depending on with regards to what you made them equal about, you are benefiting either one side or the other. I’ve discussed this concept a lot on PhilosophyForums and I’d link to the specific thread, but unfortunately that site has been fucked for quite some time now so I’ll just explain it shortly here:
Let’s say there is a race between an ostrich and an eagle. If the law/rule of the race is: no flying, then the ostrich and the eagle may be equal under that law in the sense that they are both equally banned from flying, and yet the law clearly handicaps the eagle, and by handicapping the eagle it benefits the ostrich. Likewise, if the rule/law stated no running, that would benefit the eagle even if they were both equally banned from running.
This is, in short, why equality under the law fails. Because different entities have different advantages and disadvantages, if they are held to the same law, that same law will affect them differently - one will benefit, the other will be handicapped. So I don’t think what we need is equality, I think what we need is something more akin to BALANCE, or rather, BALANC-ING, since absolute balance would be impossible. Something close to what traditionalists advocate but more based on a scientific, evolutionary understanding of reality instead of just tradition.
So it is clear that in order to create a fair society (by natural standards) we must take into account what men evolved for and what women evolved to see what either side has to offer (what their advantages/disadvantages are) so we can predict how certain laws would affect the two sides differently, and to try to balance it out. Keep in mind though, that this is a matter of which sex is GENERALLY better suited for something, not that EVERY member of a sex must be superior in that aspect to every member of the opposite sex.
What men have to offer to women is protection (dealing with threats) and provision (extraction of resources from the environment), this includes both the physical aspect of doing it and the intellectual aspect of coming up with more refined ways of dealing with threats/extracting resources. Essentially, dealing with the external world, reality, nature is the most important thing men can offer to women, and what makes masculinity irreplaceable. The second thing is sperm, less important because it is abundant in relation to eggs.
What women have to offer to men is, primarily, access to reproduction - their pussy and, more importantly, womb. This is what makes females irreplaceable. The secondary thing females can offer is homemaking (dealing with the internal world, a man’s home), this is less important because men can do it themselves.
So far it seems balance is had. I am reminded of the movie blue lagoon, which to some extent has this scenario of balance and harmony between male and female, displaying male/female interactions in their purest, most natural form, without any external interventions.
What disrupts the balance between males and females is when the state, a masculine force, intervenes and begins determining the behavior of its subordinates. This can result in balance which favors males, or balance which favors females, by replacing certain things that individual males and/or females have to offer, which reduces the value of these males/females since they can obtain what the other has to offer from the state directly. The law of the market dictates that if something is scarce and/or difficult to obtain it is valuable, while if it is abundant and/or easy to obtain, it loses value.
Although in principle it could go either way, in practice, since the state is a masculine entity, it by necessity replaces more of what males have to offer than what females have to offer. It makes what males have to offer (protection, provision) easy to obtain, and thus less valuable. Depending on circumstances, it also replaces what females have to offer, varying from high replacement (the most oppressive patriarchy you can imagine) to low replacement (the most feminist society you can imagine).
I’ll shorten state replacement to SR, and M will stand for males, while F for females. (-) will mean state replacement is not present, aka, male/female retain their value, + indicates state replacement is present, which makes individual males/females less valuable.
The following combinations thus exist, 2 of them are balanced and about different types of equality (just to show feminists what REAL equality would mean. Neither equality 1 nor 2 or any of their more moderate forms have ever existed, since a state of equality is impossible and societies have always and will always lean a little bit more to either gyno or andro centrism. The other 2 are about the actual kinds of societies which have and will exist, the only kinds of societies possible. What follows are 4 extremes on a spectrum similar to the famous political compass 4 side spectrum, of course there are also positions inbetween, in fact, the only reason I’m showing the extremes is so you can understand all that is inbetween by implication.
- SRM+ SRF+ (state replaces both men and women completely) EQUALITY TYPE 1
The state replaces both what men have to offer to women, and what women have to offer to men. Men don’t have the control who to protect and provide for, while women don’t have the control over to whom they grant access to their womb/vagina, basically everybody protects and provides for everybody and everybody fucks everybody and this is enforced by… everybody. A sort of communism mixed with hippie sexuality in its most extreme form, a truly non-discriminate and tolerant society and yet something feminists would never advocate for.
- SRM+ and SRF- (state replaces men completely women not at all) GYNOCENTRISM, FEMALES GENERALLY BENEFIT
The state replaces what men have to offer to women, aka, it forces men to protect women and provide for them while not replacing what women have to offer, instead women are given complete freedom to use the benefits of their own sexuality which is physically ensured by other men (police/military). This raises the value of females in relation to men. The extreme of this part of spectrum is feminist utopia, more moderate is gynocentric traditionalism. Due to the above mentioned fact that the state itself is a masculine entity, on the more moderate side of this part of the spectrum one can find the average, the most common type of society throughout history and especially in modernity, with regards to gender relations - some form of gynocentric traditionalism.
- SRM- and SRF+ (state replaces females but not males) ANDROCENTRISM - MALES GENERALLY BENEFIT
In this case men can choose who to protect and provide for (so no police/military protecting women and threatening men and no general transfer of resources from men to women through taxation), so they are given the advantages of their sexuality, while women are not given the advantages of theirs and the access to their womb/pussy is controlled by men, so women don’t have anything left to offer and the value of men is higher than the value of women. THIS is actual male oppression of women, not the nonsense feminists talk about. Perhaps a few ancient, patriarchal (androcentric) traditionalist societies which were warrior cultures existed on this part of the spectrum, albeit in a more moderate form. Also possible during short transitory stages of anarchy, where there is nobody to keep males in check and they can naturally dominate females. The prevalent type of society when many men die in wars and thus women become abundant in relation to men.
- SRM- SRF- (state replaces neither females nor males) EQUALITY TYPE 2
In this type of equality men have the complete freedom to choose whom to protect and provide for (no state forcing police and military to protect all women and no state taxing men and transferring resources from men to women under threats of violence), and women have complete freedom to choose whom to grant access to their womb/vagina to (no state controlling female sexuality under threats of violence).
Neither equality 1 nor 2 or any of their more moderate forms have ever existed, since a state of equality is impossible and societies have always and will always lean a little bit more to either gyno or andro centrism. I included the equalities just to show how absurd and impossible they are, and that it’s not what any feminist would ever want.